# Fan support most disproportionate to team futility **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [April 27, 2019, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120 "2019-04-27T07:59:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/21 "2019-04-29T13:21:19Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > All bow and give homage to the futility of being a Minnesota Vikings fan. 1969 — yes, a long time. And yet in the 1970s they went to four Super Bowls, only to lose to the Chiefs, Dolphins, Steelers, and Raiders. The Purple People Eaters were strong but just couldn’t get over the hump. That Super Bowl IV loss to the Chiefs leads to a piece of trivia: Joe Kapp is still the only QB ever to start a Rose Bowl, Grey Cup, and Super Bowl. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/22 "2019-04-29T13:40:17Z")
Are we talking about pro teams alone? There are a LOT of absurdly devoted college fan bases, despite their teams never really accomplishing much. Look at Texas Tech’s football fans; they haven’t won a conference championship in 25 years (last SW conference championship was 1994, no Big 12 wins), and even their last conference championship was a booby prize, because the best team in the conference was ineligble, and thus the championship was shared with like 5 other teams or something f-ed up like that. ---
**Author:** ![notfrommensa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f14d63/32.png) [@notfrommensa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/notfrommensa)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/23 "2019-04-29T14:56:46Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > In 2016 when the Cubs won, here was the list of futility. Since then, both the Astros and Eagles have ended their droughts. > **Franchise League Last Championship** > Arizona Cardinals NFL 1947 (69 Years) > Cleveland Indians MLB 1948 (68 Years) > Sacramento Kings NBA 1951 (65 Years) > Detroit Lions NFL 1957 (59 Years) > Atlanta Hawks NBA 1958 (58 Years) > Philadelphia Eagles NFL 1960 (56 Years) > Texas Rangers MLB Never (55 Years) > Tennessee Titans NFL 1961 (55 Years) > Houston Astros MLB Never (54 Years) > San Diego Chargers NFL 1963 (53 Years) > Toronto Maple Leafs NHL 1967 (49 years) > > Source: [https://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/longest-active-championship-droughts-sports-cubs-snap-skid/](https://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/longest-active-championship-droughts-sports-cubs-snap-skid/) > So while the Leafs have waited a long time, the Cardinals, Indians, Kings, Lions, Hawks, Rangers, Titans, and Chargers have waited longer. And some of those teams have pretty rabid fans. Shouldn’t the Buffalo Bills belong on this list? Won the AFC Championship in 1965. A few Super Bills appearance in the 1990’s but no Championships. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/24 "2019-04-29T15:03:03Z")
> [@Busy\_Scissors](#): > > To an outsider, ice hockey seems to be a sport where a superstar would have disproportionate influence, given five outfield players and the speed and skill level of the game. Not really, no. (Non-goalies are usually collectively called “skaters.”) In hockey, the ability of a skater to influence the game is limited by the fact that 1. It is impossible for a skater to play more than 22-24 minutes out of 60, because their legs would fall off. Defencemen can play a little more, but not much. 2. No matter how awesome you are, professional hockey requires a team. Wayne Gretzky Himself with crap teammates would simply be a high scorer on a bad team, and even his effectiveness would be several curtailed. The great majority of goals are scored in offensive systems, not purely individual effort. 3. No matter how good you are, goaltenders can stop anyone. Wayne Gretzky was ludicrously great, like just absurdly, inhumanly awesome, but in 21 years his teams won the Stanley Cup four times… and didn’t win it 17 times. Hockey players can absolutely dominate the sport more than baseball or American football players, but not as much as basketball players. > [@](#): > > This would make the Leafs’ ineptitude truly staggering, given they haven’t cracked it in decades [I know there’s four lines, so the gameday rosters are actually bigger than most sports]. Is it the salary cap that makes this so challenging, that it’s just not possible to load up on the best of the best at more than 1 or 2 positions? The salary cap is a recent invention and the Leafs had been long frustrated before that. ---
**Author:** ![Chingon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chingon/32/17645_2.png) [@Chingon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chingon)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/25 "2019-04-29T15:07:52Z")
Iowa State ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/26 "2019-04-29T15:54:24Z")
I don’t think the Cleveland Indians really compare to the Browns. Sure, it’s been a long time since the Tribe has won the World Serious, but they’ve been there plenty of times, and they’re usually better than average. The Browns, though, have never even been to the Superb Owl, and are often one of the worst teams in the league. And even despite that, Browns fandom seems to be more fanatical than Indians. ---
