# federal government shutdown **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 29, 2017, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079 "2017-11-29T18:49:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/1 "2017-11-29T18:49:52Z")
I haven’t seen a thread on this here or in GD, so I figured I’d start one. Here’s where things stand today: > [@](#): > > [There are just eight legislative days left before funding runs out for the federal government on Dec. 8, yet Congress appears no closer to a major spending deal today than it did before the weeklong Thanksgiving recess. > > Congressional leaders have said a one-week stopgap funding measure may be needed to buy lawmakers and Trump more time to reach a year-end deal, but a number of other prickly legislative items are complicating the negotiations. > > Schumer and Pelosi insist they won’t help pass a trillion-dollar spending package unless Republicans agree to protect hundreds of thousands of young immigrant “Dreamers” now at risk of deportation following Trump’s decision to end the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) program. > > Speaker Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) is working on a solution but has made clear the funding bill and immigration issue will be taken up separately.]([http://thehill.com/homenews/house/362256-chances-for-government-shutdown-rising](http://thehill.com/homenews/house/362256-chances-for-government-shutdown-rising)) > [@](#): > > [President Trump on Tuesday cast doubt on Washington’s ability to avoid a government shutdown, writing on Twitter that he didn’t believe a deal could be reached with Democrats. > > The tweet came hours before Trump is to meet at the White House with GOP congressional leaders as well as Senate Minority Leader Charles Schumer (D-N.Y.) and House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.). > > “Meeting with ‘Chuck and Nancy’ today about keeping government open and working,” Trump tweeted. > > “Problem is they want illegal immigrants flooding into our Country unchecked, are weak on Crime and want to substantially RAISE Taxes. I don’t see a deal!”]([http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/362094-trump-i-dont-see-a-deal-to-avoid-government-shutdown](http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/362094-trump-i-dont-see-a-deal-to-avoid-government-shutdown)) [Trump, Democrats Cast Preemptive Shutdown Blame](https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2017/11/28/trump_democrats_cast_preemptive_shutdown_blame_135639.html) It seems like the shoe is on the other foot now, as is often the case in politics. What do you think? Will a shutdown happen? If so, who will “win” and who will “lose”? ---
**Author:** ![yanceylebeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yanceylebeef/32/12290_2.png) [@yanceylebeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yanceylebeef)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/2 "2017-11-29T18:55:33Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I haven’t seen a thread on this here or in GD, so I figured I’d start one. Here’s where things stand today: > > [Trump, Democrats Cast Preemptive Shutdown Blame](https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2017/11/28/trump_democrats_cast_preemptive_shutdown_blame_135639.html) > > It seems like the shoe is on the other foot now, as is often the case in politics. What do you think? Will a shutdown happen? **If so, who will “win” and who will “lose”**? Bolding mine. This is what is wrong in America right now. There are no winners and losers. We all lose when ideology trumps (ha!) what is good for the country. Congratulations. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/3 "2017-11-29T18:59:03Z")
> [@yanceylebeef](#): > > … There are no winners and losers. We all lose when ideology trumps (ha!) what is good for the country. … Do you believe Pelosi and Schumer share your view on this point? ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/4 "2017-11-29T19:11:01Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > It seems like the shoe is on the other foot now, as is often the case in politics. What do you think? Will a shutdown happen? If so, who will “win” and who will “lose”? I’m still curious why the minority party is the one that should take the blame, especially when the sticking point is something the President has said he agrees with. Then again, the President changes his mind from when he sits down to shit to when he asks Melania to flush. In short, the Lying Liar lies, and Pelosi/Schumer aren’t going to take it. Republicans stand around with their thumbs up their collective asses, still trying to blame Democrats while they possess majorities in all three Houses. Why the hell are they asking Democrats for help with this? They’ve had no problem shutting them out on every piece of major legislation this year. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/5 "2017-11-29T19:21:17Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > I’m still curious why the minority party is the one that should take the blame, especially when the sticking point is something the President has said he agrees with. … Well, it often works out that way because they’d be the ones voting _against_ funding the government, while presumably most of the majority party will be voting _in favor_ of funding the government. > [@Chisquirrel](#): > > … Republicans stand around with their thumbs up their collective asses, still trying to blame Democrats while they possess majorities in all three Houses. … Is this a joke that I missed the punchline to? ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/6 "2017-11-29T19:27:05Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Is this a joke that I missed the punchline to? House, Senate, White ---
**Author:** ![Caffeine.addict](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f475e1/32.png) [@Caffeine.addict](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caffeine.addict)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/7 "2017-11-29T19:29:20Z")
The Republicans control the House, Senate, and Presidency. How can you blame the minority party that doesn’t control any of those for the government shutdown. Are you saying the Republicans can’t get their shit together enough to make this happen? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/8 "2017-11-29T19:33:21Z")
Let’s see- the Republicans want to pass tax cuts for the rich without holding any hearings or involving Democrats in any way, but when it comes time to paying the bills for previously approved spending, all of a sudden they can’t make a move without Democrats? Go ahead and shut it down, see who the voters blame. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/9 "2017-11-29T19:49:48Z")
