# Fast Food Hoax (strip searches) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 11, 2005, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713 "2005-10-11T04:18:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/61 "2005-10-12T15:38:04Z")
> [@Mtgman](#): > > With all due respect, this is exactly why the Milgram experiment was so important. It shows that abuse of authority carries far deeper ramifications than at the level of the abuser. This trust you, the vast majority of Milgram’s test subjects, and even myself place in the “experimenter” who “knows what they’re doing” is exactly what those who wish to abuse their authority rely on. I think what Balthisar is pissed off about is that the abuser here had no authority, this was not an expriment, and thus does not really replicate Milgram. In Milgram, you have a person identified as the experimenter by the person or persons running the experiment, right? It isn’t someone who just walked in off the street, he’s specifically identified as an authority figure. The abuser in this case isn’t a cop, or even a person who shows up in a phony cop uniform with a badge, it’s just some dude on the phone. What level of authority do you give to someone who calls you up out of the blue? The level of pliability and gullibility that these people show is so bizarre as to make me think (or hope?) that there is more going on than meets the eye. I could see holding on to someone until the police show up, but a strip search, kissing, oral sex, WTF? What someone will do under controlled experimental conditions when directed by a trusted authority figure should have little to do with what that same person will do in the real world when directed by an unknown person over the phone. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/62 "2005-10-12T15:46:18Z")
> [@OleOneEye](#): > > I don’t think people obey questionable orders like this because they’re stupid; they do it because they’re afraid of losing their measly $6.35 an hour and ending up out on the street. In the article it says the girl took the job because her mother lost hers, so someone else needs her to stay employed. Yep. Notice she said, when it was revealed to be a hoax, not, “How could you?” or “I’m suing!” but “Do I still have to come in tomorrow?” ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/63 "2005-10-12T16:07:42Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > Yes, it is wrong to exploit people because they are stupid. Nobody is saying that the caller is an OK guy. But it is wrong to be that stupid and to be allowed to serve food to the public. > > Gee, the hamburger fell on the floor. I didn’t know it was wrong to pick it up and serve it anyway. > My manager told me to go ahead and serve the meat that had past it’s expiration date and smelled funny. I just did as I was told. > But to me the most galling thing in the article was the level of pity for the caller. OK, he’s the accused caller but the whole, “he really wanted to be a cop” thing just creeps me out. You know this guy would be pulling over girls and forcing blow jobs to get out of a ticket every night. Yeah, but I’d think one might have the baseline intelligence to work at Mikey D’s and still be too stupid–naive really–to see through this trick. And now that the Onion’s archives are back on line, I can link to [This classic article](http://www.theonion.com/content/node/28779) ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/64 "2005-10-12T16:17:48Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > I I could see holding on to someone until the police show up, but a strip search, kissing, oral sex, WTF? Even granting the strip search made sense, and even granting the kissing made sense (the caller apparently told Nix that it would reveal if she had something hidden in her mouth), I have to say that the oral copulation is completely mysterious. What do you possibly say over the phone to justify that act?? ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/65 "2005-10-12T16:26:20Z")
> [@Wikipedia article on the Milgram Experiment](#): > > Subjects were recruited via a newspaper ad and direct mail solicitation to participate in a “study of memory” at Yale. (The experiments themselves took place in two rooms in the basement of Linsly-Chittenden Hall, on the university’s Old Campus.) The experiment was advertised as taking one hour, for which those responding would be paid $4.50. A mailing or a newspaper ad for one hour and around five bucks(roughly $18.71 in 2005 dollars) in compensation. Exactly how seriously should someone take this “experiment”? Should someone deliver what they had been told could be a lethal dose of electric shock to a screaming “subject” when they had only signed up for an hour of time and twenty bucks of cash? What level of authority do you give someone who junk-mailed you an offer to participate in an hour-long “study” for $20? Is the authority established by so tenuous a connection so much greater than an established boss-employee relationship? I’d like to think I’d tell an experimenter to fuck themselves and keep their twenty bucks. An hour and 20 bucks holds no power over me. My boss, on the other hand, has authority over the job I need to feed and clothe my family. That is by far a more prominent authority figure in my life than some random survey-taker who has offered me $20. Even though they are a much larger authority figure in my life than some random experimenter would be I’d like to think I’d tell my boss to go to hell before I’d fry someone for them. It should be noted that Milgram also controlled for “the prestige of Yale” by setting up experiments in some random storefront with a made-up research group’s name. The results were not significantly different. Even if someone trusts “an experimenter at Yale” they apparently trusted “random experimenter from company I’ve never heard of” just as much. Police have a lot of authority. If one accepts the caller as a legitimate officer then the socially conditioned deference to authority kicks in. Obviously the employee recognizes the boss as an authority figure. So the important part is to get the manager to buy you as an officer, the rest of the chain is already established. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/66 "2005-10-12T17:38:44Z")
My Hubby thinks what it really proves is at least a third of us are sadists who’d love to inflict pain and humiliation on random strangers, given the chance. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/67 "2005-10-12T18:08:02Z")
