# Farm animal breeding. **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 25, 2010, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909 "2010-11-25T18:54:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/21 "2010-11-26T03:57:10Z")
Apropos of nothing: > [@John Steinbeck](#): > > Minds me of a story they tell about Willy Feeley when he was a young fella. Willy was bashful, awful bashful. Well, one day he takes a heifer over to Graves’ bull. Ever’body was out but Elsie Graves, and Elsie wasn’t bashful at all. Willy, he stood there turnin’ red an’ he couldn’t even talk. Elsie says, ‘I know what you come for; the bull’s out in back a the barn.’ Well, they took the heifer out there an’ Willy an’ Elsie sat on the fence to watch. Purty soon Willy got feelin’ purty fly. Elsie looks over an’ says, like she don’t know, ‘What’s a matter, Willy?’ Willy’s so randy, he can’t hardly set still. ‘By God,’ he says, ‘by God, I wisht I was a-doin’ that!’ Elsie says, ‘Why not, Willy? It’s your heifer.’ > > — The Grapes of Wrath ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/22 "2010-11-26T04:03:08Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > Darn! the way I read that, I thought the link was going to go to a pic of equine S&M. :mad: I will admit to a pretty weak segue. Both sentences referred to the perils of live breeding. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/23 "2010-11-26T04:04:26Z")
I’ve always heard that the Scots and the Kiwis do some good work with sheep. ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/24 "2010-11-26T04:28:21Z")
> [@mangeorge](#): > > How important is the mare’s bloodline? I mean a mare almost went undefeated up to lately. I think it was the Breeders Cup where she finally lost. Will she be bred with a champion stallion over another mare? > It seems like nobody talks about the moms. Mares can be very important. Secretariat was known more for being a sire of quality broodmares, than money winning colts. The output of a mare is even more limited than that of a stallion. It takes 11 months to make a horse, so a mare might have 15 foals in her, in her life time. By comparison, an in-demand stallion, for example Alydar, even with the live cover rules, sired thousands of horses in his lfetime. So the impact to racing as a whole is somewhat less from even a great mare. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/25 "2010-11-26T04:42:32Z")
> [@mangeorge](#): > > I think there’s a similar situation for pigs, but I don’t know for sure. I might have gotten that idea because a pig’s wee wee is shaped kind of like a corkscrew. I’ve never seen pigs bred, only slaughterd. They didn’t like it. There’s a chapter on pig AI in Mary Roach’s book, [Bonk: The Curious Coupling of Science and Sex.](http://www.amazon.com/Bonk-Curious-Coupling-Science-Sex/dp/0393064646) The process is very involved and the chapter is hilarious. ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/26 "2010-11-26T04:55:02Z")
> [@BaneSidhe](#): > > Mare’s bloodlines are important and I’ve never understood why people put the stallion’s bloodlines over the mares. Even after being a horseperson for most of my life, I’ve never quite got it. Over her stud life, as thoroughbreds don’t allow embryo transfer, a mare will have maybe 10 foals and of those maybe 1/3rd will get to see the track. A select shuttle stallion will cover 10 times or more each season. At the same conversion rate, after a generation the influence of the stallion far outweighs that of the mares. If breeding the fastest with the fastest beget the fastest, then horse wouldn’t be the lottery that it is. They are a whole lot better trained, and run on faster tracks, but aren’t necessarily (innately) that much faster. ---
**Author:** ![Pullet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Pullet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pullet)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/27 "2010-11-26T06:50:42Z")
Among poultry, only Turkeys are artificially inseminated. Chickens, ducks, squab, pheasant, quail: all natural bred. ---
**Author:** ![psychonaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/psychonaut/32/4655_2.png) [@psychonaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/psychonaut)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/28 "2010-11-26T08:46:05Z")
I’d like to see someone try to artificially inseminate a bee. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 9:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/29 "2010-11-26T09:37:49Z")
> [@BaneSidhe](#): > > Mare’s bloodlines are important and I’ve never understood why people put the stallion’s bloodlines over the mares. Even after being a horseperson for most of my life, I’ve never quite got it. Genetically, each parent contributes 50%. But the foal is constantly with the mare for the first 6 months or more, and so gets much of its temperament & personality from the mare. So for most horses, the dam contributes MORE than the sire. Perhaps not as important for thoroughbreds, where only speed counts, but true for most riding & driving breeds. But stallions bloodlines are discussed more because of quantity. A mare can produce 15-20 offspring over her whole breeding lifespan. Top stallions might sire that many foals every single year, for 20 years or so. Secretariat produced 680 foals, over a 16 year breeding lifetime – over 42.5 per year average. So a stallion can have a much greater effect on a breed than any mare. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 9:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/30 "2010-11-26T09:55:15Z")
