# Ferguson, MO **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 12, 2014, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354 "2014-08-12T04:51:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 188
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2015, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3741 "2015-01-22T19:42:43Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Holder should have a word with those [fuckwits at the NAACP](http://www.cbsnews.com/news/naacp-seeks-new-grand-jury-in-ferguson-police-shooting/). > > Regards, > Shodan > [@elucidator](#): > > **Shodan** , what in the hell are you talking about? Have you a point that would not be hidden by a hat? Clearly there is sarcasm here, but about what? Or who? > > Are you sneering at the “community members” mentioned in the article? Does their generosity offend you, somehow? Or is it simply that you refuse to even consider that the protestors had legitimate grievances? Should they simply have shut up and eaten another spoonful of shit because some assholes might have exploited the situation if they protest? > > Give us a hint, a clue if you have such. What in the _fuck_ are you talking about? Seconded. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2015, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3742 "2015-01-22T19:49:19Z")
nm - I shouldn’t feed the trolls. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2015, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3743 "2015-01-22T19:49:41Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Seconded. I believe **luci’s** “what the hell” is about the donuts post, not the NAACP post. I’m curious too – what’s wrong with the donut cite? Sounds like a community taking care of itself after some shitty people did shitty things. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2015, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3744 "2015-01-22T20:02:39Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Holder should have a word with those [fuckwits at the NAACP](http://www.cbsnews.com/news/naacp-seeks-new-grand-jury-in-ferguson-police-shooting/). > > Regards, > Shodan > [@](#): > > ST. LOUIS – A prominent civil rights organization, citing “grave legal concerns,” is asking a Missouri judge to convene a new grand jury to consider charges against the white police officer who fatally shot unarmed black 18-year-old Michael Brown. > > The NAACP’s Legal Defense and Educational Fund submitted a letter Monday to St. Louis County Circuit Judge Maura McShane. It also asks for a special prosecutor to oversee the case and an investigation of the grand jury proceedings that ended in November with a decision not to charge Officer Darren Wilson. How does that make them fuckwits? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2015, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3745 "2015-01-22T20:36:49Z")
Please see post #2037 in this thread. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3746 "2015-01-23T00:14:43Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > How does that make them fuckwits? Not sure it makes them fuckwits, but it certainly makes them disgusting pieces of shit who want “vengeance” against a demonstrably innocent man. If that’s the attitude of the “community leaders”, and if that applies to anybody it should apply to the NAACP, to a police officer who has been shown to have committed no crime, and indeed was attacked whilst doing his job, it’s no wonder that members of that community don’t have any respect for the police. In this instance at least, it’s clear the NAACP are part of the problem, not part of the solution. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3747 "2015-01-23T00:23:28Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > nm - I shouldn’t feed the trolls. > > Regards, > Shodan I hear you. A flippant sneer isn’t funny once you explain it. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3748 "2015-01-23T00:28:44Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Not sure it makes them fuckwits, but it certainly makes them disgusting pieces of shit who want “vengeance” against a demonstrably innocent man. What they want is **justice** for Michael Brown, and clearly they – and not they alone – do not consider Darren Wilson “demonstrably innocent,” and there is no legal reason why he can’t be indicted again; double jeopardy attaches only on acquittal. > [@Steophan](#): > > In this instance at least, it’s clear the NAACP are part of the problem, not part of the solution. Then you are misidentifying the problem, which is not lack of respect for the police. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3749 "2015-01-23T01:17:48Z")
There is a legal reason he can’t be tried, though, which is that there’s no actual evidence he’s guilty of a crime. I don’t give a shit whether they consider that true or not, they’re obviously not interested in justice, else they’d be supporting Wilson, and the police in general. And the big problem _is_ lack of respect for the police. Just look at the other police thread here, and see how many people are trying to twist the police either doing their jobs, or being forced to act in self defence, into them doing something wrong. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3750 "2015-01-23T01:23:32Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > There is a legal reason he can’t be tried, though, which is that there’s no actual evidence he’s guilty of a crime. I don’t give a shit whether they consider that true or not, they’re obviously not interested in justice, else they’d be supporting Wilson, and the police in general. > > And the big problem _is_ lack of respect for the police. Just look at the other police thread here, and see how many people are trying to twist the police either doing their jobs, or being forced to act in self defence, into them doing something wrong. Some of these actions are actually in a grey area, both legally and morally, and there can be reasonable disagreement. Some policemen (but not most) are not being good policemen. Pointing this out is not a lack of respect. Asserting that some police policies and practices could improve is not a lack of respect. Through most of American history, the police (along with the rest of society, but in particular the police) treated African Americans abominably. Most of the African Americans I’ve spoken to, based on their experience, tell me that this has improved a great deal, but they still believe many cops treat them differently based on race. It’s not unreasonable to believe that this problem that has existed for all of American history may still exist to a much smaller degree. Investigating and discussing this, and taking these views into account is not a lack of respect for police. Most cops are good people. I think some police policies are screwed up and can should improve. I think some small number of cops probably shouldn’t be cops. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3751 "2015-01-23T01:56:22Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > There is a legal reason he can’t be tried, though, which is that there’s no actual evidence he’s guilty of a crime. Do we have to go over [all of this](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown#Evidence) yet again? Everyone who has been following this story knows there is some evidence. Whether the evidence is sufficient to support an indictment is the grand jury’s call – and, again, that call can be made more than once by more than one grand jury, double jeopardy does not attach. Now, you might agree with Wilson’s worst detractors as to all the facts, and still deny his actions so described constitute a “crime” – but that would be a **judge’s** call. And, I hope without much hope, will be someday soon. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3752 "2015-01-23T12:04:19Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Do we have to go over [all of this](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown#Evidence) yet again? Asks the man demanding another grand jury because the first one didn’t come to the decision you want, the state couldn’t find a reason to indict, and the FBI found no evidence to recommend he be charged. It’s time to stop this witch hunt of an innocent man who’s lost his job, had his name dragged through the mud, and has to live in hiding for his own safety. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3753 "2015-01-23T14:22:27Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Now, you might agree with Wilson’s worst detractors as to all the facts, and still deny his actions so described constitute a “crime” – but that would be a **judge’s** call. No, it isn’t a judge’s call - it is a grand jury’s call, and that has already been made. And it was made abundantly clear that Wilson could not be convicted on the evidence, and therefore another grand jury is a waste of time and money (as well as pandering to idiots). The NAACP wants to drag the process out in order to attract attention to themselves, and to punish a cop for shooting a black criminal while deliberately and persistently being white. IOW and as mentioned, they’re fuckwits. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3754 "2015-01-23T16:04:46Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > What they want is **justice** for Michael Brown No they don’t. And you’re a piece of shit for perpetuating this lie. And I agree you’re just trolling at this point. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3755 "2015-01-23T16:24:30Z")
So, these protestors are just making shit up, then? They don’t really believe what they are saying, its just an opportunity to make some trouble. And all those statistics about how much more likely a black person will be shot by a policeman, that’s all just a pack of lies from the liberal media? Nothing to do with this grand jury procedure, which represents American justice at its finest, is that it? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3756 "2015-01-23T16:26:35Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > So, these protestors are just making shit up, then? They don’t really believe what they are saying, its just an opportunity to make some trouble. They _believe_ that they want justice, but what they want isn’t justice. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3757 "2015-01-23T17:06:57Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > So, these protestors are just making shit up, then? They don’t really believe what they are saying, its just an opportunity to make some trouble. Either that or, perhaps more likely, they are believing lies fed to them by the media. > [@](#): > > And all those statistics about how much more likely a black person will be shot by a policeman, that’s all just a pack of lies from the liberal media? Nothing to do with this grand jury procedure, which represents American justice at its finest, is that it? As far as I know, no Grand Jury has ever shot anyone, black or otherwise, so that’s a complete non sequitor. As for the statistic, the specific subset of young black men get shot vastly more by the police than anyone else, because they commit far more violent crime in public. Doesn’t apply to black people in general, for either part. But all that’s irrelevant. Statistics don’t show anything about whether Wilson is guilty, only evidence about the specific case can. And, based on everything that was made public at the previous Grand Jury, evidence that proves he’s guilty does not exist. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3758 "2015-01-23T17:39:49Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > …As far as I know, no Grand Jury has ever shot anyone, black or otherwise, so that’s a complete non sequitor… Da fuq? Huh? What? > [@](#): > > …As for the statistic, the specific subset of young black men get shot vastly more by the police than anyone else, because they commit far more violent crime in public. Doesn’t apply to black people in general, for either part… Oh, good, because otherwise it sounds kinda racist. Actually, sounds _totally_ racist. But you put in that proviso at the end there, so that means its not racist. So, really, its only young black men that are the problem, not black people in general. Well, good, that’s a load off my mind! ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3759 "2015-01-23T17:48:07Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > So, really, its only young black men that are the problem, not black people in general. Well, good, that’s a load off my mind! When young black men commit between 6 and 14 times as much crime as any other group, and get shot by the police 21 times as often as any other group, yes, there’s a problem, and the behaviour of both young black men and the police\* are parts of it. Pretending that the culture and behaviour of some young black men is _not_ a problem, and claiming that anyone who says it is must be racist in an attempt to shut down discussion, is also part of the problem. Some people here seem to think that racist behaviour by the police, or anyone else for that matter, justifies or excuses criminality by others. It doesn’t, it’s that simple. \*Not that any of the Ferguson shootings appear to involve any sort of police misconduct. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2015, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/3760 "2015-01-23T17:48:14Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Oh, good, because otherwise it sounds kinda racist. Actually, sounds _totally_ racist. But you put in that proviso at the end there, so that means its not racist. So, really, its only young black men that are the problem, not black people in general. Well, good, that’s a load off my mind! We can also note that the disparity in police shootings (21 times) of young black men vs young white men is far, far larger than the disparity in crimes committed (6 to 9 times). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354.md?page=187) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354.md?page=189)