# Female Dopers: "Captain,""Sir" or "Ma'am"? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 2, 2003, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171 "2003-01-02T07:30:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/1 "2003-01-02T07:30:29Z")
A quick and non-weird question this week, for the females dopers on the board, specifically: if you were in command of a ship, would you prefer the rest of the crew to call you “Captain,”“Sir” or “Ma’am”? The only fictional female captains I can recall in recent memory (Captains Amelia and Janeway) both prefered “Ma’am” or “Captain,” and I didn’t want to rent “Cutthroat Island” again to find out what they called Geena Davis. So, opinions, anyone? Ranchoth ---
**Author:** ![AntaresJB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c2a13f/32.png) [@AntaresJB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AntaresJB)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/2 "2003-01-02T07:57:43Z")
I’d prefer Captain, I think. I would hate sir, and ma’am just always reminds me of little old ladies. ---
**Author:** ![Maxxxie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f14d63/32.png) [@Maxxxie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maxxxie)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/3 "2003-01-02T08:11:52Z")
Ranchoth, When I was in the AIRTC, I preferred to be referred to by my rank (Sergeant). On the occasions that we assumed parade positions, I was the NCO in charge of my Flight, effectively making me a pretend officer. In that instance I would be referred to as “ma’am”, not my rank. I would never refer to a superior officer by their rank - I would call them Sir or Ma’am, depending on their gender. Higher ranks could call me whatever they damn-well pleased, so long as Sergeant or my last name featured in there somewhere. Soooooo in answer to your fictional question - I would prefer ma’am. I wouldn’t object if I was referred to as Captain by higher-ups. Nor would I care if they just referred to me by my last name. I personally wouldn’t care too much if subordinates called me Captain, but would suggest to them that as a matter of courtesy they should take it as standard practice to refer to higher-ups as Sir or Ma’am. _long-winded response over_ Max 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![SkeptiJess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@SkeptiJess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkeptiJess)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/4 "2003-01-02T12:39:24Z")
Ma’am. I oppose the idea that the male honorific is in any way superior to its female equivalent. Jess ---
**Author:** ![heresiarch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/278dde/32.png) [@heresiarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/heresiarch)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/5 "2003-01-02T13:22:07Z")
“Sir?” I’m only aware of one female Captain that is routinely called “Sir” – Captain Janeway on Star Trek. Is there some convention of calling a Captain “Sir” regardless of gender? Is this a Navy thing? ---
**Author:** ![leenmi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f1d935/32.png) [@leenmi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leenmi)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/6 "2003-01-02T16:42:39Z")
Individuals should be referred to by rank and last name. If the individual outranks you, use Sir or Ma’am depending on gender. I was never told to call all officers “Sir” regardless of gender, and I never saw anyone do it, not even the Navy personnel who frequently answered phones “May I help you, Sir or Ma’am?”. Depending on your work center and military branch, it may be acceptable to use first names if the person of the same rank, less rank or within one or two ranks but not in your reporting chain. Mileage varies. The only place I have noticed all officers called “sir”, regardless of gender, is science fiction or fantasy books, and then it was usually the truly annoying “Ser”. ---
**Author:** ![butter\_pie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aca169/32.png) [@butter\_pie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/butter_pie)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/7 "2003-01-02T19:21:28Z")
I like being called Sir, but I’m weird. Captain is OK, but I think ma’am would bother me. _Make it so…_ ---
**Author:** ![Kn\_ckers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/96bed5/32.png) [@Kn\_ckers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kn_ckers)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/8 "2003-01-02T19:50:04Z")
Anything but ma’am. Sir would be fine, Captain would be better, Lord High Ruler of All the World would be best. ---
**Author:** ![XJETGIRLX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9fc29f/32.png) [@XJETGIRLX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XJETGIRLX)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/9 "2003-01-02T19:50:59Z")
I’m with **jinwicked** on this one. I think a hearty _Yes Sir!_ would definitely make my day, but call me ma’am and you’re treading on thin ice. ---
**Author:** ![Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4da419/32.png) [@Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gala_Matrix_Fire)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/10 "2003-01-02T20:45:15Z")
Ma’am, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Yumanite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b487fb/32.png) [@Yumanite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yumanite)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/11 "2003-01-02T20:56:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by leenmi \* > \*\* > The only place I have noticed all officers called “sir”, regardless of gender, is science fiction or fantasy books, and then it was usually the truly annoying “Ser”. \*\* Hmm – been reading James Tiptree, Jr? That’s the only place I’ve ever seen the honorific “ser”. I guess I would prefer “Cap’n”, but I don’t think I would care too much one way or the other. ---
