# Fallujah children's 'genetic damage' **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 23, 2010, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784 "2010-07-23T23:27:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Zanthor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@Zanthor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zanthor)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/1 "2010-07-23T23:27:19Z")
O.P. BBC News – Fallujah children’s ‘genetic damage’ 21 Jul 2010 … Cancer, leukaemia and infant mortality are all increasing in the Iraqi town of Fallujah, which saw fierce fighting between US forces and … [Fallujah children's 'genetic damage' - BBC News](http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-10721562) – 57k – Similar pages ok, basically, news has been increasing for ages now about the incredible surging birth defects in Fallujah ( a city in Iraq we rubbled with all kinds of our WMD, basic info for those that neither know nor care where or what Fallujah is.) Link Iraq to the story about the affects of Agent orange in Vietnam ( if you like ) Both tales of woe are synonymous with each other. basically, the incredible damage we inflict upon foreign nations… with our approved WMD… If you want i can link to Hillary Clinton promising Vietnam she will. look into it, no promise of aid tho… to their deformed offspring… ( like virtually nothing has been done to help them for decades, why would it change now? cept if it were not for accountability??? ) No likewise promises so far to Iraq tho. The US so far disavows all responsibility… Pictures and Vid I saw of the damaged children in both countries are beyond what humanity should have to suffer… [www.rt.com](http://www.rt.com) had a good article on it. Thoughts anyone? Zanthor ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/2 "2010-07-23T23:39:27Z")
We didn’t use “WMD” as you claim. WMD’s are either nuclear, chemical or biological, or overwhelmingly-sized explosives. This is going to veer into the depleted uranium rounds that we use, of which evidence of their use and subsequent human damage due to some type of radiation exposure is mixed. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/3 "2010-07-23T23:50:09Z")
> [@Zanthor](#): > > Link Iraq to the story about the affects of Agent orange in Vietnam ( if you like ) > Both tales of woe are synonymous with each other. > basically, the incredible damage we inflict upon foreign nations… > with our approved WMD… You are aware that the video in your link says it’s not clear what caused the defects, yes? ---
**Author:** ![Zanthor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@Zanthor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zanthor)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/4 "2010-07-23T23:59:55Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > We didn’t use “WMD” as you claim. WMD’s are either nuclear, chemical or biological, or overwhelmingly-sized explosives. This is going to veer into the depleted uranium rounds that we use, of which evidence of their use and subsequent human damage due to some type of radiation exposure is mixed. they say a cruise missile homing in on their wedding party is a WMD, whether it be equipped with Agent Orange, ( Vietnam ) DU, White Phos, etc etc, Iraq, Afghanistan, ( God only knows what else ) the point of degree of WMD is subjective, luckily something we do not have to experience, otherwise our opinion might be altered slightly, Capeche? Like, its something we are doing to them, not them to us, yeah, right…why should we care how deformed they get as a result of our actions, right? what we do is deny it, all that crap in their drinking water, their soil, came from some other ‘source’, right? definitely not us. why should we pay, right\>\>\> blah blah blah yeah, right, for sure ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/5 "2010-07-24T00:02:23Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > We didn’t use “WMD” as you claim. WMD’s are either nuclear, chemical or biological, or overwhelmingly-sized explosives. This is going to veer into the depleted uranium rounds that we use, of which evidence of their use and subsequent human damage due to some type of radiation exposure is mixed. There’s a four-year-old report on Rense that leads off with > [@](#): > > Death Made In America > Wondering if your conscience is still anesthetized > Mohammed Daud Miraki, MA, MA, PhD and supposedly shows Afghani birth defects caused by DU. Thing is, the report leads off with a picture of a [Harlequin](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harlequin_type_ichthyosis) baby–the victim of a congenital disorder that was identified 50 years before Uranium! ---
**Author:** ![Zanthor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@Zanthor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zanthor)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/6 "2010-07-24T00:04:23Z")
> [@Lute Skywatcher](#): > > You are aware that the video in your link says it’s not clear what caused the defects, yes? yes, but that is the privilege denial offers. honest oblivion to what really matters. they lie deformed, we say, we are innocent. how convenient for us, unfortunate for them, say what? we say it was not us, honest officer. BTW there are many other sources currently exploring the issues of our WMD damage we have thus far caused. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/7 "2010-07-24T00:14:58Z")