**Author:** ![Wrenching\_Spanners](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecb155/32.png) [@Wrenching\_Spanners](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrenching_Spanners)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/27 "2019-04-29T17:20:32Z")
In English Football (soccer), Millwall Football Club surely has the highest fanaticism/success ratio. They’re a mid-level second tier team that generally make the news more for their fanatical supporters than for the team’s performance on the field. > **[Millwall F.C. | Supporters and hooliganism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millwall_F.C.#Supporters_and_hooliganism)** > > Millwall have averaged a gate close to 12,000 per home game over their 93 seasons in the Football League, while the club have spent the majority of that time yo-yoing back and forth between the second and third tiers of English football. Originally based in the East End of London, the club moved across the River Thames in 1910 to south east London and support is drawn from the surrounding areas. The club and fans have a historic association with football hooliganism, which came to The stigma of ... ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/28 "2019-04-29T18:28:55Z")
As said above, American college football is where you will find your answer. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/29 "2019-04-29T22:03:12Z")
> [@Yookeroo](#): > > They’ve won their division the last four years and have lackluster attendance. I’d say that disqualifies them. I agree. I’m a die-hard Indians fan myself but I would consider most of the fan base here “fair weather” if that. Not “I’ll pay attention if they’re over .500” but more like “I’ll pay attention if they get to the ALCS”. We had a good run in the 90s, selling out 455 consecutive games once our new stadium opened. People loved the Jim Thome and Omar Vizquel. But in the last 20 years Cleveland has sadly lost its passion and patience for baseball. Oh well tho. Makes for lots of cheap ticket options for me! ---
**Author:** ![ThisSpaceForRent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thisspaceforrent/32/345_2.png) [@ThisSpaceForRent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThisSpaceForRent)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/30 "2019-04-29T23:38:58Z")
I can not believe St Louis Blues haven’t come up in this thread. Entered the NHL w/ the 1967 expansion; doubling the league to 12 teams. The Blues made it to the final dance (Lord Stanley’s Cup) the first THREE years of their existence but never won a game in the finals. 51 years…I am still waiting. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2019, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/31 "2019-04-29T23:47:38Z")
> [@ThisSpaceForRent](#): > > I can not believe St Louis Blues haven’t come up in this thread. In fact, they already have. Check Defensive Indifference’s post #16. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2019, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/32 "2019-04-30T00:15:00Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > In fact, they already have. Check Defensive Indifference’s post #16. 🙂 And I even brought stats to my post. Harrumph! ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2019, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/33 "2019-04-30T01:41:04Z")
> [@notfrommensa](#): > > Shouldn’t the Buffalo Bills belong on this list? Won the AFC Championship in 1965. A few Super Bills appearance in the 1990’s but no Championships. Good point. And those Super Bowls were 4 straight. Quite an accomplishment, going to 4 straight, even though they never won it. They were a fun team to watch with Kelly at QB. Heck, I remember watching OJ run for them in the 70s, and he was fun to watch too. Joe Ferguson at QB, but they didn’t have much of a winning team then. ---
**Author:** ![ThisSpaceForRent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thisspaceforrent/32/345_2.png) [@ThisSpaceForRent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThisSpaceForRent)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2019, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/34 "2019-04-30T02:11:23Z")
> [@Defensive\_Indifference](#): > > The Leafs are probably the best answer, but deserving a mention are the St. Louis Blues, who went to the Stanley Cup finals the first three years of their existence (benefiting from being lumped in a conference with all the other expansion teams), got skunked all three times, and haven’t been back since. They don’t enjoy the widespread following of some of the premier teams, but locally they have a rabid fan base, and since 1999 they’ve averaged over 17,000 fans per game all but two seasons. They’ve put some exciting teams on the ice, but they haven’t rewarded their fans with much playoff success. aw jeeze…I have moments of being an idiot. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2019, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120/35 "2019-04-30T13:13:09Z")
> [@ThisSpaceForRent](#): > > I can not believe St Louis Blues haven’t come up in this thread. > > Entered the NHL w/ the 1967 expansion; doubling the league to 12 teams. > > The Blues made it to the final dance (Lord Stanley’s Cup) the first THREE years of their existence but never won a game in the finals. > > 51 years…I am still waiting. Of course, in the earkly wave of the NHL expansion you also have the Sabres and Canucks, who came along just three years later and have been equally hapless. I mean no disrespect to Blues fans, who are fine and upstanding people in a great sports city, but the slavish devotion of Leafs and Canucks fans surely surpasses them; this is Canada, after all, and those team have nary a Cup since then to show for it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fan-support-most-disproportionate-to-team-futility/833120.md?page=1)