# FDA bans ephedra **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 30, 2003, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809 "2003-12-30T18:38:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![neutron\_star](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/51bf81/32.png) [@neutron\_star](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/neutron_star)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/1 "2003-12-30T18:38:26Z")
[The federal government announced on Tuesday a ban on the sale of ephedra, an herbal supplement used for weight control that has been linked to a number of deaths and harmful side effects.](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3839574/) That’s nice. Instead of letting consumers do their own research and decide what’s best for them, the federal government has again taken it upon themselves to decide what we can and can’t put into our own bodies. Why? Well, a baseball player died! Nothing wakes up the sleeping sheeple like a dead ballplayer! :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > “It’s the only thing that could make my wife and I be happy,” he said. “Nothing else could have done what this is doing. I mean to get this off the market and to save other peoples’ lives is just amazing to us.” > > Ernie Bechler testified in Congress, urging a ban. “That’s the last thing I said: 'Please don’t let my son die in vain.”’ So, by this man’s logic, we have well over half a million people a year “dying in vain” from alcohol and tobacco, some of whom are even _gasp_ **ex-ballplayers**! Why is this ballplayer any better than them? If he had half a brain, he’d have read about and weighed the risks before taking the drug. Look Ernie, it’s sad what happened to your kid and all, but that doesn’t make it your mission to keep hundreds of millions of people from ever touching the stuff. > [@](#): > > Health and Human Services Secretary Tommy Thompson said that “based on the best possible scientific evidence” his agency would issue a consumer alert about the dangers of ephedra and will send notices to manufacturers to stop selling the herbs. > > “The time to stop taking this product is now,” he said. > “They are just too risky to use,” said the secretary. Too risky? How many people died from it? Oh, right. 155 people over a several-year period, most of whom had pre-existing medical problems and shouldn’t have been taking it in the first place. For a product that’s sold in about 75% of the convenience stores I frequent, and also was the active ingredient in the wildly successful (and wildly overpriced) Metabolife, that’s not bad. Of course, all those stores also sell cigarettes, which killed 15,000 **times** more people in the same few years, but who’s counting? I don’t take ephedra often, so this ban won’t effect me much, but it really helpful when I need to stay up a few extra hours and don’t want to take large amounts of caffeine. It also works wonders on a stuffy nose. Myself and millions of other users have remained completely heart attack-free, but that doesn’t matter. The government wants to wrench it out of our hands, anyway. Fuck, if the FDA wants to do something about herbal supplements, why don’t they go after the modern version of patent medicine hucksters? I’m talking about the crooks who market completely ineffective “herbal remedies” with wild claims of curing everything under the sun while simultaneously increasing your penis size. No, these guys get to scam in peace, while one of the few herbal medications that actually works as advertised gets pulled off the market. Fuck that. Oh well. Better stock up, ephedra users. Today you’re just buying some “trucker speed” from the gas station, but in 60 days, you’ll be a criminal in possession of a dangerous drug. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/2 "2003-12-30T18:58:17Z")
Well, actually he was a **current** ballplayer. A minor league pitcher with a shot at the bigs. Other than that I’m with you. I’m all for legalization of all drugs. ---
**Author:** ![neutron\_star](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/51bf81/32.png) [@neutron\_star](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/neutron_star)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/3 "2003-12-30T19:18:50Z")
I think you misunderstood me. I said that some of the people dying from tobacco and alcohol are ex-ballplayers. I’m aware of the circumstances surrounding Bechler’s death. It is really sad, but shit like that just happens sometimes. My point was that it happens a lot more often with drugs few people consider banning than it does with ephedra. I included the “ex” because most ballplayers dying now from the detrimental effects of alcohol and tobacco played decades ago. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/4 "2003-12-30T19:31:19Z")
Oh, I dig it. I was just arguing with one of the sales weasels here that scotch has done WAY more damage to people and society than weed ever did. Making one legal and the other not is only an accident of history. And such inconsistencies bug me. ---
