# Fallout from Ron Suskind's book "Confidence Men?" **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 22, 2011, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159 "2011-09-22T04:38:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/1 "2011-09-22T04:38:49Z")
I haven’t read the book myself yet of course, but reviews & discussion ranging from the [New York Times](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/19/books/ron-suskinds-confidence-men-focuses-on-obama-review.html) to the [Daily Show](http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/tue-september-20-2011-ron-suskind) are painting this in rather dire tones. And yet, the SDMB elections forum is oddly quiet on the subject. So, anyway. Ron Suskind doesn’t appear to be any secondhand Kitty Kelly gossip monger here: he was there and talked with all the people he’s writing about in real time. What’s the fallout? From what Jon Stewart discusses with the author, it sounds like it would be very discouraging to Obama supporters. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/2 "2011-09-22T06:00:36Z")
Summary of what the book says, maybe? ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 9:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/3 "2011-09-22T09:52:58Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > And yet, the SDMB elections forum is oddly quiet on the subject. Well, it’s obvious that nobody cares enough about the subject to write an OP that explains who Ron Suskind is, what the book he wrote is about, and what he says that might be very discouraging to Obama supporters. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/4 "2011-09-22T12:41:15Z")
Oh thank god. More fair and balanced concern trolling from the OP. I can see his next OP in this forum now: Obama is found to be banging a black chick. Should his white supporters be concerned by his clear preference for non-whites? Will his non-racist black supporters be able to overcome the shame of hypocrisy and still vote for him? How will this affect his almost certain defeat in 2012, and why aren’t his supporters talking about this? Are they afraid? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![joebuck20](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/74df32/32.png) [@joebuck20](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joebuck20)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/5 "2011-09-22T14:27:57Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Summary of what the book says, maybe? I haven’t read the book either, but judging from what I saw on The Daily Show and have read in reviews, it paints Obama as a weak, indecisive leader who was all too willing to let people like Larry Summers or Timothy Geithner ignore or slow walk his directives and was overall ill suited to deal with the economic crisis he inherited. ---
**Author:** ![joebuck20](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/74df32/32.png) [@joebuck20](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joebuck20)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/6 "2011-09-22T14:35:30Z")
Also, the book describes the White House as fitting "all the classic legal requirements for a genuinely hostile workplace to women.” ---
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/7 "2011-09-22T15:20:33Z")
> [@joebuck20](#): > > Also, the book describes the White House as fitting "all the classic legal requirements for a genuinely hostile workplace to women.” The book doesn’t do that. It quotes a woman who worked in the White House who said that. You can listen to Suskind defend his reporting on [Fresh Air](http://www.npr.org/2011/09/20/140594464/confidence-men-ron-suskind-on-white-house-woes). A few people are saying they were misquoted in the book and apparently this isn’t the first time this has happened with Suskind’s books. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/8 "2011-09-22T15:32:55Z")
> [@joebuck20](#): > > I haven’t read the book either, but judging from what I saw on The Daily Show and have read in reviews, it paints Obama as a **weak, indecisive leader** who was all too willing to let people like Larry Summers or Timothy Geithner ignore or slow walk his directives and was overall ill suited to deal with the economic crisis he inherited. I don’t think this book is exactly a revelation on this one. What’s next, an exciting tell-all that showcases Reid as being a pussy or Boehner being incompetent? BREAKING: Water is in fact wet. How will this affect Obama’s certain defeat? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/9 "2011-09-22T16:47:19Z")
> [@joebuck20](#): > > it paints Obama as a weak, indecisive leader The sequel will reveal that Benedict XVI is a Catholic. ---
**Author:** ![42fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/b487fb/32.png) [@42fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/42fish)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/10 "2011-09-22T20:22:32Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > BREAKING: Water is in fact wet. How will this affect Obama’s certain defeat? > > -Joe Water was also wet during the Carter administration! Why, I remember it VIVIDLY! Connect the dot, people! ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/11 "2011-09-22T20:41:30Z")
You can just bet that that fucker matriculated at Harvard, too. ---
**Author:** ![Ca3799](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9f8e36/32.png) [@Ca3799](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ca3799)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/12 "2011-09-22T23:16:56Z")
The reviews and interviews I’ve seen and heard focused on the ‘hostile workplace’ claim and the ‘it took a while for Obama to top the learning curve’ idea. Big whoop. ---
**Author:** ![OttoDaFe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ottodafe/32/356_2.png) [@OttoDaFe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OttoDaFe)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/13 "2011-09-22T23:58:16Z")
Even granting Suskind’s premise (on which I have to maintain neutrality, not having read the book), I’d far prefer Obama’s “weakness” and “indecisiveness” to the firm, unswerving positions advocated by most of the candidates the GOP wants to throw at us. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/14 "2011-09-23T00:05:14Z")
