# Families separated at the Border - effects upon the Midterms? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [June 19, 2018, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396 "2018-06-19T19:39:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/81 "2018-06-21T18:26:20Z")
The effects were no less traumatizing, regardless of the intentions behind it. Trump wants to scare mothers and their kids. Obama wanted to use deportation to further his political goals. One is worse than the other, but it’s not a huge difference in degree. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/82 "2018-06-21T18:30:31Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The effects were no less traumatizing, regardless of the intentions behind it. Trump wants to scare mothers and their kids. Obama wanted to use deportation to further his political goals. One is worse than the other, but it’s not a huge difference in degree. Not interested in helping to turn this into another Obama bashing thread. Doesn’t that ever get old for you? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/83 "2018-06-21T18:37:59Z")
Obama himself is kinda old hat for me. His supporters who think he was a great President despite doing things they call inhumane and cruel, that’s still a sore spot. 🙂 And he did actually imprison mothers with their children as a deterrence measure, which caused the courts to smack him down, something which was disturbingly routine during his administration. > **[The Shame of America’s Family Detention Camps (Published 2015)](https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/08/magazine/the-shame-of-americas-family-detention-camps.html)** > > The Obama administration’s draconian policy toward female refugees and their children has sown misery on the border — and pushed volunteer lawyers to the breaking point. > **[Judge Orders Release of Immigrant Children Detained by U.S. (Published 2015)](https://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/26/us/detained-immigrant-children-judge-dolly-gee-ruling.html)** > > In a withering critique of Obama administration policy, the judge said the government was keeping children who crossed the border in unsafe conditions. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/84 "2018-06-21T18:50:55Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Obama himself is kinda old hat for me. His supporters who think he was a great President despite doing things they call inhumane and cruel, that’s still a sore spot. 🙂 > > And he did actually imprison mothers with their children as a deterrence measure, which caused the courts to smack him down, something which was disturbingly routine during his administration. > > [https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/08/magazine/the-shame-of-americas-family-detention-camps.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/08/magazine/the-shame-of-americas-family-detention-camps.html) > > [https://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/26/us/detained-immigrant-children-judge-dolly-gee-ruling.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/26/us/detained-immigrant-children-judge-dolly-gee-ruling.html) Also not interested in helping to turn this into another Obama bashing thread. Doesn’t that ever get old for you? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/85 "2018-06-21T19:15:05Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Well, the crisis is over. Children are now back their partners. Those children are not all back with their “partners”. Some of them are dead. Some of them were pulled, screaming and crying, from their parent’s arms, put into horrendously abusive situations, and killed. Some of those parents will never see their children again. Some of those parents will never know what happened to their children. Their last memory of their children will be of uniformed officials pulling them, crying, from their arms. Some of those children suffered (and are currently suffering) abuse that they will never recover from. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/86 "2018-06-21T19:19:33Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Up until 2014, we could at least rely on Democratic Presidents to faithfully enforce the law as best they could, while being angrily criticized by Democratic legislators, but Obama pretty much ended that and Clinton ran on a promise to only deport felons. Further, Democrats voted for biometric entry/exit systems and border fencing, but then refused to fund them. It’s a scam. First, I don’t think you entirely grasp the chronological nature of time. Second,[reality seems to disagree](https://www.washingtonpost.com/resizer/QfimaMkgs5uJ7OlaVjKivh-76Nc=/1484x0/arc-anglerfish-washpost-prod-washpost.s3.amazonaws.com/public/MTYNCAXKW4YYXHWDWB3GIXSZYQ.png) with your opinion. Don’t let that stop you, though; you’re on a roll. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/87 "2018-06-21T19:20:21Z")
Melania must be absorbing tone-deafness from her dear husband. Boarding a plane for a visit to a child detention center, she wore a coat with the words “I DON’T REALLY CARE- DO U?” ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/88 "2018-06-21T19:27:58Z")
> [@TimeWinder](#): > > The bottom line of the “immigration debate” is pure, unmitigated racism. There is no “harm” to be mitigated, except in the eyes of folks who don’t see these people as people. Study after study after study shows that they’re not harming our labor market or economy. We’re spending all this money solving a non-problem. I know the GOP supporters hate it when we attribute all of their actions to racism, but I’m still waiting for them to offer a non-racist definition of the “harm” these immigrants are causing. Some of the hatred isn’t “racist” but “voterist.” New immigrants who become citizens are less likely than the redneck base to fall for Republican lies. > [@adaher](#): > > … Open the gates to all, and it’s not 12 million anymore. It’s 120 million. Maybe 1.2 billion. Bartender, give me whatever **adaher** ’s drinking! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/89 "2018-06-21T19:32:05Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > Those children are not all back with their “partners”. Some of them are dead. Some of them were pulled, screaming and crying, from their parent’s arms, put into horrendously abusive situations, and killed. Some of those parents will never see their children again. Some of those parents will never know what happened to their children. Their last memory of their children will be of uniformed officials pulling them, crying, from their arms. Some of those children suffered (and are currently suffering) abuse that they will never recover from. There are a lot of people with surprising expectations of what a 19 month knows. “What is your mother’s name?” “Mama?” “Judge, I ask you find the defendant unresponsive.” ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/90 "2018-06-21T19:51:34Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Bartender, give me whatever **adaher** ’s drinking! 😛 What’s your estimate on the number of people who would come here if we opened our gates to all? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/91 "2018-06-21T19:52:39Z")