> [@Caffeine.addict](#): > > The Republicans control the House, Senate, and Presidency. How can you blame the minority party that doesn’t control any of those for the government shutdown. Are you saying the Republicans can’t get their shit together enough to make this happen? Well, first of all, I’m not really blaming anyone. But oftentimes, the blame falls on the party that is voting against the bill’s passage. In this case, that would be the Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/10 "2017-11-29T19:50:37Z")
Yeah - add me to the list asking why the minority party is responsible? Or, if the Repubs wish a deal, why are they prevented from offering something the other side might be inclined to accept? Or does negotiation simply mean “take it or leave it.” What can you identify, as an effort by the Repubs to negotiate in good faith? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/11 "2017-11-29T19:50:50Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > … Go ahead and shut it down, see who the voters blame. I have similar feelings. I’m actually kind of intrigued to see how a Trump administration’s list of critical functions may differ from Obama’s. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/12 "2017-11-29T19:55:36Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > … What can you identify, as an effort by the Repubs to negotiate in good faith? I’m not privvy to any of the internal negotiations in Washington. ETA: I don’t know if they’ve been negotiating in good faith, bad faith, or even if they’ve been negotiating at all. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/13 "2017-11-29T20:05:05Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I have similar feelings. I’m actually kind of intrigued to see how a Trump administration’s list of critical functions may differ from Obama’s. You can bet your sweet ass that he’ll keep the WW II Memorial open! Last time around you’d swear that closing it was Obama’s top priority. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/14 "2017-11-29T20:07:51Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > You can bet your sweet ass that he’ll keep the WW II Memorial open! Last time around you’d swear that closing it was Obama’s top priority. I kind of figured. They’ll probably not lock the gates at the National Parks either. Maybe shut down the EPA or CFPB, or the DoJ’s civil rights division. I suspect it’ll be a good bit more painful for Democrats than the last time around. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/15 "2017-11-29T20:09:16Z")
Who will lose? All Americans, and federal employees. Who will be blamed? Repubs will blame Dems, Dems will blame Repubs. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/16 "2017-11-29T20:17:39Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I kind of figured. They’ll probably not lock the gates at the National Parks either. Maybe shut down the EPA or CFPB, or the DoJ’s civil rights division. I suspect it’ll be a good bit more painful for Democrats than the last time around. While I was highly annoyed at the last time they shut down the govt and ruined my camping plans, I don’t think that they should be keeping the parks open if there are not employees in the parks. Just because it’s a big expanse of wilderness doesn’t mean that it’s not important to have people monitoring it, especially when visitors are there. Fires, wildlife attacks, people getting lost or injured, etc, who is supposed to be taking care of that if the govt is shut down and there are no employees? Sure, if they can afford to keep the parks open during the shutdown, that’d be great, but just leaving them unlocked and sending everyone home sounds like a recipe for disaster. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/17 "2017-11-29T20:25:28Z")
OK, suppose that the Democrats are voting against everything the Republicans want. The Republicans are still the majority, though. If they had their act together, they could just outvote the Democrats. Why can’t they? ---
**Author:** ![squidfood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a87d85/32.png) [@squidfood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squidfood)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/18 "2017-11-29T20:26:03Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > ]Why the hell are they asking Democrats for help with this? They’ve had no problem shutting them out on every piece of major legislation this year. Because this is one of those things that needs 60 Senate votes. Their other actions (health, taxes, court appointments) were done so as to need only 50. The last time they faced a “need 60 votes for something urgent” was last year’s spending bill, and the Repubs pretty much caved to the Dems (or at least, ended up with status quo). ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/19 "2017-11-29T20:26:12Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > While I was highly annoyed at the last time they shut down the govt and ruined my camping plans, I don’t think that they should be keeping the parks open if there are not employees in the parks. > > Just because it’s a big expanse of wilderness doesn’t mean that it’s not important to have people monitoring it, especially when visitors are there. > > Fires, wildlife attacks, people getting lost or injured, etc, who is supposed to be taking care of that if the govt is shut down and there are no employees? > > Sure, if they can afford to keep the parks open during the shutdown, that’d be great, but just leaving them unlocked and sending everyone home sounds like a recipe for disaster. I remember last time some local officials here in Utah were talking about taking over the parks (not quite Bundy-style but not all that differently either) and then the state government cut some deal to fund them through state money. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2017, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079/20 "2017-11-29T20:28:03Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > OK, suppose that the Democrats are voting against everything the Republicans want. The Republicans are still the majority, though. If they had their act together, they could just outvote the Democrats. Why can’t they? My guess is the filibuster in the Senate is probably the biggest sticking point. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federal-government-shutdown/803079.md?page=2)