> [@Zanthor](#): > > yes, but that is the privilege denial offers. > honest oblivion to what really matters. > they lie deformed, we say, we are innocent. > how convenient for us, unfortunate for them, say what? > we say > it was not us, honest officer. > BTW > there are many other sources currently exploring the issues of our WMD damage we have thus far caused. Oh, I see. You don’t really want thoughts, you just want to rant about “but they’re guilty of all this other crap!” ---
**Author:** ![Zanthor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@Zanthor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zanthor)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/8 "2010-07-24T00:25:11Z")
> [@Lute Skywatcher](#): > > Oh, I see. You don’t really want thoughts, you just want to rant about “but they’re guilty of all this other crap!” no what i hoped for was that we would own up to what we have done, still do… This ’ other crap’ you mention please define for me just what this is, so i can tell just how much you have washed your blood stained hands. no offense, just curious is all. ---
**Author:** ![Todderbob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e47774/32.png) [@Todderbob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Todderbob)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/9 "2010-07-24T00:34:04Z")
> [@Zanthor](#): > > no what i hoped for was that we would own up to what we have done, still do… > > This ’ other crap’ you mention > please define for me just what this is, so i can tell just how much you have washed your blood stained hands. > no offense, just curious is all. You want me to feel guilty, because im an American, because of what America has done, right? Why? First, why should I feel guilty about what the USA did in vietnam? I acknowledge that the US undertook some very questionable, perhaps even morally incorrect act actions. Why should I feel guilt about it? And you have yet to show one thing that the US is responsible for, other than the ridiculous amount of human suffering that war brings – and you haven’t even established that the US is responsible for that – other than innuendo. Oh, and try typing with moderately correct punctuation, so I don’t have to bust out a first grader-to-english dictionary to understand you and your post, and I’m sure you’ll come across as more convincing. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/10 "2010-07-24T00:51:02Z")
> [@Zanthor](#): > > they say a cruise missile homing in on their wedding party is a WMD, whether it be equipped with Agent Orange, ( Vietnam ) DU, White Phos, etc etc, Iraq, Afghanistan, ( God only knows what else ) the point of degree of WMD is subjective, luckily something we do not have to experience, otherwise our opinion might be altered slightly, Capeche? Trying to parse this into English, you seem to be saying that a WMD doesn’t have to actually be a nuclear, biological or chemical weapon; it just has to be a weapon. This being the case, I am forced to revise my opinion on the necessity and justness of the war. Invading Iraq was completely justified and it turns out Bush was right after all; we found WMDs all over the place in Iraq! ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/11 "2010-07-24T00:52:46Z")
> [@Zanthor](#): > > no what i hoped for was that we would own up to what we have done, still do… What, exactly, does this have to do with those “Fallujah children’s ‘genetic damage’”? ---
**Author:** ![Zanthor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@Zanthor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zanthor)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/12 "2010-07-24T01:00:28Z")
> [@Todderbob](#): > > You want me to feel guilty, because im an American, because of what America has done, right? > > Why? > > First, why should I feel guilty about what the USA did in vietnam? I acknowledge that the US undertook some very questionable, perhaps even morally incorrect act actions. Why should I feel guilt about it? > > And you have yet to show one thing that the US is responsible for, other than the ridiculous amount of human suffering that war brings – and you haven’t even established that the US is responsible for that – other than innuendo. > > Oh, and try typing with moderately correct punctuation, so I don’t have to bust out a first grader-to-english dictionary to understand you and your post, and I’m sure you’ll come across as more convincing. do you think that what you fell matters/ or that i care what you feel? personal feelings should only prompt accountability, with accountability comes ownership of past mistakes, hopefully infers that we will not repeat them. so far i have seen no evidence to suggest we have learnt one dammed thing. we still keep annihilating foreign countries with god knows what WMD then saying, its all their fault. and I say, Crap… ---