> [@mangeorge](#): > > But in demand sires don’t come (ahem) cheap. Isn’t a huge consideration for even the top breeders? Even top sires only promise a slight edge over “lesser” ones. Or no? In addition to what everyone else said, a top stallion’s owner is going to want to breed that horse to the best mares available because stallions are judged by their get as well as their own successes. So, if a winning stallion covers a lot of quality mares, but the resulting foals aren’t anything to write home about, then over the years that stallion is going to be less popular and in demand for breeding. And, of course, if he covers mediocre mares, the chances of one of them throwing a winning foal is even less likely. A responsible stud owner will try to make sure, too, that the mares his stallion covers don’t have the same flaws as the boy does. Let’s face it, every animal has flaws, or at least some areas that are weaker than others. So if a stallion has particularly weak “ankles”, for instance, his owner should look for mares that have at least average ankles, and strong ankles would be even better. ---
**Author:** ![C.Montgomery\_Burns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecd19e/32.png) [@C.Montgomery\_Burns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C.Montgomery_Burns)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/31 "2010-11-26T16:50:41Z")
Large sow units are nearly all AI these days. For one thing, it’s much easier to pass on desirable genetic traits using AI. One boar’s semen can be used to breed an entire herd, for one thing. Another big advantage to AI is that the entire breeding herd can have their estrus cycles synchronized, and be bred all at the same time. That way, pigs are all born at the same time, and their growth rate will be much more consistent. I’m sure this is grossly oversimplified, but those are some of the big reasons it’s done. Natural breeding is not feasible for units of 10,000. ---
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/32 "2010-11-26T17:21:01Z")
A cousin of mine has a herd of beef cattle that takes care of themselves all year round. He just culls it every now and then. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2010, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/33 "2010-11-26T18:02:13Z")
50 years ago, I witnessed an artificial insemination of one of the cows in my uncle’s modest dairy farm. I’m pretty sure its the norm today. I recall perusing the stats on the bulls at that time showing milk production of their dams or their offspring. Can’t remember which or both. A high producing cow is a big edge, and if the bull is worth anything, the owner doesn’t need to transport it around. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2010, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/34 "2010-11-27T23:07:38Z")
I can’t speak for the really big operations, but the ranchers around here (Montana, USA) mostly turn the bulls loose with the cows. There is some AI going on, but it’s not as prevalent as natural breeding. When I had cattle, I’d just buy a bull calf, let him do his job when he was old enough, and then put him in the freezer. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/35 "2010-11-28T00:06:34Z")
[quote=“Gary “Wombat” Robson, post:34, topic:561909”] I can’t speak for the really big operations, but the ranchers around here (Montana, USA) mostly turn the bulls loose with the cows. There is some AI going on, but it’s not as prevalent as natural breeding. When I had cattle, I’d just buy a bull calf, let him do his job when he was old enough, and then put him in the freezer. [/QUOTE] I always thought steers produced much better meat than bulls. I also thought that steers produced better meat tham cows, but read somewhere that MacDonalds requires a certain perscentage of cow meat in their burgers which is why their meat just melts away in your mouth. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/36 "2010-11-28T00:08:23Z")
[quote=“Gary “Wombat” Robson, post:34, topic:561909”] I can’t speak for the really big operations, but the ranchers around here (Montana, USA) mostly turn the bulls loose with the cows. There is some AI going on, but it’s not as prevalent as natural breeding. When I had cattle, I’d just buy a bull calf, let him do his job when he was old enough, and then put him in the freezer. [/QUOTE] Oh yeah? So you guys got cows and stuff up there, huh? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![yabob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yabob/32/2821_2.png) [@yabob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yabob)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/37 "2010-11-28T00:53:02Z")
We went around the relative scarcity of bulls on most dairy operations, and the use of “retired” milk cows in McDonald’s hamburger a while back: > **[Holstein Cattle in "City Slickers"](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=576400)** > > On the Wikipedia page for the movie Temple Grandin, the real Temple Grandin was concerned about the realism of the cattle dip scenes in that movie: I don’t know anything about cattle, so edumacate me. Why was it stupid to have Holstein cattle in... Yeah, the dairy farmers I grew up around used AI. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/38 "2010-11-28T01:43:16Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > I always thought steers produced much better meat than bulls. Yes, but they are lousy at impregnating the herd! More seriously, even if steers produce better meat than bulls, if a now-useless bull is what you’ve got, I rather suspect that bullburgers are plenty edible. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/39 "2010-11-28T02:08:31Z")
I remember reading that cattlemen cut the horns off longhorns to make then less mean. That was back in the day, so maybe “horns” was a metaphor (wrong word) for “balls”. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909/40 "2010-11-28T02:44:33Z")
> [@mangeorge](#): > > I remember reading that cattlemen cut the horns off longhorns to make then less mean. That was back in the day, so maybe “horns” was a metaphor (wrong word) for “balls”. Euphemism. (right word ;)) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/farm-animal-breeding/561909.md?page=3)