# Federated Department Stores Obliterates tradition **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 21, 2005, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675 "2005-09-21T12:52:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2005, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/21 "2005-09-21T20:36:01Z")
Ironically, according to the Wikipedia article, **Filene’s** was one of the _founders_ of Federated Department Stores in 1929 > **[Macy's, Inc.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federated_Department_Stores)** > > Macy's, Inc. (originally Federated Department Stores, Inc.) is an American holding company founded by Xavier Warren in 1929. Upon its establishment, Federated held ownership of the regional department store chains Abraham & Straus, Lazarus, Filene's, and Shillito's. Bloomingdale's joined Federated Department Stores the following year. Throughout its early history, frequent acquisitions and divestitures saw the company operate a number of nameplates. In 1994, Federated took over the department sto... Question: If the ZCMI stores were renamed Meier and Frank, why do they still show up aas ZCMI on the internet? ---
**Author:** ![FatBaldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecd19e/32.png) [@FatBaldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FatBaldGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2005, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/22 "2005-09-21T20:39:15Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Question: If the ZCMI stores were renamed Meier and Frank, why do they still show up aas ZCMI on the internet? Cite? ---
**Author:** ![MysteryFellow63427](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e4f/32.png) [@MysteryFellow63427](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MysteryFellow63427)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2005, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/23 "2005-09-21T20:42:57Z")
They’re doing the same thing by closing/renaming [Foley’s department stores](http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/front/3362971) all across Texas. Those buttmonkeys. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2005, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/24 "2005-09-21T20:44:27Z")
> [@](#): > > Quote: > Originally Posted by CalMeacham > Question: If the ZCMI stores were renamed Meier and Frank, why do they still show up aas ZCMI on the internet? > > Cite? Here, for one: [http://www.thedowntownmalls.com/](http://www.thedowntownmalls.com/) ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2005, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/25 "2005-09-21T20:52:59Z")
> [@Lissa](#): > > Ohhhh no . . . it’ll have a name. A brand name. And you’ll see it _everywhere you look._ I’m hoping it’ll be [Blue Sun](http://www.fireflywiki.org/Firefly/BlueSun). ---
**Author:** ![FatBaldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecd19e/32.png) [@FatBaldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FatBaldGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2005, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/26 "2005-09-21T21:01:07Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Here, for one: > > [http://www.thedowntownmalls.com/](http://www.thedowntownmalls.com/) As I posted above (#19) they kept the name of the ZCMI Center Mall, but the anchor tenant is now Meier & Frank. The ZCMI Center is owned by Zions Securities, Inc., the real estate arm of the LDS Church, and they have also recently purchased the Crossroads Plaza Mall directly across the street. Both malls have been in decline due to businesses moving away from the downtown area, and they are planning a massive renovation project to revitalize the downtown malls. On a slightly related note, there is a local grocery store chain, Macey’s (with an e), that has 15-20 stores in Utah, and there is some concern that people might get confused when talking about going to Macy’s to pick up a few things. ---
**Author:** ![NinjaChick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/71c47a/32.png) [@NinjaChick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinjaChick)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2005, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/27 "2005-09-21T21:12:53Z")
_shrug_ I, for one, haven’t shopped at a department store since I was 13 and desperately needed a very _small_ skirt suit for my batmitzvah. Smaller stores are cheaper and more convienant. Why mourn the loss of something that unwieldy and way beyond it’s useful life? ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2005, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/28 "2005-09-21T21:48:59Z")
> [@Beware of Doug](#): > > **EXCEPT MAYBE "BAAAAAAAA."** Paging **Hal Briston.** ---
**Author:** ![gardentraveler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gardentraveler/32/3576_2.png) [@gardentraveler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gardentraveler)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/29 "2005-09-22T01:37:14Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > Paging **Hal Briston.** Tee hee… 😃 Macy’s is doing this to all of its stores. Lazarus, which was founded here in Columbus, was bought by Federated a while back and had its name changed to Lazarus-Macy’s for a while. Now it’s become Macy’s, although I don’t think anyone calls it that yet. I rarely shopped there before - it came in handy occasionally. I agree that department stores are on their way out, but I think Macy’s is just hastening their departure by acting like they don’t care about the communities they’re in. (Maybe that’s their plan?) Just about all my needs are met by Target and Kohl’s. If I can’t find stuff there there are other non-Macy’s alternatives… GT ---
**Author:** ![percypercy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@percypercy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/percypercy)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/30 "2005-09-22T01:51:42Z")
Macy’s did it here in Memphis to Goldsmith’s. They bought up the stores a few years ago, so they became Goldsmith’s-Macy’s, then this summer they completely wiped the Goldsmith name away. Goldsmith’s was founded in 1870. The total homogenization pissed me off royally. -Lil ---
