# Fan or not, talk about what you hated in any version of Star Trek \[spoilers\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 9, 2005, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125 "2005-05-09T22:06:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![kingpengvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9dc877/32.png) [@kingpengvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kingpengvin)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/81 "2005-05-11T18:06:52Z")
The built in crutch they seemed to pull up when personal drama wasn’t enough. TOS: The Transporter malfunction. Several times teh Transporter would fail at the most importatnt moments. Sorry But If you have that as your main means of transportation to teh planet have better back ups and redundancies. TNG: Warp core breech. One time is exciting, two interesting but come on it seemed like at least three times a season the damn containment field was ready to drop. Sometimes it blew them up (fixed by a reset) but mostly it would be a computer count down until a last minute fix. Lazy writing. DS9: The Whole changing The Bajorians thing. When first introduced Bajorians seemed like a metaphor for the Occupied territories, then quickly shifted into something else akin to the Jews after the holocaust then they became like the medieval Catholic Church. The wild mood shifts of the Cardassians and Klingons over the series was odd too. I can write those off to the influence of the Founders VOY: Voyager. The whole series annoyed me save Tuvok I thought he did an excellent job at being a Vulcan. The Writers just used him poorly. Enterprise: The whole pandering wishy washiness of Bergma. If they had a vision they should have stuck to it. Instead, they kept toying with the show based on viewer complaints and ratings trying to keep viewers. First was to soften T’Pol because she didn’t give the viewers the warm Fuzzies, then the gratuitous panda. Then trying Story arcs and changing T’Pol again. then the relationships shifted. By the end you don’t know what the series is about or who these people are supposed to be. Just a pulpy mass. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/82 "2005-05-11T20:19:23Z")
> [@Diceman](#): > > **TAS:** no dislikes. The three-armed alien was cool (nice to see an alien character with a distinctly non-human appearance) and the catgirl was kinda cute. Just FYI, both of 'em are now featured recurring characters in the _Star Trek: New Frontier_ series of novels. M’ress even got accused of murdering a fellow officer at one point… :eek: ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/83 "2005-05-11T20:22:09Z")
> [@D\_Odds](#): > > Think of all the contingency fee lawyers salivating at an opportunity to go after the holodeck manufacturers. In the TNG premeir, we are told that all the lawyers were killed after WWIII. I don’t recall other mentions of the craft. ---
**Author:** ![QuizCustodet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7ba0ec/32.png) [@QuizCustodet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuizCustodet)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/84 "2005-05-11T20:52:46Z")
No strong feelings about TOS or TAS; the latter I’ve never seen at all, while the former I’ve only seen a scattering of (mostly good) episodes of. Similarly, I was unable to really get on-board with the ‘Star Trek staying still’ premise of DS9, so I didn’t watch it. Having heard good things about the Dominion war, I intend to catch it on DVD at some point. TNG: - The Warp ‘speed limit’, fortunately dropped after the episode it was first mentioned - Pretty much the whole of _Nemesis_. - Wesley as an acting Ensign - Wouldn’t have objected to a bit of Panda with Troi and Beverly Crusher. And Yar. What!?! :o VOY: - Neelix. I don’t think there was any episode to which he contributed positively. I wanted him to die in pain, but alas! 'Twas not to be. At least the Federation at large was spared him. - That thrice-darned Irish village. Earth to Voyager: TNG did the basic idea about sixteen times! It’s done! - All of the children. - As mentioned, the amazing appearing romance in the final episode or two. Chakotay and 7/9? What? - The excuses they had to come up with again and again for Janeway not to use the latest way of getting home. ENT: - Wasted promise is my biggest peeve here - there were some good episodes in seasons 1 or 2, but they didn’t appear frequently enough to save the whole thing. - No consistent characters. (Hoshi’s scared of space travel, but happy to sleep with the first alien who smiles at her nicely? Ya what?) ---