**Author:** ![Podkayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Podkayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Podkayne)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/5 "2003-12-30T19:38:55Z")
Unfortuately, since neither the FDA nor any other agency, has the legal purview to regulate supplements, they cannot simply require that ephedra be tested for safety and efficacy, nor can it regulate the purity and dosage in ephedra products. All the FDA can do is investigate claims that ephedra can be harmful, and since it has been shown to be harmful, pull it off the market. Of course, as the OP says, if the FDA had the power to regulate supplements, it would also find that many do not do what the manufacturers claim to do, that many products do not contain the dosages advertised, and that some even contain harmful impurities. At the moment, there is no regulation over the first matter, and the second and third only come to light when consumers are injured by the supplements they are taking. If the supplement industry wasn’t so vehemently resistant to government regulation, ephedra could be tested for safe dosage, interaction with precription drugs (and other supplements) and contraindication due to certain medical conditions. Ephedra products could be regulated and labeled, and consumers who took the product contrary to the package instructions would be doing so at their own risk. From the linked article: > [@](#): > > Manufacturers blocked a 1997 FDA attempt to restrict sales of certain dosages and to put warning labels on the herb by arguing the agency lacked enough proof of danger. The FDA, incidentally, doesn’t have the power to regulate tobacco or alcohol as foods or drugs. That’s the job of the BATF, who clearly don’t have the same mission or motivation as the FDA. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/6 "2003-12-30T19:45:24Z")
This sucks. I don’t take ephedra on a regular basis either. Like the OP said, it’s great for when you’re doing that last minute cramming for an exam or if you’re just dragging your feet that particular day. I won’t terribly miss taking it, but I will miss my freedom to take it. ---
**Author:** ![neutron\_star](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/51bf81/32.png) [@neutron\_star](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/neutron_star)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/7 "2003-12-30T20:09:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Podkayne \* > \*\*Unfortuately, since neither the FDA nor any other agency, has the legal purview to regulate supplements, they cannot simply require that ephedra be tested for safety and efficacy, nor can it regulate the purity and dosage in ephedra products. > > All the FDA can do is investigate claims that ephedra can be harmful, and since it has been shown to be harmful, pull it off the market.\*\* And that’s one of the big problems. The government is dealing with substances that have all the same properties as drugs, with the sole exception being that they come from a plant rather than a lab. I mean, what the fuck is that? Heroin comes from a plant. Cocaine comes from a plant. Maybe I should start selling some “Organic Poppy Extract” and “Processed Herbal Coca Paste.” Granted, the manufacturers’ opposition to regulation makes a bad situation even worse, but I guess they have the bottom line to think of. Not being able to tell wild lies about their products anymore might put a dent on business. > [@](#): > > The FDA, incidentally, doesn’t have the power to regulate tobacco or alcohol as foods or drugs. That’s the job of the BATF, who clearly don’t have the same mission or motivation as the FDA. And there we have another of those inconsistencies **Jonathan** is talking about. Tobacco and alcohol clearly fall into the category of Food and Drugs, get somehow they get lumped in with _firearms_? I don’t get it. Oh, and another thing I noticed about the article: it refers to ephedra repeatedly, but never mentions ephedrine. Some brands contain ephedra extract, standarized to a certain number of milligrams of ephedrine. Others just say “ephedrine” and make no mention of a plant. These are always much smaller pills, and I’m assuming they contain synthetic ephedrine, rather than ephedra extract. Will this ruling outlaw them, as well? The article doesn’t say. ---
**Author:** ![SnoopyFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d07c76/32.png) [@SnoopyFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SnoopyFan)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/8 "2003-12-30T20:47:46Z")
I’m with you on this one, OP. ---
**Author:** ![lezlers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/258eb7/32.png) [@lezlers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lezlers)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/9 "2003-12-30T21:50:36Z")
I’m SO with you on this. I haven’t taken it in months and was in fact just planning on going out today to get some more and start taking it (I’ve taken it off and on for a couple of years) and saw this article today. Eek! In my 26 years, this is the ONLY thing I’ve found to keep my weight in check on a consistant basis. It’s pissing me off that it’s about to be taken away. And as others have pointed out, the MUCH more harmful alcohol and cigs aren’t touched (not that I’d want those banned either). The hypocracy is astounding. Happy freakin’ New Year. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![The\_Asbestos\_Mango](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@The\_Asbestos\_Mango](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Asbestos_Mango)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/10 "2003-12-30T22:08:27Z")
Yep, that’s just what we need, another government regulation to tell us what we can’t put into our own bodies. Not a big fan of ephedra. I’ve taken it a few times for sinus stuffage, and it makes me feel jittery and mentally f-ed up. But 155 deaths over a period of several years? Aspirin has a worse record than that. The information of the potential hazards of ephedra has been common public knowledge for years. I think that human beings have the right to evaluate the risk-benefit ratio of the use of a given herb or drug and decide for themselves which ones they want to use. Apparently, the FDA doesn’t agree. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/11 "2003-12-30T22:16:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by neutron star \* > **And there we have another of those inconsistencies Jonathan is talking about. Tobacco and alcohol clearly fall into the category of Food and Drugs, get somehow they get lumped in with _firearms_? I don’t get it.** Because the ATF was set up to be a revenue agency. It has authority over Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearm licensing and taxation. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/12 "2003-12-30T23:54:57Z")
