# Ferguson, MO **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 12, 2014, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354 "2014-08-12T04:51:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 68
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1341 "2014-08-19T02:27:17Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > You mean like in Prague, Budapest and Dublin? Uprisings are messy by definition, the history books clean them up. Like May 4th 1970 right? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1342 "2014-08-19T03:21:37Z")
**Una** , you’re certifiable! Designated driver! _WHAT!?!_ Send your friends home in cabs, send them in\* limos\*, put it on your credit card, sell plasma if you have to but GOBBLE THAT JELLO BOOB! ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1343 "2014-08-19T04:30:13Z")
Don Lemon’s decked out in a bullet-proof vest for tonight’s dance. Jesus, folks! Go home already! ---
**Author:** ![Tangent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tangent/32/3098_2.png) [@Tangent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tangent)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1344 "2014-08-19T04:47:58Z")
Police moving in to disperse a crowd. I hope this doesn’t get uglier. ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1345 "2014-08-19T05:57:49Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > …GOBBLE THAT JELLO BOOB! That may have to become my new motto in life. The bad thing about being old enough to be her mom is, I’m old enough to be her mom. 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1346 "2014-08-19T06:03:36Z")
No matter what happened to Michael Brown, kicking out Amnesty International is incredibly tone deaf on the part of the police. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1347 "2014-08-19T06:26:26Z")
If things seem unstable in Fergusen, MO now, wait until the authorities find a way to excuse their dirty cop from (alleged) murder. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1348 "2014-08-19T06:27:11Z")
OK, now this. This is by way of _Crooks and Liars_, who have been very reliable in the past, but my reluctance is based more on the bombshell implications. Your correspondent from the conservative wing of the extreme left makes no claims, but! The story is that there was no actual theft, and the police may have edited the tape. Link here, make of it what you will. > **[Ferguson Cops Busted? New Video Seems To Show Brown Paying For Cigarillos...](https://crooksandliars.com/2014/08/ferguson-cops-busted-new-video-seems-show)** > > Ferguson police's attempts to demonize Michael Brown may have hit a small snag. Kinda have to hope it ain’t so, considering the trajectory of the shit intersecting the locus of the fan… ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1349 "2014-08-19T08:05:11Z")
Human sacrifice is apparently what they want [![](http://tinypic.com/images/goodbye.jpg) ](http://tinypic.com/images/goodbye.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 8:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1350 "2014-08-19T08:08:28Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Human sacrifice is apparently what they want > > [http://i60.tinypic.com/2pu0g35.jpg](http://i60.tinypic.com/2pu0g35.jpg) Your anger makes you very stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 8:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1351 "2014-08-19T08:39:41Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > OK, now this. This is by way of _Crooks and Liars_, who have been very reliable in the past, but my reluctance is based more on the bombshell implications. Your correspondent from the conservative wing of the extreme left makes no claims, but! > > The story is that there was no actual theft, and the police may have edited the tape. Link here, make of it what you will. > > [Ferguson Cops Busted? New Video Seems To Show Brown Paying For Cigarillos (Video) | Crooks and Liars](http://crooksandliars.com/2014/08/ferguson-cops-busted-new-video-seems-show) > > Kinda have to hope it ain’t so, considering the trajectory of the shit intersecting the locus of the fan… This is starting to go into “there were no planes” territory on the part of the people struggling to keep their “cop with no history of bad behavior just decides to just kill teenagers for no reason because racism” narrative intact. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 10:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1352 "2014-08-19T10:11:35Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Too many people are willing to believe that an officer with 6 discipline free years on the force simply saw Brown and, for no reason at all, decided to murder him. The only reason I’ve seen offered as to why he might have done this is that cops are racists thugs. > > It’s kind of hard to have an intelligent conversation when the thread heads in that direction. > > My suggestion. Let both sides speak. Let the DOJ collect all the evidence, and publish the results. Then, and only then, let’s assign blame. The willingness is twofold. One, when people are already accusing you, that’s the time to make a counterargument. The longer you wait, the more likely you are having to come up with an explanation, rather than already having one. It comes across as the cop going to his buddies with the real story and asking how to say it so it doesn’t sound incriminating. Second, the behavior of the rest of police force backs up the original determination that there was something wrong. If they are forcing reporters to stop filming and treating them like they are dangerous, it’s not hard to believe that the victim was also misjudged as dangerous. We know that the rioters are not willing to wait. They clearly don’t trust the police. Story after story shows the black citizens of city talking about how they are mistreated by the police. The number of black people arrested and jailed is extremely out of proportion to the population. It is in that light that people assume there must be racial motivations involved. The only people I’ve seen argue that the guy just decided to shoot a black guy because of racism is the people on the cops side. It appears to be a strawman used to discredit those who think the cop is wrong. If there actually are any who believe that, they were being idiots even before we found out more information. ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1353 "2014-08-19T10:21:29Z")
