# "Fantasy" style stories but without magic and monsters? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 6, 2009, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108 "2009-09-06T22:54:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2009, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/41 "2009-09-09T07:28:51Z")
S. M. Stirling’s _Change_ novels rock. Start 1st trilogy: Island in the Sea of Time Against the Tide of Years On the Oceans of Eternity 2nd trilogy: Dies the Fire The Protector’s War A Meeting at Corvallis 3rd quadrilogy(??): The Sunrise Lands The Scourge of God The Sword of the Lady The High King of Montival (due in 2010) I can highly recommend [Lamentation](http://www.amazon.com/Lamentation-Psalms-Isaak-Ken-Scholes/dp/0765321270) by Ken Scholes. Medieval setting of a sort, wise old man, no monsters, no magic. May or may not take place on our Earth; he is unclear about that. Also [The Steel Remains](http://www.amazon.com/Steel-Remains-Richard-K-Morgan/dp/0345493036/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252481258&sr=1-1) by Richard K. Morgan. Excellent and unique mythos and characters. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2009, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/42 "2009-09-09T13:43:04Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > It’s a great series, but it’s about a centuries long war between immortal/undead wizards, and a prophecy about a reincarnated savior who will finally end it. I’m hard pressed to think of many novels that are less like what the OP is looking for. Yeah, I love those books but I can’t believe that several people would suggest them as having light magic in them - sure, the day to day action of the books is mundane, but the _immortal sorcerors_ kind of play a big part. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2009, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/43 "2009-09-09T13:49:54Z")
Considering what Fawn in The Sharing Knife had already been through, I don’t think her marriage to Dag was weird or upsetting. To me, the books themselves would never be something I’d suggest as an answer to this OP. I think the magic in them is pretty pervasive. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2009, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/44 "2009-09-09T14:59:30Z")
> [@Push\_You\_Down](#): > > Like the title says- I’m looking for examples of traditional fantasy stories (y’know vaguely medieval setting, sword play, kings and barbarians, etc) but without any actual mythic fantasy things like magic or monsters. IIRC, Maxey Brooke did a couple of short stories for ELLERY QUEEN that get reprinted from time to time; it’s Camelot in the days of King Arthur, complete with Merlin casting spells and relaying mystical insights – by which I mean he’s just a really sharp guy using stage magic to make sure the knights in shining armor will think twice before going against the crown. ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2009, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/45 "2009-09-09T15:21:38Z")
> [@raspberry\_hunter](#): > > Honestly, though I adore Bujold like anything, and Curse of Chalion is one of my favorite books, Curse of Chalion and (much more so) Sharing Knife kind of annoy me because a much older man gets married to a girl just out of adolescence. Curse of Chalion isn’t so bad, because the man is (IIRC) in his 30’s, the woman has weathered enough fairly substantial political crises that she’s pretty much grown up, and they’re both nobility where these kinds of matches are common. Sharing Knife, however: the man is something like 100 years old (literally… he comes from a long-lived people) and the girl is a teenager. He’s been married (and widowed) before. That is a HUGE ick factor for me that really interferes with my enjoyment of the SK books. > > I wouldn’t call it pedophilia, though, just icky. As an aside, that’s one of the reasons that Buffy show squicked us out. ---
**Author:** ![Motorgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e36b37/32.png) [@Motorgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Motorgirl)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2009, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/46 "2009-09-09T15:30:46Z")
> [@Apollyon](#): > > [snip]Don’t take that to mean (from me at least) that we’re trying to persuade you that a little bit of magic is what you need, rather trying to judge / refine your requirements. Some people might say “no magic” and mean no wizards with fireballs but think some prophecy was OK, etc… basically that they don’t want the sort of fantasy where magic is used to _Deus Ex_ out of difficult plots elements, but is alright if incidental to the main storyline… that sort of thing. I asked for something along these lines a few years ago: > **[Recommend some Fantasy novels for me?](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=336892)** > > I’m looking for some new fantasy novels to read. By “new” I just mean not yet read by me. Not necessarily newly published. The problem is that I have some specific things I don’t like, which might make it hard to find books that I like. I like... It might be worth reading the thread if you don’t mind a little magic. I will re-read the thread and let you know which of the books I ended up liking, if you think that will help. ---