From Monty Python’s _The Life of Brian_: Brian: “You don’t have to do this! You don’t have to take orders!” Roman soldier tying Brian to cross: “I _like_ orders!” > [@fessie](#): > > My Hubby thinks what it really proves is at least a third of us are sadists who’d love to inflict pain and humiliation on random strangers, given the chance. ---
**Author:** ![Geobabe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/geobabe/32/3908_2.png) [@Geobabe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Geobabe)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/68 "2005-10-12T18:21:25Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Even granting the strip search made sense, and even granting the kissing made sense (the caller apparently told Nix that it would reveal if she had something hidden in her mouth), I have to say that the oral copulation is completely mysterious. What do you possibly say over the phone to justify that act?? That part has me mystified, too. The article says the caller had a reasonable explanation for every step along the way, but doesn’t say what he came up with for that one, and I can’t imagine what he could have. Bizarre. ---
**Author:** ![Yeticus\_Rex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a698b9/32.png) [@Yeticus\_Rex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yeticus_Rex)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/69 "2005-10-12T18:30:48Z")
> [@zagloba](#): > > Nitpick – this was a McDonalds company owned store, not a franchise. Ok, then…The manager and the assistant managers (if they were informed by the manager) are to blame. Anybody in a supervisory role MUST look out for the safety and welfare of their subordinates. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Corrado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a88e4f/32.png) [@John\_Corrado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Corrado)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/70 "2005-10-12T18:49:30Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > The abuser in this case isn’t a cop, or even a person who shows up in a phony cop uniform with a badge, it’s just some dude on the phone. What level of authority do you give to someone who calls you up out of the blue? The level of pliability and gullibility that these people show is so bizarre as to make me think (or hope?) that there is more going on than meets the eye. But keep in mind- the person was not called out of the blue. The “cop” included in his conversation things such as the names of fellow officers (who were, in fact, local cops familiar to the restaurant), the names of management, etc. … in other words, he laid a groundwork of trust. I don’t know where you work or what you do, but let’s assume you’re an office drone in BigCompany, your boss is Dave Jenkins, and the MidQuarter Review is coming up so everyone’s in a frazzle. Someone calls your desk and says, “Hey, Cheesesteak, this is Tom down in Accounting. Dave promised my boss John those Q3 reports so we can have them ready for the MQ Review. Can you e-mail me a copy? Oh, and our main server is down, so you’ll have to send it to [TJones@BigCompany2.com](mailto:TJones@BigCompany2.com) instead of the regular [BigCompany.com](http://BigCompany.com) address.” Is that something that raises your hackles and you immediately start interrogating him, your boss, or the Accounting Department to confirm? Or, given that he knows your boss, a meeting your boss was at, the big review coming up, the name of a manager in Accounting, etc., do you assume he’s on the up-and-up and just send him the damned report so you can get back to your real job? ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/71 "2005-10-12T19:14:43Z")
> [@John Corrado](#): > > But keep in mind- the person was not called out of the blue. The “cop” included in his conversation things such as the names of fellow officers (who were, in fact, local cops familiar to the restaurant), the names of management, etc. … in other words, he laid a groundwork of trust. > I don’t know where you work or what you do, but let’s assume you’re an office drone in BigCompany, your boss is Dave Jenkins, and the MidQuarter Review is coming up so everyone’s in a frazzle. Someone calls your desk and says, “Hey, Cheesesteak, this is Tom down in Accounting. Dave promised my boss John those Q3 reports so we can have them ready for the MQ Review. Can you e-mail me a copy? Oh, and our main server is down, so you’ll have to send it to [TJones@BigCompany2.com](mailto:TJones@BigCompany2.com) instead of the regular [BigCompany.com](http://BigCompany.com) address.” > > Is that something that raises your hackles and you immediately start interrogating him, your boss, or the Accounting Department to confirm? Or, given that he knows your boss, a meeting your boss was at, the big review coming up, the name of a manager in Accounting, etc., do you assume he’s on the up-and-up and just send him the damned report so you can get back to your real job? Well if he adds “Meet my assistant whom you have never seen at my temporary office in the bathroom behind the bus station and blow him before you turn in those TPS reports” I would be a little suspiscious. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/72 "2005-10-12T19:44:34Z")
> [@Geobabe](#): > > That part has me mystified, too. The article says the caller had a reasonable explanation for every step along the way, but doesn’t say what he came up with for that one, and I can’t imagine what he could have. Bizarre. The key to every successful con is to keep things moving fast enough so that the mark never really has time to stop and think about what’s happening. But the more off-kilter the request, the more likely you’ll trigger the “Wait, this ain’t right,” response. How that never happened here with that particular request is… well, it is amazing. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/73 "2005-10-12T19:56:28Z")
