# Facts on the Mediterranean refugee crisis
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [June 1, 2016, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217 "2016-06-01T09:28:49Z")
**Posts on this page:** 10
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)
#### Post date: [June 1, 2016, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217/1 "2016-06-01T09:28:49Z")
Two questions on the refugee crisis in the Mediterranean on two claims I’ve recently heard about it apropos of the recently [disaster](http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/may/29/700-migrants-feared-dead-mediterranean-says-un-refugees) which claimed around 700 lives, I’m having a real tough time finding a straight answer, hope you guys can help. Just asking for a confirmation or denial on the veracity of the claims, not asking about the rights or wrongs.
First claim is that if a refugee is rescued by a ship which is registered in an EU state in the Mediterranean from a stricken craft, they _have_ to be accepted as an asylum seeker and resettled in Europe (namely Italy, due to the proximity).
Second claim is that the passengers/crew of these craft from Africa know that and are…engineering situations, or allowing situations to occur, where being rescued from the sea is more likely to happen so that they can resettle in Europe.
Is there any evidence for either claim?
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### Author:  [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)
#### Post date: [June 1, 2016, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217/2 "2016-06-01T10:44:47Z")
I don’t know of evidence but:
If anyone turns up, however they get there, in an EU country (maybe in any signatory to the UN conventions) they have to be dealt with legally - you can’t shoot them or chuck them back in the sea. So, once they get on a ship or scramble over the beach they will be treated humanely. After that there is a legal process to determine their status - genuine refugees are given asylum while economic refugees are supposed to be sent back. The problem then is to determine which is which and then where they came from.
As I understand it, the rescue operation is abused by the people smugglers. “Sure, this boat is old and it leaks. Don’t worry about it (shows video of rescue). As soon as we clear the territorial waters, we will send up flares and they will rescue us.” In some cases the smugglers push off before the rescue to avoid capture.
I am guessing, but there must by now, be a shortage of small boats on the N African coast.
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### Author:  [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)
#### Post date: [June 1, 2016, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217/3 "2016-06-01T11:37:09Z")
From what I see on the German news the vessels, from their size, condition and overloading, are in maritime distress pretty much from casting off, and have little chance to reach Lampedusa or other European shores on their own. It’s not good business paying for a seaworthy vessel that’s going to be confiscated at the destination. The people who organize the trip, _if_ they are that considerate to their customers, phone MRCC Rome shortly after they estimate the boat to be far enough off the coast (according to one newspaper article I read).
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### Author:  [@Donnerwetter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Donnerwetter)
#### Post date: [June 1, 2016, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217/4 "2016-06-01T11:41:29Z")
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#):
>
> First claim is that if a refugee is rescued by a ship which is registered in an EU state in the Mediterranean from a stricken craft, they _have_ to be accepted as an asylum seeker and resettled in Europe (namely Italy, due to the proximity).
No, but once they reach European soil, they have the right to **apply** for asylum which means they have a foot in the door. Relatively few asylum applications are ultimately successful. This doesn’t really matter though because there are many ways to game the system and to finally be allowed to stay for good. In the past, Italy was eager to send the new arrivals due North as _subito_ as possible, but as of recently, the [Austrians have gotten somewhat uncooperative](http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36302422).
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#):
>
> Second claim is that the passengers/crew of these craft from Africa know that and are…engineering situations, or allowing situations to occur, where being rescued from the sea is more likely to happen so that they can resettle in Europe.
This is exactly how it works, but it’s the human traffickers who take this gamble. Although they are usually not the ones who end up dead in the water.