**Author:** ![FairyChatMom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fairychatmom/32/21825_2.png) [@FairyChatMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FairyChatMom)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/31 "2005-09-22T11:41:15Z")
I’m not much of a shopper, and I can’t remember the last time I was even in a department store. Most of the ones named here that I recognize, I’d never entered. I think the last time I was in Macy’s was in New York in 1966 - my mom bought my sister and me matching blue dresses. I was 12, she was 11. While it’s melancholy to see the familiar disappear, this doesn’t strike me as a crisis. If there’s a space in the market, something will come in to fill it. If the market is to be dominated by one brand, it will. Such is capitalism, right? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Goob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c77e96/32.png) [@Mr.Goob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Goob)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/32 "2005-09-22T14:31:17Z")
It’s not just Chicago, Wanamakers in Philadelphia, Sattler’s and AM&'S in Buffalo, they are all closed or being gobbled. Screw marketing. ---
**Author:** ![Motorgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e36b37/32.png) [@Motorgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Motorgirl)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/33 "2005-09-22T15:52:23Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > What exactly did you expect to happen? Filene’s got bought by a rival with a store _right across the street_. This was practically a sure thing. While I enjoyed shopping at Filene’s, I can’t really see why this is a big deal. It’s not unexpected, it’s just not what I wanted to have happen. It’s a big deal because it will change the character of Downtown Crossing, which I personally like. I also don’t like shopping at Macy’s because I don’t care for the stores themselves, compared to Filene’s. Slightly different merchandise, different atmosphere, different attitude. Filene’s has more clothes in the price range I’m looking for than does Macy’s. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/34 "2005-09-23T01:15:27Z")
hold on! where am i gonna get my wedding dress! they can’t close the boston filenes. strawbridge in philly is being gobbled as well. gonna be a macy’s. phila stores took a hit, no wanamaker, no gimble, no strawbridge. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/35 "2005-09-23T01:31:59Z")
Plenty of us in Michigan are still pissed off about them taking over Hudson’s and turning them into Marshal Fields. Not only did they get rid of a well-liked name, but the prices went up and the quality of the clothes went down. Fuck 'em. The department stores are definitely overpriced. The tool area in Sears is the only useful area of any department store near me. I buy most of my clothes at Kohl’s, and some stuff at Target or Meijers. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/36 "2005-09-23T01:45:23Z")
Oh yeah: I needed to buy a new suit recently. I went down to the local mall and checked out all four of the department stores there. Pathetic. Selection was very limited, and all the decent suits cost about $500. In the strip mall nearby was the Men’s Warehouse, specializing in male formal wear. Huge selection, staffed by guys who knew their stuff. $325 for a damn nice suit, with dress shirt and tie, including alterations. Guess which store I’m going to recommend to anyone who needs a new suit? ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/37 "2005-09-23T01:51:19Z")
In my home town of Jericho VT there’s a central store, Desso’s. The Dessos lived upstairs and ran the store for ages. They didn’t build it; I think they were the second family to run it; it had used to just be called the Jericho Store, or some such. But, to most of us, it was always Desso’s. They sold it in the mid-90s, and since then three different owners have gone through. They changed the name, re-arranged, changed the items they carried to varrying degrees, and basically changed it. Lots of us still call it Desso’s, even though it hasn’t been for ten years. Those damned bastards, buying the store and changing it and stuff. Jericho has never been the same. ---
**Author:** ![elmwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmwood/32/3060_2.png) [@elmwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elmwood)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/38 "2005-09-23T02:21:15Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Sibley’s (Sibley, Lindsay, and Curr, to give the full name) still exists in Rochester, although their 1920’s main store downtown closed 15 years ago. All the Sibley’s stores – excluding the ones in downtoen Buffalo and Rochester, which were closed – were renamed Kaufmann’s a decade and a half ago… In Buffalo, it went: Hengerer’s (to 1995) -\> Sibley’s (to 1990) -\> Kaufmann’s (to 2006?) -\> Macy’s Adam Meldrum and Anderson (to 1994) -\> Bon Ton Jenss -\> extinct 2000 LL Berger -\> extinct 1991 The Sample - extinct 1990 Hens and Kelly -\> extinct 1985 Sattler’s -\> extinct 1983 A little-known fact: \* No department store chain that was locally owned in Buffalo ever closed just their downtown Buffalo store, while leaving the suburban stores open.\* ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/39 "2005-09-23T02:34:03Z")
Ahhhh, dammit! I checked the Internet and found a _current_ Rochester address for Sibley’s stores (which, of course, I can’t find now – it wasn’t anarchived story or anything). I checked the Salt Lake sites and found records of ZCMI – not just ZCMI center. It looks as if , even checking quickly on the 'net isn’t enough. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675/40 "2005-09-23T03:22:26Z")
They did this with Weinstocks stores in northern California a number of years ago. In Sacramento we had several of each between four major shopping centers. One mall in particular had two anchor stores: a Weinstocks at one end and a Macys at the other. When they announced that all of the Weinstocks would be closing, I remember thinking "maybe we’ll get a Bloomingdale’s. At least it will be different. Instead, we wound up with two Macys, one at either end of the mall. I think we now have 6 Macys stores in the greater Sacramento area. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/federated-department-stores-obliterates-tradition/322675.md?page=3)