# Factoids..if any of these are true..it's mind boggling
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/factoids-if-any-of-these-are-true-its-mind-boggling/233040
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [March 8, 2004, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/factoids-if-any-of-these-are-true-its-mind-boggling/233040 "2004-03-08T00:27:43Z")
**Posts on this page:** 9
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)
#### Post date: [March 8, 2004, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/factoids-if-any-of-these-are-true-its-mind-boggling/233040/1 "2004-03-08T00:27:43Z")
[http://www.kahealani.com/ucc/factoids.html](http://www.kahealani.com/ucc/factoids.html)
Can anyone debunk or prove these are right?
the first 5…
> [@](#):
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> # The IRS is not a U.S. Government Agency. It is an Agency of the IMF. (Diversified Metal Products v. IRS et al. CV-93-405E-EJE U.S.D.C.D.I., Public Law 94-564, Senate Report 94-1148 pg. 5967, Reorganization Plan No. 26, Public Law 102-391.)
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> # The IMF is an Agency of the UN. (Blacks Law Dictionary 6th Ed. Pg. 816)
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> # The U.S. Has not had a Treasury since 1921. (41 Stat. Ch.214 pg. 654)
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> # The U.S. Treasury is now the IMF. (Presidential Documents Volume 29-No.4 pg.113, 22 U.S.C. 285-288)
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> # The United States does not have any employees because there is no longer a United States. No more reorganizations. After over 200 years of operating under bankruptcy its finally over. (Executive Order 12803) Do not personate one of the creditors or share holders or you will go to Prison.18 U.S.C. 914
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> # The FCC, CIA, FBI, NASA and all of the other alphabet gangs were never part of the United States government. Even though the “US Government” held shares of stock in the various Agencies. (U.S. V. Strang , 254 US 491, Lewis v. US, 680 F.2d, 1239)
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### Author:  [@kellner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kellner)
#### Post date: [March 8, 2004, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/factoids-if-any-of-these-are-true-its-mind-boggling/233040/2 "2004-03-08T00:51:41Z")
> [@](#):
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> # The IMF is an Agency of the UN. (Blacks Law Dictionary 6th Ed. Pg. 816)
Almost, but technically it isn’t. It was founded independently, membership is independent but it cooperates closely with the UN.
See this chart of the UN structure:
[http://www.un.org/aboutun/chart.html](http://www.un.org/aboutun/chart.html)
(note the \* on _specialized agencies_)
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### Author:  [@WernhamHogg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WernhamHogg)
#### Post date: [March 8, 2004, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/factoids-if-any-of-these-are-true-its-mind-boggling/233040/3 "2004-03-08T00:59:10Z")
The last numbered item in the list linked to is “guess who owns the UN?” my instinct was that the answer to this suggestive question was, either “the Jews,” or some other crackpot conspiracy nutcase blather. Backing up to the host site confirms the latter (not anti-Semetic, just crazy).
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### Author:  [@Atticus\_Finch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atticus_Finch)
#### Post date: [March 8, 2004, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/factoids-if-any-of-these-are-true-its-mind-boggling/233040/4 "2004-03-08T01:02:54Z")
The owner of the site you got this info from:
> [@](#):
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> Angela Kaleahani: Clairvoyant Psychic Reader, Healer and Counselor, consults at 1(808)635-6688; Teaches Meditation, Clairvoyance, and Kundalini; and presents educational articles…
This seems like pretty standard tin-foil hat stuff. Couldn’t be bothered refuting every bizarre statement…
> [@](#):
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> …there is no longer a United States.
Ah well, it was fun while it lasted. Excuse me, must go update my atlas.
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### Author:  [@Atticus\_Finch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atticus_Finch)
#### Post date: [March 8, 2004, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/factoids-if-any-of-these-are-true-its-mind-boggling/233040/5 "2004-03-08T01:06:53Z")
There is one scary thing on the page - the little “pi” link near the owner’s name. Someone is attempting to follow a Sandra Bullock movie! Chilling stuff…
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### Author:  [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)
#### Post date: [March 8, 2004, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/factoids-if-any-of-these-are-true-its-mind-boggling/233040/6 "2004-03-08T01:11:17Z")
Reeder, you aren’t really THIS gullible, are you? C’mon, man, not everything you get in an E-mail is true.