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### Author:  [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)
#### Post date: [June 1, 2016, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217/5 "2016-06-01T11:41:56Z")
There’s no legal obligation to accept anyone who is rescued from danger as a refugee in the terms of the Geneva Convention. The problem is in part the moral one of what to do when people arrive in such distressing circumstances (but may or may not be refugees from conflict and persecution), and what sort of reception might actually encourage or discourage the demand that people-smugglers are feeding on; and in part it’s the logistics of fulfilling the obligation to come to a decision in so many cases, and whether it’s morally reasonable to expect those countries who just happen to have the coastline most likely to be landed on to take all the accepted refugees (as the Geneva Convention would imply). Apart from Germany, the bulk of EU countries are trying to play pass-the-parcel or flatly refusing to help, apart from their contribution to funding some sort of refugee support in Turkey. Apart from Lebanon and Jordan, other Arab countries seem to have been conspicuous by their apparent lack of attraction to refugees or willingness to volunteer to welcome them, but whether that’s a reflection on our news media or on them, I don’t know.
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### Author:  [@Donnerwetter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Donnerwetter)
#### Post date: [June 1, 2016, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217/6 "2016-06-01T12:05:01Z")
The undocumented immigrants who take the route over the Mediterranean to Italy, by the way, are for the most part from Sub-Saharan Africa (although there actually are some Syrians and even Afghanis who make their way to Egypt and Libya. I wonder how they do that.
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### Author:  [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)
#### Post date: [June 1, 2016, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217/7 "2016-06-01T12:14:15Z")
> [@PatrickLondon](#):
>
> Apart from Lebanon and Jordan, other Arab countries seem to have been conspicuous by their apparent lack of attraction to refugees or willingness to volunteer to welcome them.
:rolleyes:
Pure horse manure.
[Syrian Refugees](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War) by numbers
Except for Germany (which opened its doors) and for Greece (which is like, right next door) most refugees have been in Arab lands. And tell me, why is it surprising that people perfer to go to Greece (1200 KM from[Damascus to Athens](http://www.mapcrow.info/Distance_between_Athens_GR_and_Damascus_SY.html) as opposed to say UAE (2100 KM from [Dubai to Damascus](http://www.prokerala.com/travel/distance/from-damascus-syria/to-dubai/)) or Iraq (yeah really?)
Most European countries have not taken enough to fill a stand of a decent size football stadium.
[QUOTE=wiki]
Turkey 2,748,367 (registered, 3 March 2016)[3]
Lebanon 1,500,000 (estimated arrivals Dec 2015)
1,048,275 (registered)[4]
Jordan 1,265,000 (census results Nov 2015)[5]
642,868 (registered)[6]
Germany 484,000 (estimated arrivals Dec 2015) [7]
306,703 (applicants Dec 2015) [8]
Greece 496,119 (arrivals to May 2016)[9] 54,574 (estimated in country May 2016)[9]
5,615 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Saudi Arabia 420,000 (estimated overstays 2015)[10]
Macedonia 400,000 (estimated arrivals)[9]
2,150 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Serbia(incl. Kosovo) 313,314 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Iraq (incl. Iraqi Kurdistan) 239,000 (estimated in Iraqi Kurdistan)
6,000 (estimated rest of Iraq March 2015)
246,589 (registered)[11]
United Arab Emirates 242,000 (estimated overstays, government source, 2015) [12][13]
Kuwait 155,000+[10][14] (estimated overstays to June 2015)
Egypt 119,665 (registered)[15]
Sweden 107,966 (applicants to Dec 2015) [8]
Hungary
72,505 (applicants to Dec 2015) [8]
Croatia 55,000 (estimated September 2015)[16]
386 (applicants to Dec 2015) [8]
Canada 47,270 (applicants to May 2016)
30,003 (approved)
27,190 (resettled)[17]
Algeria 43,000 (estimated Nov 2015)
5,721 (registered Nov 2015) [18]
Qatar 40,000 (estimated overstays 2015)[10]
42 (registered 2015)[10]
Austria 38,385 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Netherlands 30,698 (applicants to Dec 2015) [8]
Libya 26,672 (registered December 2015)[1]
Denmark 19,433 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Bulgaria 17,527 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Armenia 17,000 (estimated July 2015)[19]
Belgium 15,744 (applicants to Dec 2015) [8]
Singapore
13,856 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Switzerland 12,822 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Norway 13,993 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
France 11,402 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Brazil 9,000 (approved ) [20]
2,097 (Nov 2015)[21]See: Syrians in Brazil
United Kingdom 9,292 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
5,102 (resettled 2015) [22]
Spain 8,365 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Russia 5,000 (estimated 2015)[23]
Malaysia 5,000 (estimated August 2015)[citation needed]
Australia 4,500 (2015)See: Syrians in Australia
United States 4,035 (resettled) [24]
Tunisia 4,000 (September 2015)[25]
Bahrain 3,500 (estimated June 2015)[10]
Cyprus 3,464 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Montenegro 2,975 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Italy 2,538 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Romania 2,525 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Malta 1,222 (applicants to Dec 2015) [8]
Finland 1,127 (applicants to Dec 2015)[8]
Gaza Strip 1,000 (December 2013)[26]
[/QUOTE]
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### Author:  [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)
#### Post date: [June 1, 2016, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217/8 "2016-06-01T12:35:51Z")
No, they do not have to be granted asylum and resettled.
