# Farenheit 9/11 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 26, 2004, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farenheit-9-11/252292 "2004-06-26T07:20:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2004, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farenheit-9-11/252292/81 "2004-07-06T21:57:52Z")
[QUOTE=rjung] Roger Ebert disagrees.[/QUOTE] \*_pssst. So do I._ ---
**Author:** ![Seven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Seven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Seven)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farenheit-9-11/252292/82 "2004-07-07T00:27:28Z")
> [@Snakespirit](#): > > Gonna plunk down $9 to make Mike richer? > > Check out [this site](http://www.davekopel.com/Terror/Fiftysix-Deceits-in-Fahrenheit-911.htm) first. It’s a relatively coherent view on some of the shortcomings of Mikey’s latest fuckumentary… That article is reaching. I’m not going to pick it apart, but I found this somewhat funny. > [@](#): > > Deceit 36 > > Moore mocks Attorney General John Ashcroft by pointing out that Ashcroft once lost a Senate race in Missouri to a man who had died three weeks earlier. ?Voters preferred the dead guy,? Moore says, delivering one of the film?s biggest laugh lines. > > ``` > It?s a cheap shot. When voters in Missouri cast their ballots for the dead man, Mel Carnahan, they knew they were really voting for Carnahan?s very much alive widow, Jean. The Democratic governor of Missouri had vowed to appoint Jean to the job if Mel won. > > ``` Moore could have said “Voters preferred the dead guy” or the **truth** (according to that article) “Voters preferred the dead guys wife who wasn’t even running for office”. Either way, it showed people DIDN’T want Ashcroft. Either way, it’s funny. I saw the film,. twice. I really liked how Moore handled the Sept 11th scenes. Everyone who owns a television has seen what happened on Sept 11th. It’s been played and replayed. I think it was far more effective and powerful to just run the audio, then the reactions and scattered papers. Of all the bits I’ve seen on Sept 11th, I think that was the most tastefully done. I think Moore went easy on Bush to tell the truth. He could have shown the clip of Bush saying he was going after OBL at all costs and wouldn’t stop until he is caught (the whole “Dead or Alive” business) and mirror that with the one he did use -where Bush says he hasn’t given him much thought. In all, I think the movie is important. I think it shows people a side that might not have known. My wife didn’t know about the protests on Bush’s inauguration day. The mainstream media kind of glossed over that one. I read a review that said “none of this is news for those paying attention”. My mother, who voted for Bush, admits herself she hasn’t really been paying attention. After watching this movie perhaps she will start. I’m not saying this movie will change her vote or should change her vote. But it might inspire her to ask a few questions before voting for anyone. ---
**Author:** ![voguevixen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5ac83/32.png) [@voguevixen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voguevixen)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farenheit-9-11/252292/83 "2004-07-07T00:37:21Z")
> [@RTA](#): > > Another thing that bothered me was while discussing Bush’s “military service”, we hear the riff from “Cocaine”. I feel that if you are going to advance the idea that Bush used to be a cokehead - which, let’s be perfectly clear, I believe is far, far more possible than not - one should at least support it just a little, even with just the existing circumstantial evidence. I agree. That falls under the category of “cheap shot” to me. I was disappointed because I want to be able to point to to the footage of people being stupid and say “see? They’re being stupid!” Something like that is obviously (at this point) unverifiable. There was a lot of speculation that frustrated me because there is so much FACT to go on. Why waste time being juvinile? ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farenheit-9-11/252292/84 "2004-07-07T00:39:01Z")
It’s interesting that none of the people who call Moore a liar have ever been able to back it up conclusively. In his entire career as a filmmaker, Moore has been sued exactly once. And he won. Before F9/11 was released, he handed it over to a bunch of lawyers and a team of professional factcheckers and told them to tear it apart, to find anything in the film that wasn’t accurate. The released film is the one that went through that process. ---
**Author:** ![Seven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Seven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Seven)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farenheit-9-11/252292/85 "2004-07-07T02:09:42Z")
I chuckled a bit at the Cocaine riff, but I think I was the only person in the hall who got the joke. I know the teeny-bopper next to my wife who checked her cell phone text messages four times during the film didn’t get the reference. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farenheit-9-11/252292/86 "2004-07-07T14:59:13Z")
I think the snarky tone, even the “Cocaine” riff, was entirely appropriate. Ridicule is a powerful political tool–Mark Twain, SNL–and is an entirely valid form of criticism. Isn’t one of the greatest WWII films _The Great Dictator_? A film that’s nothing more than an extended skit on how ridiculous Hitler was? ---
**Author:** ![Trunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/87869e/32.png) [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farenheit-9-11/252292/87 "2004-07-07T15:22:45Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > The audience is too stupid to give the facts their own interpretation, or to seek out other sources of information, so we should indulge that stupidity and not give them any information that will lead to them looking something up. that’s what funny (and ironic) about a lot of the detractors. without getting too “straw man-ish” here, you’ll hear someone say, “Moore showed Bush sitting in the classroom for 7 minutes after being told about the second plane implying he was a complete idiot who didn’t know what to do.” It’s like when the cops ask a guy, “where were you on July 2nd?” and the guy goes, “I wasn’t no where near that dumpster behind the Tastee Freez.” There is a lot presented objectively in this movie that the Bush supporters read as Moore slamming him. Maybe that’s because it’s is presented in a subjective framework, but in effect the supporters are basically making Moore’s case for him – that is, reading bush buffoonery into otherwise objective scenes. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farenheit-9-11/252292/88 "2004-07-07T15:24:10Z")
> [@robgruver](#): > > I look forward to getting the DVD. Hopefully the comentary tracks will be VERY informative. I dunno. BFC doesn’t have a commentary track, other than one with Moore’s office staff and production crew. I do imagine it’ll be chock full of other information, and might have (hopefully) an addendum to include info from the 9/11 hearings that wrapped up after production. ---
**Author:** ![BrattiAtti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c57346/32.png) [@BrattiAtti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrattiAtti)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farenheit-9-11/252292/89 "2004-07-07T18:56:41Z")
I enjoyed this movie, mostly because it sparked hours worth of conversation between my sister and me. I thought the “what was he thinking” crap when showing Bush reading with the kids was distasteful. I, too, think the audio was a great way to cover 9/11’s attacks. The child with its arm (leg? short memory span here) blown open made me cringe, and the woman screaming to Allah brought tears to my eyes. I’m thankful for the comedic relief scattered throughout the movie. I would’ve had one hell of a tension headache if I hadn’t been laughing once in a while. My mom (sometimes a reliable source ;)) says that MM wishes this movie not to be thought of as a documentary, but more as an opinionated view of the “other side”. I applaud him for taking advantage of his rights as an American, being able to get away with bashing the government so thoroughly. I will be seeing this again when it hits theaters here (I traveled 190 miles to see it two weeks ago), and I probably will cry, laugh, and cringe as much as I did then. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farenheit-9-11/252292.md?page=4)