# Fat Bashing and Sizeism **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 24, 2003, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922 "2003-04-24T18:51:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![London\_Calling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@London\_Calling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/London_Calling)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2003, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/101 "2003-04-25T22:32:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Witch \* > I still eat whatever I want, I just use my head. This is \*the answer \*people, only eat with your head. Repeat after me: Eat with head, eat with head … words to live by ! I gotta tell ya … ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2003, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/102 "2003-04-25T22:32:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sauron \* > \*\*This is a bad thing? Please don’t ever tell my wife, then. \*\* Well, yes and no. This is a position requiring both flexibility and skill. The problem in the 80s was that too many “instructors” (ala Jane Fonda) just had people kicking their feet up over their heads with no safety information, or proper instructions. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/103 "2003-04-26T02:01:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wolfman \* > \*\*First of all being heavy for years really fucks up your ankles and knees. Walking for 20 minutes a day is and will always be excrutiating for many obese people. \*\* I just wanted to add to this point. A friend of the family is a lovely woman. Smart and accomplished. She also used to be severely clinically depressed. Her depression led to obesity to the tune of about 450 lbs. She was about 5’ tall. Suffice it to say, she couldn’t move around very much - she basically sat on her bed or the sofa for a couple of years. Enter some serious mental health intervention and some Prozac (Yep - it worked for her). Ba-bam - the lady lost around 200 lbs just by being less depressed and eating less. The problem remained, however; that due to the joints atrophying, she was unable to straighten her legs. She currently is forced to use a walker to go anywhere. So now, here she is, with an amazing accomplishment under her belt - the loss of a whole other person - and she can’t really enjoy it because she’s still a 250lb 5’ tall woman. She’s still big. Strangers still point and make fun of her. She still has the stigma of “fat” despite her amazing success. Anyone who says “Anyone can lose weight - they just have to diet and exercise” is probably correct. However, the amount of weight lost is not necessarily going to turn every person into a supermodel, but a lot of people seem to forget that. The woman in my example has done an amazing thing for her health and her life - she has atained some mobility. However, she still has weight related complaints. If she complains, immediately, it seems, that someone is ready to jump up and say “Well - you wouldn’t be fat if you would just diet and exercise.” Wrong. If she didn’t diet and exercise, she would weigh 450 instead of 250. People just really need to give others a break. ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/104 "2003-04-26T02:24:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Philster \* > Fat people are somewhat forgiven if they have never been armed with information…the truth about eating and how exercise is not a way to eat and get away with it. We need a platry amount of cals to live. 15-1800! That is IT. Oh, _thank you_ for your gracious forgiveness. _How_ would we survive without knowing your kind absolution. Schmuck. > [@](#): > > Once we effectively educate everyone and debunk the excuses about slow metabolisms and ‘born to be fat’ nonsense, then we can start being tough on people for knowing better but not acting on the information to stay in shape. And now you shine down upon us all with your _radiant_ wisdom. Of course there is nothing to the slow metabolism thing and you have proven it to us all. We sit at your feet in rapt attention for your next fecal nugget of wisdom. {Edited for coding-Lynn} ---
**Author:** ![chula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a4c791/32.png) [@chula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chula)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/105 "2003-04-26T03:40:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CanvasShoes \* > \*\*Well, yes and no. This is a position requiring both flexibility and skill. The problem in the 80s was that too many “instructors” (ala Jane Fonda) just had people kicking their feet up over their heads with no safety information, or proper instructions. \*\* I think you were wooshed, but thanks for the info. ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/106 "2003-04-26T03:56:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by DeVena \* > \*\*And per exercise, most fat people hate to use public facilities because of the humiliation and ridicule. Don’t get me wrong - I’m all for exercise. It is VERY important to one’s health. But, with all the pointing, laughing and rude comments, you get ashamed to be seen in public at all, much less be seen struggling and sweating. \*\* Don’t make the mistake of assuming this will happen at all health clubs or gyms. At the gym I use, several times a week, there are a couple of guys who are very large, indeed (both are well over 300 pounds, one of them probably closer to 400), and they do a lot of struggling and sweating. But no one subjects them to any humiliation or ridicule. In fact, I think a lot of the other gym regulars respect the effort it takes for these guys to work on their problem. If you’ve got more than one gym or health club to choose from, don’t give up because the first one you try yields an unpleasant experience. Most people, thankfully, aren’t jerks! ---
**Author:** ![jack\_ss](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c77e96/32.png) [@jack\_ss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jack_ss)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/107 "2003-04-26T05:05:33Z")
> [@](#): > > Me, I’m just trying to survive here. When you look at me and see a woman who weighs 250 lbs., you don’t know that I’ve lost 70 lbs. since last March. You have no way of telling. I still get the comments and the looks, because I’m still fat. > When do you think it will stop? When I’m 220 lbs? 180? 150? How long do strangers get to pass judgement on me because I have to have a diet soda when I want something to drink in a fast food place? Congratulations, **Gravity** Yes, you’re still fat but you’re losing weight at a sensible rate. You’re doing something good for yourself. You’ve made tremendous progress and deserve recognition for it. Fuck other people who judge you by what you eat in public. Additionally, I doubt that you are any more accurate of a mind reader than I am. a lot of the things that I assume others are thinking about me are just my own insecurities. All this talk about “but the alcoholic/addict has a ‘disease’ and society makes excuses for him”…I dunno. I got laughed at & judged pretty harshly for being passed out on the sidewalk at 6:00 in the morning. I didn’t get any special treatment from the judge when I was brought in for public intoxication. I’m in 12-step recovery and have been clean for a while now. I don’t have any sympathy for the assholes that are in & out of recovery, do multiple rehabs, etc. but just can’t seem to _get it_ that they can’t use drugs. I look good without a shirt. I used to be underweight, but after I got sober, I started lifting weights and put on lean muscle. Now I’m old enough (and quit smoking 3 weeks ago) that I have trouble with love handles/spare tire. Nothing life-threatening, but not attractive. I’m fortunate enough that I can stay fit and attractive by increasing my exercise & limiting my food intake. By that I mean that I don’t have a defective thyroid, thymus or pancreas; I’m not diabetic nor do I have any other known health issues. I’m not a physician, but I think that if you don’t have an identifed health issue of that type, you can keep yourself healthy by limiting food intake & increasing activity. Not that you’ll look like a piece of Roman Sculpture, (I don’t think I can anymore) but you can acheive & maintain a healthy body configuration. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/108 "2003-04-26T05:46:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by cainxinth \* > \*\*I never said laziness I said lack of will power, lack of self control, and lack of desire to make a difficult sacrifice. > > Please show me a cite that shows that the growing trend of obesity in America is due primarily to factors beyond one’s personal control. \*\* No cite, but anecdotal. I’ve always been a skinny person, in a family of people who either aren’t, or who have to struggle not to be overweight. It is not a struggle for me. It has never been a struggle. Take Thanksgiving. Most of the people in my family have the attitude of, “eat until you’re unconscious and/or there’s no food left” and there is always a lot of food, but . . . not much left. “And then watch football on television.” First I had the battle of the clean plate, where I had to convince my mother that if only I could load my own plate then I would eat it all. Then I would get jeered at because after I loaded my plate, there was still some plate visible. It seemed that nobody in my family understood that there came a point when I _could not eat another bite_, whether it was lemon creme pie or another serving of green bean casserole or ice cream. (Of course, these were the same people who also said, when I _did_ take a second helping of angelfood cake, that it sure must be nice to eat whatever I wanted without gaining weight.) And then after dinner I would be absolutely crazed if I didn’t get to go for a walk or run around in the yard or something physical. Eventually I figured out that nobody else in my family feels like I feel when full. I don’t like it–I hate it, I’d rather be hungry! They don’t get the can’t-eat-one-more-bite thing because they don’t have it! My idea of a nightmare outing is to go to some all-you-can-eat place. For me, it’s a total waste. Or a place where the portions are so big they’re falling off the plate. This kind of thing actually makes me lose my appetite entirely. But the rest of my family (and here I mean the family I grew up with, not the one I created) thinks these are kind of idea. When I go home to visit, I get taken to a place where, I’m not kidding, one portion of chicken fried steak looks like what I would set on the table to feed my husband and kids. And then they look hurt when I don’t eat every bite–even though I eat quite a bit and take the rest in a doggy bag, like I don’t really appreciate this fine dining establishment, ungrateful wretch that I am. I’m adopted. I think it’s a gene thing. (I guess if I’d been a nice person I would have washed the dishes and cleaned up the kitchen while everybody else was napping, instead of going out for a stroll.) ---