They do, however, have the right to apply for asylum and have their case heard. This doesn’t necessarily have to be in Europe, but you can’t just pack asylum-seekers off to some random country that doesn’t want them, and this far nobody is lining up to take people already in Europe. Likewise, within Europe it doesn’t have to be Italy, but Europe has been struggling to come up with a more equitable way to manage this.
Right now the boats are largely designed to be scuttled. There was a time when seaworthy vessels steered by professional captains were used, but that came with more risk to the smugglers and increased the chances of the boats being forced to turn back. Now people are just packed into whatever, handed a sat phone and flares, and told to call for help when they reach territorial waters.
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### Author:  [@Donnerwetter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Donnerwetter)
#### Post date: [June 1, 2016, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217/9 "2016-06-01T12:48:54Z")
Germany is the land of milk and honey. Germany or bust. Nobody wants to live in places like Romania or Bulgaria. Even the Czech Republic (where the standard of living is up to par Germany or Austria) isn’t good enough. This is a typical news story:
> [@](#):
>
> Czechs halt Iraqi refugee scheme after group leaves for Germany
>
> Czechs angry after Iraqi Christians reject asylum and rent a bus to leave the country
>
> A bold project to bring Iraqi Christian refugees to a sceptical central Europe has been terminated, after almost one-third of the new arrivals rejected life in the Czech Republic and rented a bus to take them to Germany.
>
> The 25 Iraqis formally refused asylum in the Czech Republic last Friday, retrieved their passports from the country’s interior ministry in Prague and hit the road for Germany, where they are now awaiting a decision on their fate.
>
> Czech officials called a halt to the scheme on Thursday, and said the incident showed how proposals for every EU state to take a quota of refugees were doomed, because almost all of them want to live in Germany or other wealthy countries.
> **[Czechs halt Iraqi refugee scheme after group leaves for Germany](https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/czechs-halt-iraqi-refugee-scheme-after-group-leaves-for-germany-1.2602066)**
>
> Czechs angry after Iraqi Christians reject asylum and rent a bus to leave the country
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### Author:  [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)
#### Post date: [June 2, 2016, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/facts-on-the-mediterranean-refugee-crisis/756217/10 "2016-06-02T02:24:49Z")
From your list - other than neighbouring countries - Jordan, Lebanon, Turkey, and “Kurdistan” - the middle eastern countries are not well represented. “Overstayed” is a euphuism for what? They were guest workers but did not feel it was safe to go home? OTOH, if you had to spend your life savings to go somewhere else, Algeria or Egypt probably would not top the list anyway. (And note to get there, you still have to find transport, since Israel or the Mediterranean blocks overland transport.)
OTOH, the Arab countries have been burned before by Palestinian refugees. They were supposed to be temporary - but then became permanent guests with no departure in sight. They either integrate, taking jobs from locals and creating friction, or they ive in separated camps which turn into dangerous ghettos. Jordan and Lebanon have both had bad experiences with refugee camps, yet still have to handle the bulk of the flood.