# FemDefence **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 14, 2005, 11:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263 "2005-04-14T11:06:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Lissla\_Lissar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8491ac/32.png) [@Lissla\_Lissar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lissla_Lissar)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/21 "2005-04-14T20:01:11Z")
Chiming in to make three posters who thought of the dentata from _Snow Crash_. Ow. ---
**Author:** ![pinkfreud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pinkfreud/32/17603_2.png) [@pinkfreud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pinkfreud)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/22 "2005-04-14T20:10:17Z")
> [@Velma](#): > > How would it make a rapist angrier than fighting back any other way? Aren’t rapists likely to be most especially fond of their genitalia? Punching or poking someone in the face and shoving a spike into his wienie aren’t equivalent acts. I suspect that many men (even those who are not rapists) would rather have a sharp object poked into their eyes rather than into their penises. The emotional impact is, I think, quite different. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/23 "2005-04-14T20:12:24Z")
Consider U.S. Patent #4237876, issued December 9, 1980: > [@](#): > > An anti-rape device having a hollow housing adapted to be worn within a human vagina. [http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=/netahtml/search-bool.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&co1=AND&d=ptxt&s1=4237876.WKU.&OS=PN/4237876&RS=PN/4237876](http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=/netahtml/search-bool.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&co1=AND&d=ptxt&s1=4237876.WKU.&OS=PN/4237876&RS=PN/4237876) I’m pretty certain I’ve seen patents for several such anti-assault devices intended to be worn “inside”, dating back a century or more. (I’ve seen quite a few “crazy invention” collections) Nobody seems to be wiling to use them. ---
**Author:** ![Amp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Amp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amp)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/24 "2005-04-14T20:27:33Z")
I think a lot of you guys missed this part from the website: > [@](#): > > Femdefence is an on-going project first presented in 2003. The project includes the creation of an **imaginary** product, which bears the project’s name. The “product“ is a kind of protection against rape, somewhat similar to a tampon in that it’s user carries it inserted into her vagina. ---
**Author:** ![Scott\_Plaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Scott\_Plaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scott_Plaid)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/25 "2005-04-14T20:33:56Z")
I just finished reading **Snow Crash** , when I saw this thread, it was the first thing I thought of, and I was right. ---
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/26 "2005-04-14T20:37:00Z")
> [@Velma](#): > > How would it make a rapist angrier than fighting back any other way? Hitting, scratching, biting, etc. I was taught in self-defense class to fight back any way I can. If I have to poke his eye out I will do that too. Wouldn’t it make him double over like a groin hit anyway? Then you could escape. Also useful for cases where you would be drugged or passed out. Well then you would be fighting back with a chance of debilitating and escaping the rapist. A sharp spike carried in your hand would be far more effective than one hidden away. Though it may be possible to use this device for surprise factor, it is likely that the victim is allready subdued before the rapist attempts penitration so the few moments in which they might have the initiative against him may be very difficult to take advantage of. Realisticly unless his first penitration attempt was very hard the device would likely only scratch the tip of the penis. It would hurt, but nothing like a groin strike hurts. Damage to the penis is not nearly as painful as damage to the testes, the penis is made to take a lot of beating ( 🙂 ). ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/27 "2005-04-14T20:44:53Z")
Okay, and then the rapist yanks it out…and uses it on you? _shudder_ Besides, I’m a klutz-I can’t imagine trying to put that thing in-if you get it in WRONG (hell, women have put tampons in wrong and then they’ve hurt)… AAAAAHHH!!! ---
**Author:** ![missbunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/76d3ee/32.png) [@missbunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/missbunny)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/28 "2005-04-14T21:08:06Z")
> [@](#): > > The construction is such that the pin still cannot injure the bearer. Looking at the picture in the first post’s link, I cannot imagine how that thing would not injure the wearer. Is it retractable or something? Does that spike thingy pop out on command? The device looks smooth and slippery, and I’m sure any of you tampon-wearing ladies will confirm that sometimes they slip around and slide down farther than they are supposed to. And then you can feel them. It’s uncomfortable enough feeling a _piece of cotton_ up there - yet that lethal weapon is supposed to remain in place, unnoticed? ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/29 "2005-04-14T21:23:36Z")
> [@Amp](#): > > I think a lot of you guys missed this part from the website: I certainly didn’t miss it, but the discussion is a lot more illuminating if we roll with it as if it’s real - which is the artist’s intent. The advertisements in magazines and bus stops certainly don’t let on that the product is not planned to be actually made. The point is to get people talking, and to note one’s own reaction to the idea of such a thing. Are you a “hell yeah!” person or a “I’d hurt myself” person or a “it’d make him hurt me more” person? Each one and countless others are valid reactions that speak volumes of how we see ourselves as victims (or not) and the power struggle between rapists and victims - the interesting thing is finding out which reactions we have and the discussion that ensues. ---
