I object to moving the goalposts. Upthread it was starvation, and since that doesn’t happen, it’s suddenly malnutrition.
So you’ve never actually worked hard in your life, right?
Like I said, you don’t care about malnutrition.
And I never once mentioned starvation.
No, this. ^
Yes, you did. Post #86.
You can’t even keep your stories straight. :smack:
Again, what is a living wage? Suppose I have two employees, one is 24 years old, single, lives in a room that he rents from a nice old lady, walks to work, and is happy to survive on beer, ramen noodles, and the occasional dime bag of weed he smokes on weekends.
The second employee is 38 years old, has four children by four different women, owes back child support, got a degree in history that he still owes $50k in student loan payments, has a car payment, and a mortgage payment on a $250k home.
These two individuals have vastly different concepts on what the amount of money they must receive to pay their bills or to simply survive. The point is that these individual concerns are NOT the concern of my business. I didn’t tell the guy to have four kids or to get a worthless degree. It is also not my good fortune that the other employee doesn’t need a car.
These individual concerns bear no relation to the contract of employment I offer, nor to they appreciate MY side of this contract. The only just measure of what I should pay an employee is what his skills would demand on the open market and what value he brings to the business. Anything above that is simple charity.
If the 24 year old has skills which command $100k per year, and the competitor down the road will pay him $100k per year, then I had better pony up or else lose his skills to that competitor. The argument that he doesn’t own a car, a house, or have children to support, so he doesn’t need $100k per year has absolutely, and it should be repeated, absolutely no bearing at all on our employment contract. He is free, as he should be, to earn that money and spend it on whatever he likes.
Likewise, the 38 year old has skills which only command $9/hr. But he needs more than that to live! This fact, again, has no bearing on an employment contract anymore than the example of buying food at a grocer that I posted earlier.
By employing someone, a business does not assume responsibility, as a guardian, for that individual. His lack of skill and need for a subsidy above and beyond what he is able to earn on the free market, is not something I created. His lack of skill remains after, and existed before he worked for me. Placing the burden for his care upon a business owner who may not even be making minimum wage himself is a ludicrous way of allocating social costs.
I do not believe people should starve in the streets. I think that society has deemed that we should provide help for indigent people. But I likewise think that society itself should bear the burden, not the business owner who is already contributing to relieve that person’s poverty.
I was not claiming that starvation exists or not in the US. I was asking if you were willing to let people starve.
See?
No one said people should starve. This is like the 4th time you’re attempting to misrepresent my position.
Maybe something like determining the minimum needed for the area. Such as lowest commonly available housing+amount awarded for food stamps (plus something to account for non-food items like soap and TP) + phone+ basic utilities.
Granted, that would be very complex to actually determine the appropriate formula and will vary wildly between areas.
You said corporations and government own no one a living wage. So if someone is low skill, maybe low intelligence and can’t make enough to live on, what do you propose?
Seriously? Where did you get the idea that the government owes you these things?
How about the Supreme Court?
West Coast Hotel Co. v. Parrish
Let me explain something to you. When the Supreme Court says something is constitutional, that means it is supported by the binding bits of the Constitution. The federal government can compel business to pay what ever minimum wage they want. They don’t need any other reason, so if they want to say it is for the general welfare, they don’t have to cite chapter and verse of the Constitution; they have the authority already.
You can’t explain anything.
Isn’t this board moderated? Why do people keep posting things that are factually untrue? 
The feds may levy taxes to support the general welfare, not pass laws to support the general welfare. The minimum wage law survives under the commerce clause.
Yes, the courts have held that a federal minimum wage law is constitutional. But is it a wise and just public policy? And, even more, where should the wage be set? At sustenance levels or that “living wage.”
What about a doctor’s wife who wants to work to supplement the family’s income or simply because she wants something to do during the day. Why should her wage be based upon some calculation of minimal needs in the community?
Why is a phone considered something necessary for survival? A basic phone or a smart phone? Land line or cell phone? What other basic utilities? Cable television? High speed internet? IOW, what is considered “basic” and who decides these things?
I mean a basic bottom line for those who are unable to make more, not supplement high earners.
You really think having a phone is a luxury? How about possible employers getting hold of a job applicant.Calling for medical aid or doing business in general?
And since many employers only take applications over the internet, maybe that should be part. There’s a company locally that offers dial-up ( last I looked) for 99/year.
i wasn’t trying to offer a complete plan but a suggestion for determining a living wage.
A living wage is whatever you can earn by actually working.
No, it’s not.
How about someone who disabled and unable to work?
Maybe someone of low IQ who can only handle simple janitorial duties or do piecework?
According to whom? You?
The VA and SSA both have criteria to determine disability.
My mom was a stay at home as was typical of the 1950-1970s. At the age of 29, she contracted polio and was paralyzed from the waist down.
No college, no job skills and unable to drive.
Divorced by dad when I was 12.
Younger brother, cerebral palsy and mentally handicapped. Requires a live-in aide.
Are you going to tell them to go to hell?