# Feds 'black-bagging people' in Portland **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 18, 2020, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638 "2020-07-18T03:19:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/203 "2020-07-19T17:22:58Z")
Why the aggressive questions? **Yes, if you read the thread,** I fully understand what is Happening in Portland. You are exaggerating somewhat, but what is occuring in portland is deplorable. I concur that Barr and trump are sending in brownshirts there for political reasons, and their brownshirts are abusing peoples rights. However, I was asked a question and answered it. Remember, whether or not you despair of what is happening in Portland, facts are still facts. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/204 "2020-07-19T17:25:10Z")
who said otherwise? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/205 "2020-07-19T17:28:22Z")
Local police cant do that. The Constitution clearly gives Feds supremacy. And arresting them or shooting them etc- is exactly what trump andBarr want to happen. They would call it a insurrection, declare martial law, suspend habeas corpus, and of course- call off the election. No, the only thing to do is sue them, protest to Congress, get the ACLU and Federal courts to do something, They are there as some idiot protestors set a fire in the federal Courthouse with fireworks, thus giving Barr the excuse he needed. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/206 "2020-07-19T17:32:03Z")
You said > [@](#): > > Look, in DC there was also a furor over Fed agents with no nametags, etc. Those were BoP riot police, who, _quite justifiably_ have permission to not wear name tags. The furor was about more than just them not wearing nametags. That was part of it, but it was their actions as well. And, while I understand why they would not wear nametags while in a prison dealing with a riot, they are not in a prison dealing with a riot, so they don’t really have the same excuse. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/207 "2020-07-19T17:34:01Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > They are there as some idiot protestors set a fire in the federal Courthouse with fireworks, thus giving Barr the excuse he needed. Collective punishment for the actions of individuals. I wonder how that road goes. And that is assuming that it was actually an idiot protester, and not a govt agent or other provocateur. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/208 "2020-07-19T17:38:12Z")
It was just a weak excuse. but “arson” was all the excuse Barr needed. Certainly possible, but doubtful. Barr certainly has been doing crap like that. This is the Reichstag fire that Barr needed. ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/209 "2020-07-19T17:42:17Z")
Regarding whether Portland protests are peaceful: Sure there are probably big chunks of protestors that are peaceful, but ignoring the violence and claiming it doesn’t exist is bizarre. And expecting the police to have stuff thrown and fired at them and to just allow that to happen is also bizarre. I don’t know what the answer is when you have a protest that is 95% peaceful and 5% violent but they’re all mixed together, it’s complex, but to simply state that only the 95% exists is weird. Federal agents and their actions: The reports I’m reading bother me. I’m glad the ACLU exists as a counter and I hope they will press the issue if their actions were illegal. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/210 "2020-07-19T17:52:06Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Please. You folks think lawlessness is justified to advance your political ideology. Now you complain about it. That’s called hypocrisy. I complain about it when it is _the government_ being lawless. You can call it hypocrisy if you like, but with each post you’ve made here I care less and less about what your opinion might be. And I didn’t think that was possible. On another board I peruse one poster made an observation that has been elevated into a law: _You can’t make a reputation posting here but you can sure ruin one._ ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/211 "2020-07-19T18:11:16Z")
> [@RaftPeople](#): > > I don’t know what the answer is when you have a protest that is 95% peaceful and 5% violent but they’re all mixed together, it’s complex, but to simply state that only the 95% exists is weird. And if it is 99% peaceful, 1% violent? 99.9% peaceful? If you have a thousand people protesting, it only takes one to make it “violent”. There are two ways of dealing with that. Either you do not allow protests, or you acknowledge that that 1 individual is not representative of the rest of the protest. Also, I have seen peaceful protests driven into violence by the actions of the police, so I’m not sure you can really blame the peaceful protesters for that either. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/212 "2020-07-19T18:28:16Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I’m certainly not saying that’s the worst option, unfortunately, I don’t know that there are any good options at this point, so it may well be the least bad. > [@DrDeth](#): > > No, the only thing to do is sue them, protest to Congress, get the ACLU and Federal courts to do something, Except that is not going to work, as the inability of these paths has already been established. Your suggestion is functionally equivalent to doing nothing. You can argue that doing nothing is better than trying to intervene, but don’t fool yourself into thinking that complaining to Congress and the courts will do anything. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/213 "2020-07-19T18:37:08Z")
@Ludovic, did you intend to reply to me? Because my notifications and the post header say that you did; but it looks like you’re actually replying to k9bfriender and DrDeth. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/214 "2020-07-19T18:41:21Z")
Even if you assume that there are violent protester that need the intervention of law, the answer is reasonable grounds, arrest, Miranda and indictment. What we have is South American Junta style protest suppression. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/215 "2020-07-19T18:44:20Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > @Ludovic, did you intend to reply to me? Because my notifications and the post header say that you did; but it looks like you’re actually replying to k9bfriender and DrDeth. No, I must have clicked on the wrong “reply” button. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/216 "2020-07-19T18:47:43Z")
So then what? Look the Federal Police actions in Portland are so new that the ACLU and the courts havent had time to do anything. The ACLU and Courts have accomplished miracles. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/217 "2020-07-19T18:50:20Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > I must have clicked on the wrong “reply” button Easy to do. Discourse has them all over the place. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![SCAdian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scadian/32/3292_2.png) [@SCAdian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCAdian)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/218 "2020-07-19T18:59:30Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > Discourse has them all over the place. Is one enough? Are three too many? ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/219 "2020-07-19T19:09:35Z")
> [@SCAdian](#): > > Is one enough? Are three too many Martinis? – that reads like a quote, but Thurber and martinis is what comes up when I google it, and that quote isn’t quite right. There’s one by each post, one for the thread, one at the reply box, so I suppose if the limit is 10K posts there’d be up to 10,002 per thread. And I suppose actually the old boards had even more, as each post had ‘reply with quote’, ‘multiquote’, and ‘quick reply’; they just weren’t as conspicuous. We seem to be off track. One properly identified and properly behaving police force per demonstration is probably about right. However many are carrying on in Portland right now appear to be too many. ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/220 "2020-07-19T20:35:01Z")
thorny, I believe it’s an allusion to [an old TV commercial](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaD4qT_wNIk) for Fletcher’s Castoria, a children’s laxative. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/221 "2020-07-19T20:50:14Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > I believe it’s an allusion to [an old TV commercial](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaD4qT_wNIk) for Fletcher’s Castoria, a children’s laxative Thanks. – if I ever saw that one, I seem to have managed to forget it. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2020, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638/222 "2020-07-19T20:57:45Z")
Now I’m singing the product name to the tune of Fletcher Memorial Home from The Final Cut. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/feds-black-bagging-people-in-portland/915638.md?page=12)