A LOT of people want to move to the US: > **[A revealing map of who wants to move to the U.S.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/03/22/a-revealing-map-of-who-wants-to-move-to-the-u-s/?utm_term=.085bf822d2d9)** > > The world's countries, color-coded by the share of the population that would like to migrate to the U.S. Gallup says 138 million people want to move to the US. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/92 "2018-06-21T20:07:55Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > A LOT of people want to move to the US I want a Ferrari. Although I could afford one, I will never buy one, because wanting and doing are different things. (Which may be why we use different words for them.) ---
**Author:** ![TimeWinder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@TimeWinder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TimeWinder)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/93 "2018-06-21T20:15:08Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Gallup says 138 million people want to move to the US. So? That would increase our population by a little less than 50%, assuming every single one of them follows through. (And in the post-Trump era, I believe they wouldn’t). That still wouldn’t put us at even a quarter of the population density of most European countries, and would dramatically increase our labor force, tax base, and economy. We’d probably have to spread them out over a few years logistically, but it would be no big deal at all. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/94 "2018-06-21T20:43:24Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Here in Texas, Cruz, Cornyn and Will Hurd (to name three) are downright _frightened_ at what this means to them. Their internal polling is so horrible that last week Cruz was all “the law is the law” and this week he (and Cornyn) introduced legislation to stop this. > > In addition, calls to their offices show extremely depressed and tired staffers who are tired of having to fend off frightened conservative Hispanics who are now wondering if they, or a family member, will be next > > Meanwhile Will Hurd (representative) is appearing on as many local shows as he can to argue that this isn’t HIS doing. > > Rick Wilson, ex-GOP media guru, tweeted this yesterday: > > [x.com](https://twitter.com/TheRickWilson/status/1009035743153532928?s=19) > > "Well, well, well. > > Who’s teacher NOW? > > Pollster for one of Trump’s most passionate, white-hot, flame-on ride-or-die defenders sends: > > “We have about a week before XXXXXXXX bails on Trump. The numbers are THAT bad.” " > > This may play well in Indiana, but in Texas it is a political disaster for the Republicans, especially those who need Hispanic votes to win. Texas is a state that is becoming increasingly in play for Democrats. Don’t get me wrong: I understand that it’s still a red state and it would take a lot for a Democrat to win a statewide election. But the Bushes have understood for a long time that winning in Texas means not angering the Latino vote. Trump is endangering Republicans there, as he is in Arizona. Last summer, Trump’s nadir was Charlottesville. South Texas is the Charlottesville of 2018. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/95 "2018-06-21T21:26:27Z")
For comparison: Uganda has taken in 19 registered refugees for every 100 citizens, plus an unknown number of unregistered refugees. And they’re not putting them in camps: They’re giving them the same sort of housing that most Ugandans have, intermixed with the citizens. If Uganda can do that, why can’t we? Are we not great enough? ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/96 "2018-06-21T21:45:52Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > For comparison: Uganda has taken in 19 registered refugees for every 100 citizens, plus an unknown number of unregistered refugees. And they’re not putting them in camps: They’re giving them the same sort of housing that most Ugandans have, intermixed with the citizens. If Uganda can do that, why can’t we? Are we not great enough? That’s really interesting — thanks for that info (I’m not being snarky). Obviously there are huge differences between the two countries\*, but still, it’s useful to know. \*Also, Uganda borders Congo, where two of the bloodiest wars in the last 100 years took place, peaking two decades ago. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/97 "2018-06-21T22:39:47Z")
> [@JKellyMap](#): > > That’s really interesting — thanks for that info (I’m not being snarky). Obviously there are huge differences between the two countries\*, but still, it’s useful to know. > > \*Also, Uganda borders Congo, where two of the bloodiest wars in the last 100 years took place, peaking two decades ago. Maybe an analogy would be 1910-1920, when Mexico was suffering a civil war. Did migration to the US spike then? I don’t know — I’ll try to find out. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/98 "2018-06-21T22:47:11Z")
Migration from [Mexico did increase during](https://blogs.loc.gov/kluge/2015/03/the-history-of-mexican-immigration-to-the-u-s-in-the-early-20th-century/) the 1910-20 Revolution, but still at low levels compared to recent decades — from a few thousand per year to around 10,000 per year (and then to around 20,000 per year in the 1920s). But[the numbers might have been quite a bit higher](https://www.loc.gov/teachers/classroommaterials/presentationsandactivities/presentations/immigration/mexican4.html)— there’s no way to know. In any case, a LOT of Mexicans stayed put, even when their country was in a civil war, and the borders WERE open. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2018, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/99 "2018-06-21T23:42:30Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Well, the crisis is over. Children are now back their partners. … Come again, comrade? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2018, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396/100 "2018-06-22T01:51:50Z")
Most of the refugees in Uganda now are actually from South Sudan, not the Congo. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/families-separated-at-the-border-effects-upon-the-midterms/816396.md?page=6)