**Author:** ![DadWagonDriver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/edb3f5/32.png) [@DadWagonDriver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DadWagonDriver)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/109 "2003-04-26T05:50:12Z")
I have to chime in with a slight hijack here. **Mockingbird** , kicking the Coke habit is fairly simple, but cold-turkey sucks. I learned this method in Men’s Health, and it worked for me fairly quickly. Buy one twelve pack of regular Coke, and one of Diet Coke. For the first week, mix 8oz of regular with 4oz of diet. The next week, 6 and 6. Week three, 4 and 8, week 4, 0 and 12. I actually managed to do it in about a week instead of a month, but as an athlete I had different motivation. As a side note, now when I _do_ drink regular coke (i.e. at McD’s or a movie) it tastes way too sweet and I can only drink about half of it. I also quit drinking Diet Coke for the most part now, it gave me weird smelling gas (I know, TMI). Probably the saccharin. A good method (although a bit expensive) to not eating as much throughout the day: Go to GNC and buy Nitro-Tech powder. It’s a protein shake. One of these keeps me filled up for an hour or two (I have a high metabolism, so YMMV). The Nitro-Tech bars are the best tasting protein bars I’ve eaten as well, I’d suggest those too. In general, I agree with those that say that obesity stems from lifestyle choices. One look at my parents tells me that. I’m working with them right now, I hope all of you hae better luck than they have so far. (Neither is Morbidly Obese, but my dad is 6’2 and around 275 lbs. My mom is 5’8 and around 220-240.) Good luck to all of you, and congrats on the progress to those that have seen it. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/110 "2003-04-26T06:03:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by yosemitebabe \* > \*\*I don’t care what you personally or internally feel about fat people. I don’t give a shit. But don’t _ever_ let yourself be mean, snotty, cruel, condescending towards some stranger who has done NOTHING to you, other than be seen in public while fat. I think people who are deliberately mean to complete strangers are a very low form of life. There’s just no excuse for it. \*\* I would never be deliberately mean, snotty, cruel, or condescending to a complete stranger. My family is a different story. I almost feel I owe them a bit of snottiness, and a good helping of condescension as well. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/111 "2003-04-26T07:56:07Z")
I’d just to state for the record that I could not remain conscious on 1500 calories a day. ---
**Author:** ![ultress](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/7c8e57/32.png) [@ultress](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultress)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/112 "2003-04-26T15:27:19Z")
I have struggled for quite a while with my weight. I know what the problem is, but I won’t go into it now it would take too long. But it stems from childhood and being afraid of not having enough to eat. My ex was thin. He could eat three times as much as me and never gain an ounce. He had a job that required a good deal of physical activity. I was in an office. But, alas, it will catch up with you in the end. As he aged he became significantly less active, still eating the same amount and now he looks like a baby balloon. There is justice in the world. All the times he called me fat have caught up with him. I too have tried every diet under the sun. Lose and gain, lose and gain. My doctor put me on Atkins and at last I’ve found something that I can live with. It takes a lot of effort, but I’m worth it. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/113 "2003-04-26T16:13:18Z")
Here’s how it is. Are you morbidly obese? Have you ever been morbidly obese? Have you had to fight morbid obesity most of your life? Do you have an eating disorder of any kind, be it bulimia, anorexia, or, \* (yes is a fucking eating disorder it just doesn’t render you cuter)\* , \*\* compulsive overeating? \*\*Are you a psychologist or psychiatrist or a physician specializing in the treatment of bariatrics? If the honest answer to the above questions is “No”, then your opinion about the experience and abilities and lives of people who DO have to deal with these issues is worse than meaningless, it is aggressively ignorant and frequently offensive, and if you had an ounce of decency you’d shut the fuck up about it. The fact that we all share the same basic bodies that require food and both gain and lose weight does NOT qualify you to pronounce jack shit about the issues and experiences and challenges of people for whom these are not straightforward matters. Surprise! We are here to fight ignorance, not argue for the legitimacy of our value judgments and prejudices. ---