The list of “facts” you cite are all over the Web, all repeated verbatim. They are roughly as accurate as those E-mails that tell you a duck’s quack doesn’t echo. On the other hand, their alleged references are somewhat hard to track down. You posted 5, not 6…
1. The IRS is part of the Department of the Treasury. It’s not connected to the IMF. The IRS Restructuring Act was Public Law 105-206. Public Law 102-391 has nothing to do with the IRS, so I assume the author just picked the numbers at random.
2. Kellner has addressed this, although I don’t know why that would be a bad thing.
3. So the United States Department of the Treasury is what? A figment of everyone’s imagination? If there’s no Treasury, why does the law say there is?
> **[31 U.S.C. § 302 - U.S. Code Title 31. Money and Finance § 302 | FindLaw](https://codes.findlaw.com/us/title-31-money-and-finance/31-usc-sect-302.html)**
>
> U.S. Title 31. Money and Finance 31 USCA Section 302. Read the code on FindLaw
1. That’s stupid. The United States is a MEMBER of the IMF. USC 285 and 288 authorize the President to have the United States become a member nation of the IMF. That does not make the IMF a part of the United States government; the USA, as well as all other countries, is a member of many such organizations. You don’t think NATO is now the Department of Labor, do you?
2. Reeder, you’re smart enough to know a crackpot, tinfoil-hat post when you see it.
3. Yeah, right. US v Strang has absolutely nothing to do with this claim. It’s rather easy to find the U.S. law that created those organizations - here’s the law that created NASA:
[http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/ts\_search.pl?title=42&sec=2472](http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/ts_search.pl?title=42&sec=2472)
I dunno about Lewis v US, but I’m betting more of the same.
Some of these are so retarded I’m not even sure how they can be “Debunked.” How do you prove there is “no United States” to someone convinced they somehow disappeared?
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### Author:  [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)
#### Post date: [March 8, 2004, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/factoids-if-any-of-these-are-true-its-mind-boggling/233040/7 "2004-03-08T01:20:04Z")
I never said I believed it. But I figured our learned group here would have the knowledge right there in their heads to debunk them.
And I was right…thanks!
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### Author:  [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)
#### Post date: [March 8, 2004, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/factoids-if-any-of-these-are-true-its-mind-boggling/233040/8 "2004-03-08T12:24:18Z")
> [@Reeder](#):
>
> I never said I believed it. But I figured our learned group here would have the knowledge right there in their heads to debunk them.
>
> And I was right…thanks!
Like a lot of other conspiracy theories, these seem to prove more than is actually convenient. I.e., if there weren’t (in some existential or fundamental legal sense) an extant Treasury, but the gang in power had been able universally to convince essentially everyone but Madame Kaleahani that there _were_ one for the past century, what are the odds of her (or you) doing anything effectively to change that situation? The gang must be pretty powerful to sustain so many lies for so long. But after all, they’re shape-shifting lizards anyhow([subversiveelement.com - This website is for sale! - subversiveelement Resources and Information.](http://www.subversiveelement.com/AliensReptoidsIckeShifters.html)), which I guess can give you a pretty powerful edge in politics . . . .
Even on less overtly nutty topics (e.g., whether Ohio properly ratified the 16th Amendment), if you had a technically-not-implausible contrary theory, you’d run up against an unspoken, somewhat-cynical, but probably-necessary legal principle: what’s the point in asking, because there’s no way that any court or legislature established, protected, and funded by the U.S. government is going to jump up and determine that, why, yes, the entire structure of federal government is illegitimate, flawed, and needs to be dismantled immediately (who would enforce such an injunction, anyhow, I wonder?).
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### Author:  [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)
#### Post date: [March 8, 2004, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/factoids-if-any-of-these-are-true-its-mind-boggling/233040/9 "2004-03-08T12:38:20Z")
The thing that struck me about “factoid” #5 is its citing of “Executive Order 12803,” strongly implying that this Executive Order did… what? Dismantle the United States as a real and actual nation? What sort of insanity would the President have to be infected with to dismantle the country HE’S running? Is it even possible to do in this way, bypassing all other branches of government entirely?
Wow. Just… wow.