> [@John Corrado](#): > > Is that something that raises your hackles and you immediately start interrogating him, your boss, or the Accounting Department to confirm? Or, given that he knows your boss, a meeting your boss was at, the big review coming up, the name of a manager in Accounting, etc., do you assume he’s on the up-and-up and just send him the damned report so you can get back to your real job? Honestly, it would. I work with sensitive data from time to time, nothing earth shattering, but it could be useful for the competition to get their hands on. If someone I don’t know asks me for information, I make damn sure that someone I DO know vouches for them, and their need to know, or I look them up on our internal directory and verify their identity that way. I do occasionally get requests from people I’ve never worked with before, they don’t get jack until I know they are in a job position that needs the information. And forget a non-corporate email, though that could just be my company, the email is very reliable. I’ve been here 8 years, and haven’t gone outside the company’s email even once. This is with stupid corporate information… screw detaining a young girl, strip searching her and sticking my cock in her mouth. Over a stolen purse? I am never going to understand how a store manager and an adult man can be fooled into doing these horrible things. At some point somebody needed to tell the caller to get bent and that the girl will be waiting for them to show up in a squad car. Do these people even have an iota of common sense? Do they not watch crime dramas on TV? Who has ever heard of the cops asking regular folks to do searches of criminals? Maybe this is just a matter of 1,000 stores hanging up on you and 1 going along with it, but it still boggles the mind. ---
**Author:** ![Caffeine.addict](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f475e1/32.png) [@Caffeine.addict](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caffeine.addict)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/74 "2005-10-12T20:06:59Z")
Not to mention, that even if it was a cop, he wouldn’t be able to strip search her without a warrant, let alone the rest of what was done. Don’t these people watch Law and Order? ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/75 "2005-10-12T20:12:10Z")
> [@OldOneEye](#): > > I don’t think people obey questionable orders like this because they’re stupid; they do it because they’re afraid of losing their measly $6.35 an hour and ending up out on the street. In the article it says the girl took the job because her mother lost hers, so someone else needs her to stay employed. > [@Guinastasia](#): > > Yep. Notice she said, when it was revealed to be a hoax, not, “How could you?” or “I’m suing!” but “Do I still have to come in tomorrow?” No. The article said that the ass manager told her she didn’t have to come in tomorow and that she could take off as much time as needed. The girl didn’t go back to work there. I doubt that her mother let her. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/76 "2005-10-12T20:35:22Z")
> [@Yeticus Rex](#): > > Employee manuals in fine print? Are you serious? Making up anything and everything to “rail against ‘THE MAN’”…eh, **EC**? > > When we train employees, they take turns reading all the material with us there to make sure they read it, comprehend it, and ask any questions about it. HELLO?!? YOU WANT THEM TO KNOW THIS STUFF! This would help the company RETAIN profits which would be in the corporation’s best interest. If McDonalds corporate is guilty of anything, it’s lack of communication through non-compliance of it’s franchise managers…not, “You didn’t read the fine print.” Oh, and maybe paying low wages tends to only attract marginal employees would be another issue. > > But management on the franchise level is to blame here ultimately. Let’s see, a lawyer says, “They didn’t read the manual” which is so close to “they didn’t read the fine print” it virtually makes no difference, and you are defending him. I guess you’re a sucker for Lost Causes or something, so I’m officially notifying you that Haven’t Got a Leg to Stand On. Further defense will result in comparison to the Black Knight in Monty Python and the Grail - and I know you don’t want that. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![GawnFishin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9bcb4/32.png) [@GawnFishin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GawnFishin)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/77 "2005-10-12T20:37:06Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > No. The article said that the ass manager told her she didn’t have to come in tomorow and that she could take off as much time as needed. The girl didn’t go back to work there. I doubt that her mother let her. I get the impression she asked. > [@](#): > > Ogborn was so cold she was shaking and so stunned that, as Dockery wrapped her in a blanket, **she asked if she had show up for work the next morning.** > > Dockery told her no. “Take as much time off as you want,” she said. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/78 "2005-10-12T20:43:10Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > It doesn’t matter what Maccas does: you can fool some of the people all of the time. And jailing Maccas management because of that fact would be as much of a crime as what occurred to these poor girls in the first place. The manager on the spot had a duty to protect their employees from things of this sort. He or she didn’t. Why is no one ever able to blame authority figures for blatant failures? I notice that the people who gave the orders to Lynndie England and her cohorts in crime were sanctioned in any way. It’s only the lower level people who ever deserve sanctions, as far as some people are concerned. I’m not one of them. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/79 "2005-10-12T20:53:07Z")
> [@OleOneEye](#): > > I don’t think people obey questionable orders like this because they’re stupid; they do it because they’re afraid of losing their measly $6.35 an hour and ending up out on the street. In the article it says the girl took the job because her mother lost hers, so someone else needs her to stay employed. How could anyone want a $6.35 an hour job when there are so many great government training programs that will have them working for Big Bucks in no time, ask our conservative posters … ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713/80 "2005-10-12T20:56:38Z")
What this drives home for me is that for these people, the choice was never “Take that Rhodes Scholarship, or have a rewarding career at McDonalds?” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fast-food-hoax-strip-searches/325713.md?page=5)