**Author:** ![HelloKitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ecccb3/32.png) [@HelloKitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HelloKitty)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/85 "2005-05-11T21:06:40Z")
I really can’t believe no one has mentioned this yet, but one of the things I hated most about Trek in general: The stupid way they killed of JTK in Generations!! Falling down a cliff? Come on, you could have done better than that! In no particular order here’s a list of the others: Major Kira (why did so many men fall in love with her? ICK!!!) Troi Any plot line concerning the Klingon empire (Strangely enough I do enjoy the character of Worf) Separating the saucer section The Nexus The Prime Directive Star Fleet Admirals (they’re either corrupt or incompetent) The Prophets Robin Curtis as Saavik I don’t have too many complaints, I enjoy TOS, TNG, DS9 and the movies as a whole. Never really got into Voyager or Enterprise. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/86 "2005-05-11T22:16:22Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Oh, yeah. Another thing…why do phasers have a range? I mean, you never see a bulkhead explode behind someone when Our Heroes miss a shot, do you? They will explode a rock in front of them, which lets the audience know they are being shot at, but you never see what happens to that beam after it misses. And how can phasers leave the Enterprise (TOS) going apart (\<) and hit the target coming together (\>)? Maaaaagic. Maybe you can explain to me why a phaser will disintegrate someone if you shoot them in the chest…or, specifically, the shirt. How come it doesn’t just disintegrate their shirt? Why does it get their shoes but not even scorch the deck under their feet? How can a phaser disintegrate someone and yet, when shooting at Monster of the Week it doesn’t even affect them? What’s magical about their skin? Arrrrrgh! -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/87 "2005-05-11T22:20:14Z")
> [@kingpengvin](#): > > First was to soften T’Pol because she didn’t give the viewers the warm Fuzzies, then the gratuitous panda. Then trying Story arcs and changing T’Pol again. then the relationships shifted. By the end you don’t know what the series is about or who these people are supposed to be. Just a pulpy mass. Hmm…I’ve gotta ask because I’ve seen it mentioned a couple times. I stopped watching Enterprise about a year ago. Panda? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![gotpasswords](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c57346/32.png) [@gotpasswords](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gotpasswords)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/88 "2005-05-11T22:54:40Z")
Panda’s just another name for “cheesecake” and usually in reference to Hoshi. As for the acronyms, I know TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY and ENT, but what’s TAA and TAS? ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/89 "2005-05-11T22:56:51Z")
Panda is a Trek Doperism. It’s the pandering to our base needs for sex and stuff. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/90 "2005-05-11T22:58:55Z")
TAA & TAS are the same show, the cartoons. Sometimes listed as The Animated Adventures or The Animated Series. ---
**Author:** ![Waenara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/50afbb/32.png) [@Waenara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waenara)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/91 "2005-05-11T23:27:49Z")
Most everything that annoys me has been mentioned already. General impressions: **TOS** - never watched more than one or two **TNG** - too much holodeck; too much Wesley Crusher; too much late 80s PC sensitivity - a counsellor on the bridge crew?! **DS9** - I really enjoyed some of the mid- and later-season episodes; Kira bugged me a lot; too many episodes about Bajoran religion; Quark’s brother annoyed the crap out of me **VOY** - pussified the Borg; make-up team has no creativity re: alien’s appearance **ENT** - watched two episodes - one very boring, the other had the TCW and even only watching less than one episode, it struck me as the stupidest idea ever associated with Star Trek **Worst episode ever** - Voyager - the ship gets trapped inside a black hole, and has to escape by breaking through the event horizon _which is depicted as a **physical** barrier_. Bar none, the worst science-related mistake I’ve ever seen in Trek. Not just gobbeldygook treknobabble, but outside stupidity. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/92 "2005-05-11T23:42:08Z")
> [@Waenara](#): > > **ENT** - watched two episodes - one very boring, the other had the TCW and even only watching less than one episode, it struck me as the stupidest idea ever associated with Star Trek Am I the only one who read the above and thought, “Tasty Coma Wife was on Enterprise?”? Oh, and Hoshi was much yummy. Hopefully this will push her into Playboy. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/93 "2005-05-12T00:23:04Z")
Am with **Diceman** on most of the issues in TOS thru VOY. Specially the TNG Season One standard plotline of “We’ll just stand here being morally superior and thus prevail”. Sheesh. Disagree on Q, though. Q was interesting _in TNG_. Unfortunately, like the Borg, they could not leave well enough alone and proceeded to ruin the whole idea in DS9 and Voyager. Must disagree with many of the prior posters on ENT and Panda. Panda **was** ENT’s redeeming quality. But it could not carry it alone so I said \*&^% it after noticing we would not have a decontamination every episode 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/94 "2005-05-12T01:36:49Z")
