# Fallout from Rick Perry's "Debate Performance" **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 24, 2011, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407 "2011-09-24T01:04:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/62 "2011-09-29T12:01:54Z")
> [@AbloyProtec](#): > > The Federal Sales Tax proposed under the 9-9-9 plan would be added to applicable state and local taxes. That’s so poor people will have some “skin in the game”, right? ---
**Author:** ![AbloyProtec](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9f8e36/32.png) [@AbloyProtec](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AbloyProtec)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/63 "2011-09-29T12:34:54Z")
> [@CaptMurdock](#): > > So, if your tax rate is at or near 9% already, you aren’t going to see very much reduction, if at all. It is my understanding that the lowest rate possible for those who actually pay income tax is 10% ($8,500 and lower annual income). 15% is between $8,501 and $34,000. 25% is between $34,501 and $83,600. Then you also eliminate payroll taxes. I’ll put together a scenario later this evening when I have time. The difference isn’t as significant to lower incomes as you think, but I’ll yield any of those arguments until I can put forth the math to back it up. > [@](#): > > so the corporations who are already making RECORD profits and NOT hiring new workers get to keep more of their money and the deficit still doesn’t get paid down. Show me one company that has posted a record profit and currently has no job openings. One. > [@](#): > > And again, the bottom 80% are going to get squeezed because they are going to have to pay more for stuff, while their income tax rates probably aren’t going to be reduced by much if at all. No, we’ve “adequately assessed” this plan, and it stinks. Anytime you utilize a tax rate that is the same no matter what you make, you’re obviously going to have a bigger impact on some than others, primarily lower incomes. The interesting point here is to find out HOW MUCH a person in a lower income bracket would have to spend before the 9-9-9 plan would cause him or her to pay more than the current system. That’s what I’m going to detail later tonight when I have time. ---
**Author:** ![AbloyProtec](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9f8e36/32.png) [@AbloyProtec](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AbloyProtec)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/64 "2011-09-29T12:36:11Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > That’s so poor people will have some “skin in the game”, right? That’s so everyone puts forth an effort to get America back on it’s feet. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/65 "2011-09-29T12:58:10Z")
> [@AbloyProtec](#): > > That’s so everyone puts forth an effort to get America back on it’s feet. Because the wealthy pay too much tax, and the poor pay too little? ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/66 "2011-09-29T13:28:51Z")
The 9% income tax on the poorest 50% will hardly make up for the regression of the 9% sales tax, since (at least according to GOP dogma) the poorest 50% of Americans already pay only 0% in income tax. Don’t know (or particularly care) about Cain plan details, but with lower income taxes and **no payroll taxes** , revenue will presumably drop significantly. (I guess that doesn’t matter much, since we’ll be shutting down the Department of Education, Department of Waste, etc.) > [@AbloyProtec](#): > > > [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > > > That’s so poor people will have some “skin in the game”, right? > > That’s so everyone puts forth an effort to get America back on it’s feet. I guess the thinking is that indolent Welfare Mamas now begging for better schools will “see the light” if they “have skin in the game,” i.e. see the price of toothpaste rise from $1.99 to $2.18. I think I summed all the GOP ideas up pretty well when I wrote “these Republicans must come from a parallel universe.” ---
**Author:** ![AbloyProtec](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9f8e36/32.png) [@AbloyProtec](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AbloyProtec)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/67 "2011-09-29T13:43:25Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > The 9% income tax on the poorest 50% will hardly make up for the regression of the 9% sales tax, since (at least according to GOP dogma) the poorest 50% of Americans already pay only 0% in income tax. Cite? > [@](#): > > Don’t know (or particularly care) about Cain plan details, Yet here you are. > [@](#): > > but with lower income taxes and **no payroll taxes** , revenue will presumably drop significantly. (I guess that doesn’t matter much, since we’ll be shutting down the Department of Education, Department of Waste, etc.) Uh oh, did a light bulb just go off? Cain also proposes cutting government spending. The 9-9-9 plan will generate around $300 billion less for the Federal budget. > [@](#): > > I guess the thinking is that indolent Welfare Mamas now begging for better schools will “see the light” if they “have skin in the game,” i.e. see the price of toothpaste rise from $1.99 to $2.18. It’s more so to spur economic growth and new employment, but, spin it how you want. > [@](#): > > I think I summed all the GOP ideas up pretty well when I wrote “these Republicans must come from a parallel universe.” Well, since it’s safe to assume you’ll not be voting Republican we can agree to disagree and see who is standing November 7, 2012 (hopefully). ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/68 "2011-09-29T14:08:07Z")
> [@AbloyProtec](#): > > Cain also proposes cutting government spending. The 9-9-9 plan will generate around $300 billion less for the Federal budget. > > It’s more so to spur economic growth and new employment, but, spin it how you want. Today’s taxes are already at the lowest level in generations; hence \*\* > [@septimus](#): > > “these Republicans must come from a parallel universe.” \*\* Thirteen months and change until the Day of Doom. > [@AbloyProtec](#): > > … we can agree to disagree and see who is standing November 7, 2012 (hopefully). I fear you may win your hope: [Quote=H. L. Mencken] Nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public. [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![AbloyProtec](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9f8e36/32.png) [@AbloyProtec](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AbloyProtec)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/69 "2011-09-29T15:19:54Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Today’s taxes are already at the lowest level in generations That’s no excuse for why they shouldn’t be lowered even more. That’s like saying, “Gas mileage has never been better” when someone details the plans of Ford wanting to increase the average MPG for sedans. ---
**Author:** ![saoirse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@saoirse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saoirse)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/70 "2011-09-29T15:21:18Z")
> [@Typo\_Knig](#): > > Somebody has to get the Republican nomination. If the economy is much worse than it is now - or not a lot better - then an inanimate carbon rod could beat Obama. I think that’s why Dave Weigel recommended that they nominate [Texas State Representative Tan Parker](http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2011/08/catching_pataki_fever.single.html): > [@](#): > > Pitted against a “generic Republican,” Obama would lose the 2012 election. Parker is the first person who comes up on Google when you search for “Republican state representative” and skip past the ones who are only famous for sex scandals. ---