A damned shame. Ephedra (not sudafed) works very well on those occasions when I need a little extra help with my allergies. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2003, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/13 "2003-12-31T00:02:49Z")
I love ephedra. I’m a naturally nocturnal person. The absolute best way to kick start my brain online at 8 in the morning was a nice dose of ephedra and some coffee. Nothing else was more effective with that few side effects. Shit, it didn’t even raise my pulse rate. ---
**Author:** ![GatorGrappler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e0b2c6/32.png) [@GatorGrappler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GatorGrappler)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2003, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/14 "2003-12-31T03:44:14Z")
If ephedra is dangerous and banned, why iaren’t tobacco or alcohol products banned? It doesnt make since. I read where more people die form aspirin than ephedine each year. This is insane. ---
**Author:** ![FilmGeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@FilmGeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FilmGeek)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2003, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/15 "2003-12-31T04:59:28Z")
Rather than banning, I think they should have made it a controlled substance governed by the FDA… but this ban did bring to my attention that the use of Ephedra and other drugs (caffeine and aspirin among them) can bring deadly consequences. I took ephedra as a younger girl in the form of Metabolife (once or twice) and included caffeine and ibuprofen (I was on a medical regimen of daily ibuprofen and I’m helplessly addicted to coca cola). I detested the way it made me feel, heart racing, mind unable to focus, etc. Is this just a “don’t control my life” rant? Or does it actually have to do with Ephedra? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2003, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/16 "2003-12-31T06:11:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by GatorGrappler \* > \*\*If ephedra is dangerous and banned, why iaren’t tobacco or alcohol products banned? It doesnt make since. I read where more people die form aspirin than ephedine each year. This is insane. \*\* Well, and more people die from car accidents than Russian Roulette each year, also, but Russian Roulette is still the more dangerous activity. A lot more people use aspirin than ephedra. The same is true of alcohol and tobacco. Besides, banning alcohol or tobacco would have a much bigger economic and social impact than banning ephedra. ---
**Author:** ![London\_Calling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@London\_Calling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/London_Calling)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2003, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/17 "2003-12-31T06:27:38Z")
On something of a tangent this story caught my eye in a fairly local paper this week: “A bag containing 10g of Mexican cubensis magic mushrooms - bearing the warning “can cause hallucinations” - can now be bought for as little as £5 from a specialist store in Church Street. \ But the threat of a bad trip was not enough to put off Sabina Khan, 25, who bought a £5 bag to munch at her Selhurst flat. “I ate just one mushroom and it tasted OK but a bit mouldy,” she said. "It took about 20 minutes to work but suddenly I became really light-headed and began noticing things my eyes would never usually see. “Things became really strange when I began a conversation with my dog - he told me he felt cooped up and wanted to get out of the house.” Vincent Godber, a Coulsdon-based wine merchant aged 55, was equally keen to try out the Mexican. He admitted to sampling the drug in the late-seventies and said he never imagined there would come a time when it could be bought across the counter. “Back in the old days you had to get out an ordnance survey map and traipse around the Welsh countryside to get hold of mushrooms,” he said." Excellent ! As if the place isn’t already like something out of a Tom Sharpe book . . . ---
**Author:** ![London\_Calling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@London\_Calling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/London_Calling)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2003, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/18 "2003-12-31T06:28:51Z")
[Link for the above](http://iccroydon.icnetwork.co.uk/news/headlines/page.cfm?objectid=13753472&method=full&siteid=53340) ---
**Author:** ![EvilGhandi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@EvilGhandi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EvilGhandi)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2003, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/19 "2003-12-31T07:20:21Z")
Ephedra is also a prettty damn fair broncho dialator. Damn good tea for when I don’t have the money for my fucking expensive (and atmittedly better) perscription meds. Fuck fuck and fuck again, back to psuedofed and caffine. Wait. are the just banning ephedra the herb? Cause if they are, the active ingredient is avalable in OTC asthma meds. ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2003, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809/20 "2003-12-31T10:41:21Z")
The ban applies only to “dietary supplements containing ephedrine alkaloids.” It does not affect OTC or prescription medications. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fda-bans-ephedra/221809.md?page=2)