**Author:** ![missbunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/76d3ee/32.png) [@missbunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/missbunny)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/30 "2005-04-14T21:51:28Z")
I for one definitely missed the “imaginary” part. ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/31 "2005-04-14T23:22:42Z")
I missed it too. I saw the words “sharp pin, penetrate,” and “penis” and my brain sorta stopped. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2005, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/32 "2005-04-14T23:54:23Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > I certainly didn’t miss it, but the discussion is a lot more illuminating if we roll with it as if it’s real - which is the artist’s intent. The advertisements in magazines and bus stops certainly don’t let on that the product is not planned to be actually made. The point is to get people talking, and to note one’s own reaction to the idea of such a thing. Are you a “hell yeah!” person or a “I’d hurt myself” person or a “it’d make him hurt me more” person? Each one and countless others are valid reactions that speak volumes of how we see ourselves as victims (or not) and the power struggle between rapists and victims - the interesting thing is finding out which reactions we have and the discussion that ensues. Well, put me in the “It doesn’t matter how women try to defend themselves. Men can and will do whatever they want” camp. The only way the frequency of sexual assault will change is if men change. ---
**Author:** ![Dubious\_Weasle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b782af/32.png) [@Dubious\_Weasle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dubious_Weasle)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/33 "2005-04-15T01:31:46Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > Seriously, the thing has a pull-string, just like a tampon. You can see it and feel it. Make sure you see no string before you go to work. Ignoring the imaginary nature of the product for a moment… If it’s simply a matter of “making sure you see no string before you go to work” how is this in any way a defense? I would imagine that rapists can check too. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 9:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/34 "2005-04-15T09:46:01Z")
[treating the question as if the device existed] Of course there’s a potential for misuse. A psychopathic female could pick men up with the sole intent of having them fall foul of her FemDefence. I don’t say it would be common, but it’s hardly out of the question. The quote in the OP mentioned something about too many of those accused of rape going unpunished. This may be unfair, but in a civilised society we only punish those who are _convicted_, not _accused_ - and given some of what I’ve seen called rape, no, I’m sorry, I don’t think women have _carte blanche_ to go about armed with a concealed deadly weapon (There was a case in the paper about a year ago, involving a snooker star and the complainant. They had consensually got naked and rolled around together, but penetration hadn’t been agreed on and when it occurred she told him to stop. He did, although not instantly, but she still dragged him into court. The court decided that he’d done nothing worthy of punishment. Tough bananas for the complainant, but tougher for him if she had been able to hand out summary mutilation without warning.) Also I could see this falling under the heading of _schlimbesserung_, if I’ve got my German right - that which is intended to make things better, but only makes them worse. The rapists whom everyone will absolutely agree most deserve to meet this fate - the proverbial knife-wielding sickos - will be the ones to suffer the least. Force will rise to meet resistance. You have to be really, really intent on not being raped to stick to your guns when the k-w.s. has the blade to your throat and says “If I get a nasty shock, it’s bye-bye carotid artery. Anything you want to tell me?”. :: really, really disappointed at seeing **Rilchiam** apparently lining up in the “All men are complicit in rape” camp :: [/ttqaitde] Does this brainwave emanate from the same Swedish woman who wanted to hit all men up with a “violence tax” to compensate women for the expectation of male violence? ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 9:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/35 "2005-04-15T09:59:14Z")
This: > [@](#): > > Force will rise to meet resistance. is why I said this: > [@](#): > > It doesn’t matter how women try to defend themselves. Men can and will do whatever they want. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/36 "2005-04-15T10:42:16Z")
**Rilch** , delete “men”, insert “rapists”, and I’ll have no quarrel with you. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/37 "2005-04-15T10:56:33Z")
Any woman can become a victim. As such, she has to consider that any man could be a rapist. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/38 "2005-04-15T12:01:34Z")
Oh boy… :smack: ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/39 "2005-04-15T12:16:48Z")
> [@Rilchiam](#): > > Any woman can become a victim. As such, she has to consider that any man could be a rapist. Any woman could be armed with a gun, but I think it would be rather sad to go through life assuming all women are planning on shooting me. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2005, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263/40 "2005-04-15T12:24:04Z")
So it’s sad. There’s no one way to defend against rape. You can only be so careful. You can only run so fast, avoid so many people, learn so many defense skills, take so many precautions. What worked for one woman didn’t work for another. The one constant in rape is a male assailant. BTW, I’ll be signing off soon, so don’t think I’m running away from this. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/femdefence/299263.md?page=3)