Someone posted this [link](http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/crime/officers-remember-pcp-fueled-shootout-in-college-park/2014/07/09/b30a9146-fb02-11e3-b1f4-8e77c632c07b_story.html) earlier about being shot while high on PCP: One the final paragraphs > [@](#): > > For a few minutes, Simms said, it seemed it would be impossible to stop McKoy. After officers thought McKoy pulled out had a second gun, police shot him several more times. Despite the bullet wounds, McKoy tried to steal two police cruisers, crashing one into the wall of a nearby fast-food restaurant. By the end of the night, McKoy had been shot multiple times, pepper sprayed and zapped by stun guns before he was finally subdued. It was interesting to me because l used to live one block over from the street where this started, across from the University of MD. Two years later and about a mile down the road after this justifiable use of deadly force (although the guy woke up in the hospital the next day with no recollection of the incident.), the same department (Prince Georges County) arrested a bunch of students during a celebration of a basketball win over hated Duke. Since the students had been known to riot after Duke games, the University, County, and Park police were out in force—and looking for a fight according to one student’s lawyer. His client was charged with assaulting mounted police, resisting arrest, disorderly conduct, public intoxication and probably more. His injuries were reported a resulting from being kicked by one of the assaulted horses and not from the arrest. It wasn’t until a cell phone [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAPwyodTkYA) showed up days later after a public appeal by his lawyer that it became apparent that County police jumped him for no reason an beat the shit out of him. Maybe both sides are lying in this case. Looks doubtful he was shot in the back like his buddy said. I’m tending to favor the cop here, but what happened at my alma mater gives me pause. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1354 "2014-08-19T10:32:20Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Are you sitting by yourself or are there other people in the room with you? Is the window open? It’s just the wind entering through his ears and swirling around the empty chamber that is his head. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 10:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1355 "2014-08-19T10:34:13Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > OK, now this. This is by way of _Crooks and Liars_, who have been very reliable in the past, but my reluctance is based more on the bombshell implications. Your correspondent from the conservative wing of the extreme left makes no claims, but! > > The story is that there was no actual theft, and the police may have edited the tape. Link here, make of it what you will. > > [Ferguson Cops Busted? New Video Seems To Show Brown Paying For Cigarillos (Video) | Crooks and Liars](http://crooksandliars.com/2014/08/ferguson-cops-busted-new-video-seems-show) > > Kinda have to hope it ain’t so, considering the trajectory of the shit intersecting the locus of the fan… The story you cite claims that the independent autopsy showed a bullet entering back to front. I didn’t see that claim in the autopsy, and the diagram I linked earlier shows all entry wounds. Since Crooks and Liars is usually so reliable, can you help me understand the difference? ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 10:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1356 "2014-08-19T10:36:43Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Now your complaint is he didn’t kill him quick enough? What the fuck is wrong with you? Do you actually have a position here, or are you just trolling? > Actually I think we all know the answer to the last question. Dude, you’re the one who just suddenly showed back up when the SDMB started discussing another unarmed black kid being shot. Even just checked your posting history to make sure I wasn’t just seeing things, and you haven’t even posted in any other thread. And your posts in this thread seem to indicate you spoiling for a fight. Your schtick of taking people out of context or otherwise deliberately misunderstanding them does get old. His complaint is clearly that he has trouble seeing why it would take that many bullets to bring the guy down. I’d say your misinterpretations come off more like trolling than anything 'luci has said. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1357 "2014-08-19T10:51:09Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > No, death is an unfortunate side effect of a reasonable response to assault. I think this gives proper context to the events being discussed. Well said. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1358 "2014-08-19T11:36:35Z")
Well personally what I’m seeing in Ferguson is part of a much bigger problem which is the growing gap between rich and poor and the trouble that even hard working people are finding it to make ends meet. Sadly blacks are getting the worse of it. It wouldnt take much for more of the working class to jump into this. The government needs to address the issue before it gets any worse. Sadly in the US the rich control both parties. ---
**Author:** ![Sinaptics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Sinaptics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaptics)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1359 "2014-08-19T11:40:59Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > The story you cite claims that the independent autopsy showed a bullet entering back to front. > > I didn’t see that claim in the autopsy, and the diagram I linked earlier shows all entry wounds. > > Since Crooks and Liars is usually so reliable, can you help me understand the difference? It’s in Baden’s autopsy report: [http://www.thewire.com/national/2014/08/michael-browns-family-addresses-preliminary-autopsy-results/378686/](http://www.thewire.com/national/2014/08/michael-browns-family-addresses-preliminary-autopsy-results/378686/) [http://aattp.org/baden-no-evidence-of-a-struggle-between-michael-brown-and-murderer-video/](http://aattp.org/baden-no-evidence-of-a-struggle-between-michael-brown-and-murderer-video/) ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2014, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354/1360 "2014-08-19T12:11:51Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > It’s in Baden’s autopsy report: > > [http://www.thewire.com/national/2014/08/michael-browns-family-addresses-preliminary-autopsy-results/378686/](http://www.thewire.com/national/2014/08/michael-browns-family-addresses-preliminary-autopsy-results/378686/) > > [http://aattp.org/baden-no-evidence-of-a-struggle-between-michael-brown-and-murderer-video/](http://aattp.org/baden-no-evidence-of-a-struggle-between-michael-brown-and-murderer-video/) Interesting. Apparently the NY Times article either didn’t include some of Dr. Baden’s comments, or Baden reconsidered his interpretation prior to yesterday’s press conference. I wonder how the other autopsies will interpret the wounds. I have to say, the inconsistencies in public statements, witness stories and official actions seem to me to be worse than the usual confusion and speculation of most sensational stories. From the “strong arm robbery” video that wasn’t, to the police chief’s changing and contradictory statements, to the incomplete or revised private autopsy report, to the bipolar police approach to protests and rioting, none of this makes a whole hell of a lot of sense. It seems we can’t assume any particular statement made by anyone involved -public official or witness or hired consultant- to have been made in good faith. And I don’t trust the reporting to be so either, particularly with predominance of private tweets reported as news. I feel a bit ashamed having participated in the public speculation-accusation-retaliation cycle, but there’s seemingly no other way to even discuss social events now days. Og help us all. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354.md?page=67) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ferguson-mo/695354.md?page=69)