**Author:** ![Banger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@Banger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banger)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2003, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/12 "2003-01-02T21:02:27Z")
I’m pretty sure that in all the recent **Star Trek** series, not just **Voyager** , female officers were called “Sir”. ---
**Author:** ![leenmi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f1d935/32.png) [@leenmi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leenmi)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2003, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/13 "2003-01-03T00:08:09Z")
Yumanite, Modesitt and Stasheff (I’ve probably screwed up the names, but the Recluse series and the stupid Warlock series), both used it. Others have as well, and it always annoys me. Doesn’t matter, though. Females of higher ranks are referred to by rank or Ma’am, and, in the Air Force, we just ignored that there was no better way offered to call the collective besides Airmen, since Air Force members was also slightly masculine in a suggestive way. ---
**Author:** ![racer72](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/racer72/32/3075_2.png) [@racer72](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racer72)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2003, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/14 "2003-01-03T01:15:58Z")
I served under a female commanding officer while in the Navy. She was always addressed as Captain, that was her rank. When answering her questions, it was always yes maam or no maam. And calling a female officer sir would be cause for NJP (non judicial punishment). And the officer in charge of a ship is called Captain only if that is their rank. Call an admiral ‘captain’ and you would be keyholed on the yardarm. ---
**Author:** ![nashiitashii](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/7c8e57/32.png) [@nashiitashii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nashiitashii)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2003, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/15 "2003-01-03T01:46:57Z")
I’d prefer to be called by my rank, and would object outright to “sir.” “Ma’am,” OTOH, is one of those double-edged swords: it makes me feel a little old hearing it, but it’s also acknowledging that I’m a _female_ in charge. I guess I’d probably settle best with “miss/ms. [last name here]” in replacement of my rank and last name. -Indigo- ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2003, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/16 "2003-01-03T03:51:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by heresiarch \* > \*\*“Sir?” I’m only aware of one female Captain that is routinely called “Sir” – Captain Janeway on Star Trek. > > SNIP \*\* * * * ??? She told Harry Kim in the pilot episode that she didn’t want to be addressed as “sir” despite Starfleet protocols. I do recall Dr. Crusher being called “Sir” when she had to take over the bridge on time on TNG. As for me, I’d prefer Captain or ma’am. Ma’am doesn’t bother me, because my students occasionally use it, though I never asked them to. Dear lord, I am such a geek. ---
**Author:** ![Spavined\_Gelding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@Spavined\_Gelding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spavined_Gelding)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2003, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/17 "2003-01-03T05:39:25Z")
I worked with a Sergeant Major once who always called me “Captain Gelding, sir,” when ever he spoke to me. It drove me nuts. The guy was so correct that there was a feeling that he was mocking me. Others in the unit felt the same way. He also kept calling my wife “the Captain’s lady.” Thank God I did not have a dog so the stiff necked old soldier was spared inquiries about the state of health of “the Captain’s bitch.” ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2003, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/18 "2003-01-03T06:20:39Z")
AFAIK, Captain, like most ranks, is genderless. ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2003, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/19 "2003-01-03T08:26:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Anthracite \* > \*\*AFAIK, Captain, like most ranks, is genderless. \*\* I have gotten points and KP, depending on inflection. Always know where the line is with all the different people above you. If you don’t, you should not be in the military IMO. \*::see comment about KP ::: \* :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Stentor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d2c977/32.png) [@Stentor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stentor)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2003, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171/20 "2003-01-03T14:10:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by heresiarch \* > \*\*“Sir?” I’m only aware of one female Captain that is routinely called “Sir” – Captain Janeway on Star Trek. > > Is there some convention of calling a Captain “Sir” regardless of gender? Is this a Navy thing? \*\* No, It’s a Star Trek thing. The ideal society without any divisions between race or gender and so forth. Petty Officer third class Stentor [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/female-dopers-captain-sir-or-maam/146171.md?page=2)