Did anyone else kind of puzzle over how there seems to be no new human cultural developments between the 20th and 24th centuries? I mean, I know you can’t expect the writers—especially a lot of _those_ writers—to create a 22nd century symphony to rival Beethoven just to use in the background in one episode, but it’d still pretty weird. (Maybe perfect utopias like the Federation just stifle artistic and cultural development, as an unfortunate side effect. :smack: ) Generations— •All the ship’s lights apparently burning out, and •The death of the Enterprise-D. They couldn’t just give it a _refit_ or anything, nooo…they _had_ to blow it up. :mad: Voyager— Kinda minor, but how they pretty much dropped the Caretaker and his mate after the premiere, and that one episode in season one. The Borg element in the finale was OK, I guess, but I was hoping for kind of some way of bringing the story “full circle.” ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/95 "2005-05-12T02:50:15Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#): > > Did anyone else kind of puzzle over how there seems to be no new human cultural developments between the 20th and 24th centuries? I mean, I know you can’t expect the writers—especially a lot of _those_ writers—to create a 22nd century symphony to rival Beethoven just to use in the background in one episode, but it’d still pretty weird. (Maybe perfect utopias like the Federation just stifle artistic and cultural development, as an unfortunate side effect. :smack: Now that you mention it, I did find it strange that everyone knows Lynyrd Skynyrd’s “Free Bird.” It’s already a fairly obscure song; you’d think that by the 24th Century, it would be totally forgotten. ---
**Author:** ![drewbert](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drewbert/32/15890_2.png) [@drewbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewbert)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/96 "2005-05-12T03:22:33Z")
> [@Waenara](#): > > **Worst episode ever** - Voyager - the ship gets trapped inside a black hole, and has to escape by breaking through the event horizon _which is depicted as a **physical** barrier_. Bar none, the worst science-related mistake I’ve ever seen in Trek. You missed [Threshold](http://groups-beta.google.com/group/rec.arts.startrek.current/browse_frm/thread/db4c118e5d316e2c/76ecc199738deb19?), eh? ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/97 "2005-05-12T03:32:50Z")
> [@drewbert](#): > > You missed [Threshold](http://groups-beta.google.com/group/rec.arts.startrek.current/browse_frm/thread/db4c118e5d316e2c/76ecc199738deb19?), eh? Fishing for a compliment? 😛 They should’ve cut to cartoon versions of themselves, like Don Knotts in _The Incredible Mr Limpet_. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/98 "2005-05-12T07:57:57Z")
> [@NoClueBoy](#): > > Fishing for a compliment? 😛 > > They should’ve cut to cartoon versions of themselves, like Don Knotts in _The Incredible Mr Limpet_. And _Limpet_’s science was not only better, but since at one point it involved top-secret Nazi weaponry, it was automatically cooler. On the plus side, Threshold did involve a Star Trek crewmember pulling out his own tongue, then knocking up the captain. (Which, unfortunately, _sounds_ a lot better than it actually was.) ---
**Author:** ![Waenara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/50afbb/32.png) [@Waenara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waenara)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/99 "2005-05-12T15:41:15Z")
> [@drewbert](#): > > You missed [Threshold](http://groups-beta.google.com/group/rec.arts.startrek.current/browse_frm/thread/db4c118e5d316e2c/76ecc199738deb19?), eh? Actually, I believe I did see _Threshold_, and I mostly remember it (despite efforts to the contrary). I think that the episode with the black hole was worse for making a basic science mistake. An event horizon is not a physical barrier, period. And they didn’t try to invoke any special conditions or treknobabble to make it one for this particular episode. _Threshold_ made my brain hurt just watching it, and it was completely stupid and ignored basic biological facts (i.e. "de-evolving (devolving?) into “lower” life forms - as if your current body “remembers” what creature it evolved from hundreds of millions of years ago). BUT, at least they tried to “explain” it with hand-waving about breaking Warp 10. It was still a stupid-ass show, but at least the writers tried somewhat. ---
**Author:** ![Petey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f1d935/32.png) [@Petey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Petey)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125/100 "2005-05-12T19:57:46Z")
DS9: The Marquis Why did half of Star Fleet defect? I guess we were supposed to sympathize with them and think they were fighting a noble cause. What was their cause anyway? That the Federation gave up territory to the Cardasians? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-or-not-talk-about-what-you-hated-in-any-version-of-star-trek-spoilers/303125.md?page=6)