**Author:** ![raspberry\_hunter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@raspberry\_hunter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raspberry_hunter)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2009, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/47 "2009-09-09T15:55:03Z")
I thought of another one! Cynthia Voight’s Kingdom series, especially Jackaroo and Wings of a Falcon – nobility, peasants, dashing heros, adventures, and not a single piece of magic (or prophecy or gods or what-have-you) that I can recall in the whole thing. > [@Miller](#): > > Fifty five, actually. Still a hell of an age difference, but nothing at all like a hundred years. Thanks for the correction, and my apologies – been a while since I read them, and I was probably conflating a bit with Twilight, which I finally read recently (and which _really_ squicks me out that way). **Other Waldo Pepper** , I loved those Merlin stories! I had completely forgotten about them. ---
**Author:** ![Mervyn\_Pumpkinhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3ab097/32.png) [@Mervyn\_Pumpkinhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mervyn_Pumpkinhead)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2009, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/48 "2009-09-12T00:45:51Z")
I just read this one by K.J. Parker, and it is very good yet, again, sad. [http://www.amazon.com/Purple-Black-K-J-Parker/dp/159606241X/ref=sr\_1\_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252716263&sr=1-1](http://www.amazon.com/Purple-Black-K-J-Parker/dp/159606241X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252716263&sr=1-1) ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2009, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/49 "2009-09-12T00:56:49Z")
> [@Apollyon](#): > > Along with the killer eels, machine that drains life and the holocaust cloak, I’d characterize it as low magic and monsters, but not zero of either. In the book, Buttercup is menaced by sharks, not giant eels. And IIRC, in neither the book nor the movie is it suggested that the torture machine or holocaust cloak are magical. ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2009, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/50 "2009-09-13T22:23:44Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > In the book, Buttercup is menaced by sharks, not giant eels. And IIRC, in neither the book nor the movie is it suggested that the torture machine or holocaust cloak are magical. Ah, haven’t read the book. In the movie at least the torture machine is shown to be water wheel powered and claimed to suck out years of life / life-force… umm… can I build one of those at my place without magic? 🙂 The cloak may have just been fire-proof and doused in accelerant. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2009, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/51 "2009-09-14T07:24:51Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > 3rd **quadrilogy** (??): > > The Sunrise Lands > The Scourge of God > The Sword of the Lady > The High King of Montival (due in 2010) Tetralogy. ---
**Author:** ![nicole1912](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9de0a6/32.png) [@nicole1912](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nicole1912)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2009, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/52 "2009-09-14T07:56:50Z")
The first Kushiel trilogy by Jacqueline Carey (the second set of books was an abomination that I’m working hard to forget) might be sort of what you’re looking for. It’s got gods, but no magic spells or wizards or anything like that that I can remember, set in an alternate medieval Europe. The first three books ([Kushiel’s Dart](http://www.amazon.co.uk/Kushiels-Dart-Jacqueline-Carey/dp/0765342987/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252914799&sr=1-5), [Kushiel’s Chosen](http://www.amazon.co.uk/Kushiels-Chosen-Jacqueline-Carey/dp/0330412779/ref=tag_dpp_lp_edpp_img_in) and [Kushiel’s Avatar](http://www.amazon.co.uk/Kushiels-Avatar-Jacqueline-Carey/dp/0330420011/ref=pd_sim_b_1)) have very good character development, I liked them and still reread them on occasion. ---
**Author:** ![ColdPhoenix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@ColdPhoenix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ColdPhoenix)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2009, 9:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108/53 "2009-09-14T09:44:13Z")
The Tales of the Otori mostly fit the bill. Read the original trilogy first. There is a group called the tribe that have certain “skills” but they’re nothing like fireballs etc. > **[Tales of the Otori](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tales_of_the_Otori)** > > Tales of the Otori is a series of historical fantasy novels by Gillian Rubinstein, writing under the pen name Lian Hearn, set in a fictional world based on feudal Japan. The series initially consisted of a trilogy: Across the Nightingale Floor (2002), Grass for His Pillow (2003), and Brilliance of the Moon (2004). It was followed in 2006 by a sequel, The Harsh Cry of the Heron, and in 2007 by a prequel, Heaven's Net is Wide. In 2020, two new books were published in a sequel series called Chil... [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fantasy-style-stories-but-without-magic-and-monsters/509108.md?page=2)