He claims that Geithner was told to nationalize the banks to get them lending and back in control. But Geithner just flat out did not follow orders. Well not Obama’s, but he followed Goldman’s. The claim is that several people in the admin did not follow through but were not canned. He also put in Goldman people when his early advisers were much better and not on the payroll of the banks. But after Obama got in, there was an unprecedented financial crisis to deal with besides finding people to fill the administration out. It was a very busy time. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/15 "2011-09-23T00:19:56Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > You can just bet that that fucker matriculated at Harvard, too. Hey, we all experimented in college, it ain’t a life choice. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/16 "2011-09-23T00:21:28Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > The sequel will reveal that Benedict XVI is a Catholic. People say that, but I suspect he’s really a German. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/17 "2011-09-23T02:18:20Z")
Some excerpts I found interesting in a [review written by the editor of Salon.com](http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/joan_walsh/politics/2011/09/21/ron_suskind_confidence_men/index.html): > [@](#): > > [T]he question at the heart of Suskind’s book is much more interesting: Who is Barack Obama, and what exactly did he want to do with his presidency? > > . . . > > Whatever happened with Citibank, it’s clear that at every turn, Obama made choices that protected the Wall Street status quo, and Geithner was behind every single decision . . . Geithner worked hard to protect the debt machine and its masters [. . .] One prominent banker tells Suskind his colleagues expected much harsher treatment from the Obama administration in the administration of TARP and other decisions. “For Washington to not demand anything when it saved us, even stuff that we know is for our long-term good, was one of the stupidest moves in modern times … I feel like I should go over and hug Tim. It’s a shame we can’t pay him, 'cause that’s a guy who really earned a big-time bonus.” > > . . . > Some of the book’s most unsettling revelations have to do with White House sexism, or maybe it’s best described as “guyism,” as in Obama just misses the way his guy culture leaves out women, however inadvertently. Most of the juicy stories have already been dissected – and denied, not convincingly, by some of the women involved: Anita Dunn saying the White House would “fit all of the classic legal requirements for a genuinely hostile workplace to women”; Christina Romer complaining she was overlooked and undermined so often by Larry Summers she “felt like a piece of meat”; a “women’s dinner” convened by Valerie Jarrett to allow the president to hear the complaints of his top female staff directly. > > . . . > > Suskind offers one telling anecdote about Obama’s approach to gender that’s been overlooked in coverage to date. Early in the book, during a campaign strategy session on candidate Obama’s economic program, he and his advisors discuss the continuing erosion of jobs and wages for low to moderately skilled male workers. The big job opportunities, one researcher explains, will be in the exploding realm of healthcare – positions for nurses, hospital orderlies and in-home assistants to frail seniors will boom. > > Obama jumps in: “Look, these are guys,” he says. “A lot of them see health care, being nurse’s aides, as women’s work. They need to do something that fits with how they define themselves as men.” Quickly the conversation turned to infrastructure: fixing the nation’s crumbling roads, bridges, schools and public buildings. Men like to build, the group concludes, and infrastructure offers a campaign promise that promotes employment, improves our public roads and buildings, and makes working-class men feel better about themselves. . . . I could shrug off Obama’s “guyism” in that conversation about “women’s work,” if only he’d had the courage to follow through and push a program that would create jobs, fix what needs fixing and shore up male employment. Instead, we have unconscionably high unemployment, plus a window into the president’s retro view of “men’s” and “women’s work.” > > . . . > > Suskind frequently stops mid-narrative to grapple with the central question of his book: Was the problem mainly with Obama’s staff, which can be corrected by a staff shakeup, and with the president’s early inexperienced leadership, which can be ameliorated by experience? Or is there something missing in Obama himself, in his vision and values, that led to the lack of bold action to solve the nation’s biggest problems? > > . . . > > On the question of whether the problem is with Obama’s political values and priorities, or just his lack of leadership experience, Suskind doesn’t seem sure himself. He closes the book with a picture of a president who’s been “educated” on the ways of the White House, a picture that reassures Suskind a little. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/18 "2011-09-23T11:58:36Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > Some excerpts I found interesting in a [review written by the editor of Salon.com](http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/joan_walsh/politics/2011/09/21/ron_suskind_confidence_men/index.html): But how will another cut and paste post by the OP affect Obama’s doomed 2012 campaign? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/19 "2011-09-23T16:03:05Z")
I just watched Suskind on Democracy Now. His statements were given and then the people who he said the things he “reported”, responded. Then he responded. I don’t think he left with his credibility in tact. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallout-from-ron-suskinds-book-confidence-men/597159/20 "2011-09-23T16:28:53Z")
This is just the break that the McCain campaign has been waiting for.