# False "incoming missile alert" sent to Hawaii residents **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 13, 2018, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557 "2018-01-13T18:51:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/101 "2018-01-14T19:58:12Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > **Waikiki weather:** Mostly sunny, high of 82º, 70% chance of incoming ballistic missle(s). “I’m sorry. I misread that. Today’s high will be 820,000º” ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/102 "2018-01-14T19:58:22Z")
> [@Zakalwe](#): > > From launch to impact is estimated to be 37 minutes assuming North Korea is the aggressor (See [here](http://www.businessinsider.com/north-korean-nuclear-strike-united-states-arrival-times-2017-8)). The steps you outline would probably take 10-15 minutes even under ideal circumstances - cutting the effective warning time almost in half. Getting it absolutely right, but too late to do any good is, IMHO, worse than the occasional false alarm. > [@Mangosteen](#): > > You mean to tell me that there is a “button” that has “Ballistic missile threat inbound to Hawaii. Seek immediate shelter. This is not a drill.” some how attached to it and that no one had to type this particular specific message into the system? > > Is there another “button” for “Tsunami threat inbound to Hawaii. Seek immediate shelter.”? > > And another one for a meteor threat, an Alien invasion and Godzilla? > > The idea that the alert could be sent out accidentally by “one person during a shift change” is complete BS. > > Hawaii state is without a doubt incompetent, but there is no way the alert system didn’t already have a two person (at least) multi layered fail safe program in place to prevent accidental alerts. **k9bfriender** beat me to it, but read the post above yours. The military can detect a launch pretty quickly but then they need further time to determine _where_ it’s going. Look at how parallel the paths between NYC & Wash DC are from the link in **Zakalwe** ’s post. Once they determine that it’s a real launch & where it’s going (ie. _not_ another test to land harmlessly in the ocean) they need to disseminate this info, both up the military chain & ‘down’ to the appropriate state(s) Emergency/Disaster resources, in this case it appears to be HEMA. HEMA now needs to go thru their checklists before sending out a message. If it _wasn’t_ preloaded, I’d be extremely surprised that the exact wording wasn’t carefully chosen in advance & printed in their procedure manuals. In other emergency services, & even in things like sports, the desire is to train enough so that when scenario x happens one just reacts & doesn’t need to think about it is a good thing. To sum up, there’s an extremely short window of time to get out an urgent message, one that could quite possibly mean the end of the sender’s own family. You don’t want them dithering on what exact wording to send; make it as simple as possible during an extremely stressful situation Is having some/much of this canned a good thing? Yes Is regularly drilling on this a good thing? Yes Is having the drill go one step too far & _really_ send out the message a good thing? Obviously not, but as has been already pointed out, it doesn’t appear there were any deaths/injuries from this foul up & procedures are being/have been changed to make it work even better in the future. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/103 "2018-01-14T20:00:47Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > The problem wasn’t really the alert that was sent out. Obviously, it isn’t exactly optimal to send such things, but the bigger problem was the response. > > It should have been less than a minute to inform the public of the false alert. A few minutes would have been longer than it should have been. > > 38 minutes is unacceptable. > > While preventing the false alert from happening again is important, the priority should be on why the response was so delayed, and how to make it faster in the future. As I mentioned, there was no automatic response in place in the event of a false alarm. First they had to realize the mistake, which took awhile, then input a message manually. And have you ever tried typing quickly when under extreme pressure? Especially if you have fat-finger syndrome like me? Again, they are now investigating all the shortcomings and making adjustments as necessary. Sounds like President Chump has not had time to give any comments on yesterday’s doings. Whining about Wolff’s book and “fake news” takes up all his time. That and working on his golf game. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/104 "2018-01-14T20:39:26Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > As I mentioned, there was no automatic response in place in the event of a false alarm. First they had to realize the mistake, which took awhile, then input a message manually. And have you ever tried typing quickly when under extreme pressure? Especially if you have fat-finger syndrome like me? I am actually a pretty fast typist, so I’m not sure I can empathize with that. But, in any case, that explains why the correction was not made within 15 seconds, it doesn’t explain why it took 38. No matter how fat your fingers are, you should be able to get a message out in that amount of time. I am pretty sure I could type a coherent message with my toes in that amount of time. > [@](#): > > Again, they are now investigating all the shortcomings and making adjustments as necessary. Yeah, it was the realizing that they had made a mistake part that took them far longer than it needed. I truly hope that that message never gets sent for real, but if it is sent, I hope that people retain enough confidence in the EBS system to heed the warning. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/105 "2018-01-14T20:57:15Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I am actually a pretty fast typist, so I’m not sure I can empathize with that. But, in any case, that explains why the correction was not made within 15 seconds, it doesn’t explain why it took 38. No matter how fat your fingers are, you should be able to get a message out in that amount of time. I am pretty sure I could type a coherent message with my toes in that amount of time. While knowing nothing about the specifics of their system, I’m guessing the operator chooses from a dropdown list of pre-defined messages & either there is no manual entry capability or the operator working Saturday morning didn’t have the system access to manually key in a recall message. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/106 "2018-01-14T21:29:34Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > While knowing nothing about the specifics of their system, I’m guessing the operator chooses from a dropdown list of pre-defined messages & either there is no manual entry capability or the operator working Saturday morning didn’t have the system access to manually key in a recall message. Add to that that I don’t think they realize what they had done for a bit. But yeah, the reason to analyze this event is not to lay blame, it is to find what went wrong, and prevent it from happening in the future, and also come up with viable solutions in case it does anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Mangosteen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Mangosteen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangosteen)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/107 "2018-01-14T22:30:53Z")
Would be interesting to know the total cost of this incident. Restaurants, stores and many other kinds of businesses were emptied as people ran for cover. Across the entire island chain, the cost due to lost revenue could run into the millions of dollars. Wonder if any businesses will sue? Its good to know that the individual supposedly responsible will be “retrained” even though they were not new to their position and also that no disciplinary action is planned. ---
**Author:** ![galen\_ubal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galen_ubal/32/4440_2.png) [@galen\_ubal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galen_ubal)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/108 "2018-01-14T22:46:53Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > While knowing nothing about the specifics of their system, I’m guessing the operator chooses from a dropdown list of pre-defined messages & either there is no manual entry capability or the operator working Saturday morning didn’t have the system access to manually key in a recall message. [According to the Washington Post](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2018/01/14/hawaii-missile-alert-how-one-employee-pushed-the-wrong-button-and-caused-a-wave-of-panic/?utm_term=.e1ca9d2fa68c), that’s pretty much how it started. > [@](#): > > Around 8:05 a.m., the Hawaii emergency employee initiated the internal test, according to a timeline released by the state. From a drop-down menu on a computer program, he saw two options: “Test missile alert” and “Missile alert.” He was supposed to choose the former; as much of the world now knows, he chose the latter, an initiation of a real-life missile alert. > > “In this case, the operator selected the wrong menu option,” HEMA spokesman Richard Rapoza told The Washington Post on Sunday. Part of the delay was crafting a way to cancel the alert: > [@](#): > > “We had to double back and work with FEMA [to craft and approve the false alarm alert] and that’s what took time,” Rapoza said. > That has since been remedied, he said, with a cancellation option that can be triggered within seconds of a mistake. > “In the past there was no cancellation button. There was no false alarm button at all,” Rapoza said. “Now there is a command to issue a message immediately that goes over on the same system saying ‘It’s a false alarm. Please disregard.’ as soon as the mistake is identified.” They go on to describe plans to make it a two-person operation to send out a real alert. Sounds like they’re identifying the initial problems in process, and correcting them. Not great, but in a way, it’s probably the best way to test the system. ---
**Author:** ![Mangosteen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Mangosteen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangosteen)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/109 "2018-01-14T23:43:48Z")
And AFTER the person (mis)chooses “Missile Alert” from the drop down menu, are you telling us there is not another pop up that says, "Are you sure you want “Missile Alert”? When I want to erase a stinking TV program from my DVR and hit the “erase” button, I get a pop up that says, “Are you sure you want to erase this program?” When I want to exit my online account at Bank of America and hit the exit button, I also get a pop up that asks me if I really want to leave. And you are telling me that a computer program designed to send out a message as important as a incoming missile alert, does not have a “second question” confirming the operators request? Just not buying it. ---