**Author:** ![Zanthor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@Zanthor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zanthor)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/13 "2010-07-24T01:04:53Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > Trying to parse this into English, you seem to be saying that a WMD doesn’t have to actually be a nuclear, biological or chemical weapon; it just has to be a weapon. This being the case, I am forced to revise my opinion on the necessity and justness of the war. Invading Iraq was completely justified and it turns out Bush was right after all; we found WMDs all over the place in Iraq! No, again you see it all from your own self POV, what i said was, we lay waste to them with ‘our’ WMD, to them, we are Destroyers, of them nothing more, nothing less. Want to try address how come Agent Orange and God knows what in Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan causes them to be born so horribly deformed? instead of lamely attacking me for trying to highlight our arrogance?\> Searching here, all i see is head in sand, it was not us that wasted them… I say, Bullshit ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/14 "2010-07-24T01:14:55Z")
> [@Zanthor](#): > > do you think that what you fell matters/ or that i care what you feel? If no one else’s opinion matters, why did you post here? Why not just write your OP on a piece of paper and keep it in your pocket? ---
**Author:** ![Zanthor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@Zanthor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zanthor)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/15 "2010-07-24T01:26:07Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > If no one else’s opinion matters, why did you post here? Why not just write your OP on a piece of paper and keep it in your pocket? here again, its from self POV as if that is all that matters. What I said was, if you bothered to look beyond self, POV was that personal feelings are only useful in causing one to be prompted to Empathy. IE. Seeing the situation from ‘Their’ POV. ( if you can ) otherwise its just all self glorification, justification etc etc etc. self perpetuating lies of vain gloriousness. what i was saying was our self rightousness, as we lay waste to foreign nations with God knows what is seriously flawed. They are being born with serious defects. The thread is, are we responsible? Comprehende? I think yes, convince me otherwise if you can. cos i will doubt you, think we are lying with butt cheeks squeezed so tight not one $US will come out to help them, no expense spared to waste them tho, make them bleed some more… Why exactly again? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/16 "2010-07-24T01:30:33Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > We didn’t use “WMD” as you claim. WMD’s are either nuclear, chemical or biological, or overwhelmingly-sized explosives. This is going to veer into the depleted uranium rounds that we use, of which evidence of their use and subsequent human damage due to some type of radiation exposure is mixed. Not that I’m defending the OP, but… > [@](#): > > [WMD](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weapon_of_mass_destruction#United_States) > Within U.S. civil defense organizations, the category is now Chemical, Biological, Radiological, Nuclear, and Explosive (CBRNE), which defines WMD as: > > ``` > (1) Any explosive, incendiary, poison gas, bomb, grenade, or rocket having a propellant charge of more than four ounces [113 g], missile having an explosive or incendiary charge of more than one-quarter ounce [7 g], or mine or device similar to the above. (2) Poison gas. (3) Any weapon involving a disease organism. (4) Any weapon that is designed to release radiation at a level dangerous to human life. > > ``` ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/17 "2010-07-24T01:34:47Z")
> [@Zanthor](#): > > Comprehende? I’d have to say… no. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/18 "2010-07-24T02:01:05Z")
White phosphorus is considered a chemical weapon when anyone other than us uses it. And the analogy with Agent Orange doesn’t actually hold up, because Agent Orange was intended to kill only plants, not humans. In fact, Agent Orange itself does only kill plants, not humans: The cancers are from impurities that come in during manufacture. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/19 "2010-07-24T02:03:24Z")
**Zanthor** : The folks on this MB are about 10-1 rabidly against the Iraq War. If you find yourself on the outs in an anti-Iraq War thread here, you might want to rethink your position. Or at least rethink your argument. “Bad thing” happened in Iraq. The US waged an unjust war in Iraq. Therefore the US is responsible for “bad thing”. Uh… no. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784/20 "2010-07-24T02:42:13Z")
> [@Zanthor](#): > > please define for me just what this is, so i can tell just how much you have washed your blood stained hands. > no offense, just curious is all. > [@Todderbob](#): > > Oh, and try typing with moderately correct punctuation, so I don’t have to bust out a first grader-to-english dictionary to understand you and your post, . . . This is Great Debates, so these sort of snide personal remarks are unwelcome. = = = That said, the OP does not appear to wish to actually engage in a debate, so I am moving it off to the BBQ Pit where Zanthor can express himself more freely. [/Moderating] [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fallujah-childrens-genetic-damage/547784.md?page=2)