**Author:** ![cainxinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7bcc69/32.png) [@cainxinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cainxinth)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/114 "2003-04-26T16:15:58Z")
**Stoid** , the question isn’t do people with an eating disorder have a hard time losing weight. It’s do most overweight people have an eating disorder? ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/115 "2003-04-26T16:57:12Z")
Actually, the question is: Why is it any of your fucking business? Why does anyone have to explain, justify, excuse, or ask forgiveness for the amount of fat on their bodies? Certainly there are a thousand different details that could contribute to any given person’s fat. So? Are you looking to make some more judgment calls about whose fat is forgivable and whose isn’t? Who we get to demonize vs. who we get to sympathize with? Being fat is painful, difficult and complicated. Being fat is itself a miserable consequence to a given set of behaviors and/or conditions. Being fat is its own punishment. Vanishingly few people are happy about it. Their various struggles with it are really none of your business, unless and until you are in the jury box weighing the evidence to decide whether some fat person’s descrimination lawsuit has merit. Until then, be damned grateful you do not have this problem and think about something else. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/116 "2003-04-26T17:00:30Z")
By the way, I will answer your question: most obese people have an eating disorder. I think it is disingenuous to suggest that conversations about sizism and fat hatred are really about people who are carrying an extra 20 on their ass or gut in middle age, and most such people would not self-identify as the descriminated against fat people of the world. ---
**Author:** ![cainxinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7bcc69/32.png) [@cainxinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cainxinth)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/117 "2003-04-26T17:11:43Z")
It’s my business because some people are demanding that my tax dollars and my air travel costs should be directed to accommodating for their condition. If it is in fact a genuine disorder beyond their control I’m more than happy to pay, but I still haven’t seen any real proof that such is the case for most obese people. ---
**Author:** ![cainxinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7bcc69/32.png) [@cainxinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cainxinth)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/118 "2003-04-26T17:17:06Z")
And like I said earlier, I think that society has changed, food types and availability has changed, and the social pressures of weight and body image have changed. Clearly there has to be some top-down solution to the problem. But, in the same token I don’t want to dissolve any sense of personal responsibility, or to give people a free pass to choose a lifestyle of obesity simply because they know they will receive sympathy and accommodation from society. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/119 "2003-04-26T17:40:49Z")
Hey, guess what: it’s not your call. You can and certainly will have any ol’ opinion you like. But what precisely is your goal in opening a Pit thread to talk about your ignorant value judgments of the lifestyles and personal realities of fat people? (A category of persons that make up a substantial percentage of this board, as you must surely know by now.) There is a tiny handful of fat people who are bitching to get x,y,z. But they aren’t bitching to you personally, and their whining really doesn’t justfy you spewing your value judgments about fat people in general and whether their fat is forgivable or not. If you’re so damned concerned about your tax dollars (an argument I find incredibly difficult to swallow, I might add, but I’ll give you the benefit), follow the voting patterns of your politicians and act accordingly, and spare me your proclamations about my ass and how it came to be that way. ---
**Author:** ![cainxinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7bcc69/32.png) [@cainxinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cainxinth)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2003, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922/120 "2003-04-26T17:51:39Z")
I don’t presume to know what the physical makeup of this board is. And, I didn’t start this thread to pass judgment on anyone. I started it because a poster made the remarks that ALL fat people deserve special treatment because ALL fat people are suffering from a physical disorder. I knew objectively that it was impossible for that to be true because I was a fat person and I didn’t require societies’ help. I still haven’t found data suggesting that I am a rare case. From my informal googling all I’ve found is that there isn’t enough research because the problem is so complicated and relatively new. But, it is a legitimate discussion, and we are all trying to discuss it empathetically and logically. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fat-bashing-and-sizeism/170922.md?page=7)