**Author:** ![galen\_ubal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galen_ubal/32/4440_2.png) [@galen\_ubal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galen_ubal)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/110 "2018-01-14T23:54:50Z")
From the above article: > [@](#): > > On Saturday, Ripoza said, the employee was asked in the computer program to confirm that he wanted to send the message. In the future, a second person will be required for confirmation. Oops. Not to say he didn’t screw up…but, hindsight is 20/20. I can’t say, if I’d been designing it myself, that I’d have allowed for the infinite ability of humans to screw up. It’d be better if they’d done that in the first place, but at least they’re catching it now. Rereading your response, **Mangosteen** , are you thinking that it was deliberate? Maybe, but I’m hard pressed to see how it benefitted anyone. Eight in the morning, routine task, not paying much attention…well, I think, given the choice between screwup and malice, I’ll pick screwup as the probable cause. ETA: I’m not excusing the guy - it was a truly bonehead move that frightened a lot of people. Just saying it was, most likely, an innocent mistake. History is replete with such things. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/111 "2018-01-14T23:58:37Z")
- In the future, a second person will be required for confirmation. \* And, of course, that second person will be in the men’s room taking a dump when they need him to confirm. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/112 "2018-01-15T00:46:41Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > I think running around crying and screaming was very much a minority reaction. Right. So what are NBC and running coach _talking_ about? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/113 "2018-01-15T00:53:04Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Right. So what are NBC and running coach _talking_ about? I never said it happened. I said, basically, that it’s not entirely impossible for an unknown number of people to react that way. ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/114 "2018-01-15T01:08:01Z")
The report I’ve read is that there is a dropdown menu with two items - one sends a test message, the other sends a not-a-test message. If true, not exactly a button. Not exactly well designed, either. ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/115 "2018-01-15T01:14:58Z")
…a-a-and, missed the edit deadline after realizing this was already up there. I hate missing a page. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/116 "2018-01-15T01:37:24Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I am actually a pretty fast typist, so I’m not sure I can empathize with that. But, in any case, that explains why the correction was not made within 15 seconds, it doesn’t explain why it took 38. No matter how fat your fingers are, you should be able to get a message out in that amount of time. I am pretty sure I could type a coherent message with my toes in that amount of time. Good for you. Too bad for us you weren’t there. Don’t worry – again, all procedures or lack thereof are now being scrutinized under a microscope. Any conspiracy theories that this was intentional will go the way of the 9/11 and JFK fantasies. The employee in question – constantly referred to as a “he” until today, when they’ve started refusing to specify the gender – has reportedly not been fired but rather disciplined and reassigned to other duties for the time being. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/117 "2018-01-15T02:25:14Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > - In the future, a second person will be required for confirmation. \* > > And, of course, that second person will be in the men’s room taking a dump when they need him to confirm. My thoughts exactly. Except it’s not just a second employee, but a manager. If this were for real, it is literally a time-sensitive, life-threatening emergency. Do they have multiple managers with at least one always in the room such that bio or lunch breaks don’t degrade their readiness capabilities? ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/118 "2018-01-15T03:16:05Z")
running coach: > [@](#): > > That’s the big red button next to the big red button that brews coffee. \What does this little red button do?\ ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/119 "2018-01-15T03:26:18Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > running coach: > > > [@](#): > > > > That’s the big red button next to the big red button that brews coffee. > > \What does this little red button do?\ [More like this.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1CxlyMoFRs) ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557/120 "2018-01-15T09:11:24Z")
> [@Mangosteen](#): > > And AFTER the person (mis)chooses “Missile Alert” from the drop down menu, are you telling us there is not another pop up that says, "Are you sure you want “Missile Alert”? My understanding is that there was. But the operator pressed yes without thinking, just like you and I press yes on all the confirmation messages we get. What I haven’t seen is whether the test message also had a confirmation box. If it did, and it looked like the real one, then no wonder he or she screwed up. The real confirmation box should have had large flashing red letters, saying “Are we really all going to die, or are you shitting me?” Then it wouldn’t have happened. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/false-incoming-missile-alert-sent-to-hawaii-residents/806557.md?page=7)