**Author:** ![Capitaine\_Zombie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@Capitaine\_Zombie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capitaine_Zombie)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/71 "2011-09-29T15:23:28Z")
> [@AbloyProtec](#): > > That’s no excuse for why they shouldn’t be lowered even more. That’s like saying, “Gas mileage has never been better” when someone details the plans of Ford wanting to increase the average MPG for sedans. Damn smart to lower already record-breaking low taxes when you’re waist high in deficit. Wonder how balanced were the US under the last Republican President with this kind of nonsense. ---
**Author:** ![AbloyProtec](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9f8e36/32.png) [@AbloyProtec](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AbloyProtec)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/72 "2011-09-29T15:27:13Z")
> [@Capitaine\_Zombie](#): > > Damn smart to lower already record-breaking low taxes when you’re waist high in deficit. So logic would dictate that you cut from the budget as well or is that too good of an idea? ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/73 "2011-09-29T15:56:39Z")
> [@AbloyProtec](#): > > So logic would dictate that you cut from the budget as well or is that too good of an idea? You can not cut your way out of the deficits. The math does not work. Besides austerity programs are an economic death spiral. Once you institute them , you exacerbate all that is hurting the economy and do nothing about what could help it. These programs stifle demand. the engine of the economy. Cutting jobs , services and programs will put less money in the pockets of consumers. It will harm the lower classes while not touching the wealthy. The program is mere sophistry. It sounds logical if you don’t think about it. It is not only wrong, but dangerous. ---
**Author:** ![AbloyProtec](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9f8e36/32.png) [@AbloyProtec](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AbloyProtec)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/74 "2011-09-29T16:05:56Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > You can not cut your way out of the deficits. The math does not work. > > Besides austerity programs are an economic death spiral. Once you institute them , you exacerbate all that is hurting the economy and do nothing about what could help it. > > These programs stifle demand. the engine of the economy. Cutting jobs , services and programs will put less money in the pockets of consumers. It will harm the lower classes while not touching the wealthy. The program is mere sophistry. It sounds logical if you don’t think about it. It is not only wrong, but dangerous. So you’re going to omit any part of the 9-9-9 plan and simply equate one portion of his solutions to why none of this will work? Cool, I finally get to do this: Nice strawman, or is it cherry picking? ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/75 "2011-09-29T16:16:05Z")
> [@AbloyProtec](#): > > So you’re going to omit any part of the 9-9-9 plan and simply equate one portion of his solutions to why none of this will work? > > Cool, I finally get to do this: > > Nice strawman, or is it cherry picking? There’s a Hermann Cain thread a couple down. How about this gets talked about there? Keep this thread for the joke from Texas. The deluded guy who thinks a party steeped in racism will vote for a black guy is [right here.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=623842) In that thread you can explain how 9-9-9 is nothing but piss-poor marketing. Almost up there with “no longer than three pages” followed by ‘obviously when I said three I didn’t really mean three’. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![AbloyProtec](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9f8e36/32.png) [@AbloyProtec](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AbloyProtec)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/76 "2011-09-29T16:17:20Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > In that thread you can explain how 9-9-9 is nothing but piss-poor marketing. Almost up there with “no longer than three pages” followed by ‘obviously when I said three I didn’t really mean three’. > > -Joe Oh you! ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/77 "2011-09-29T16:21:37Z")
> [@AbloyProtec](#): > > Oh you! Yes, how dare one use a candidates own words against him. That’s like unfair and stuff. Perry, the guy this thread is about, seems to have similar problems. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![AbloyProtec](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9f8e36/32.png) [@AbloyProtec](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AbloyProtec)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2011, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/78 "2011-09-29T16:23:54Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > Yes, how dare one use a candidates own words against him. That’s like unfair and stuff. That reminds me, my co-worker just told me he was so hungry he could eat a horse. Time to call him on his bullshit, literal or not! ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2011, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/79 "2011-09-30T17:08:01Z")
Well, well, well… Look who just got smart: you, Republicans! Looks like they’re inching toward Romney, growing wise to the fact that Yosemite Sam can’t win. What can we do to shift things back? I’ll campaign for Perry if I must. Go, Perry, go! ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2011, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/80 "2011-09-30T20:56:44Z")
Some Choice Quotes from Rick Perry: > [@](#): > > “And then I suspended Marcia off this bridge and took a virgin heifer night riding for a while,” said Perry. > [@](#): > > “I cannot wait for a medieval cookie, a Cinnabon , hot yellow kool-aid and save a pretzel for the gas jets!” Watch the video [Here](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BhDhDRvHaGs) News article [Here](http://www.ksdk.com/news/article/279242/28/Rick-Perry-victim-of-Bad-Lip-Reading) ---
**Author:** ![AbloyProtec](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9f8e36/32.png) [@AbloyProtec](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AbloyProtec)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2011, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407/81 "2011-10-02T16:50:48Z")
Anyone see this? > [@](#): > > Following a Washington Post report that Republican presidential candidate Rick Perry’s family hunting camp in Texas once had the word “Niggerhead” painted on a large rock at its entrance, the Perry campaign is scrambling to control the damage [Original Report](http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/rick-perry-familys-hunting-camp-still-known-to-many-by-old-racially-charged-name/2011/10/01/gIQAOhY5DL_story.html) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-rick-perrys-debate-performance/597407.md?page=5)