# Fictional works where the revealed mystery is awesome **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 30, 2012, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225 "2012-01-30T21:04:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2012, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/41 "2012-02-05T20:08:40Z")
> [@qubed](#): > > A lot of these (Oldboy, Chinatown, Usual Suspects) of these don’t seem like mysteries that are revealed, but rather unsuspected twist endings. I’ve never seen \*Oldboy \*and I more or less agree with you about _Chinatown_, but I’d say part of the mystery of _The Usual Suspects_ is who Keyser Soze is and how he operates – if he’s even real. The ending does explain this. ---
**Author:** ![bashere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/779978/32.png) [@bashere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bashere)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2012, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/42 "2012-02-05T20:50:54Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > Only Forward by Michael Marshall Smith. > [Amazon.com: Only Forward: A Novel: 9780553579703: Smith, Michael Marshall: Books](http://www.amazon.com/Only-Forward-Michael-Marshall-Smith/dp/0553579703/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1328061535&sr=8-1) > > I found the big reveal to be very well done and somewhat devastating. I came in here to post this, believing I was the only person on the planet who had read that book. Also, the reveal in Spares (the Gap, not the reason for the title). ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2012, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/43 "2012-02-05T21:29:11Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > I’ve never seen \*Oldboy \*and I more or less agree with you about _Chinatown_, but I’d say part of the mystery of _The Usual Suspects_ is who Keyser Soze is and how he operates – if he’s even real. The ending does explain this. I think the even better thing with TUS is that, even after the ending we still don’t really know either way. Sure…he _could_ be Keyser Soze, or he could be an intermediary, or even just a smart guy cashing in on a myth. Anyhow, that’s another thread. I dropped by to say that the ending of Life on Mars/Ashes to Ashes was wonderfully done. I couldn’t see how it would tie up the loose ends in an emotionally satisfying way, but it did. Perhaps I’m just a big old softy but I certainly had a lump in my throat. ---
**Author:** ![Atomic\_Alex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atomic_alex/32/175_2.png) [@Atomic\_Alex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomic_Alex)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2012, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/44 "2012-02-05T21:45:19Z")
> [@Zsofia](#): > > Well, it follows the story as far as I remember, but > > there’s a King Kong-style stop motion Chthulu at the end that ought to suck but IMHO was AWESOME. There’s two big set pieces in the movie - the Louisiana cult and the ship with the island, and both have this wonderful dreamlike quality. > > The scenes where people are sitting and talking to each other are amateurish. The scenes where stuff happens are fantastic. > > ETA - and somebody obviously shares my nitpick rage about bad fake old newspaper clippings in movies - the ones in this one are perfect. Thanks, that does sound interesting. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2012, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/45 "2012-02-05T23:01:09Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > I think the even better thing with TUS is that, even after the ending we still don’t really know either way. Sure…he _could_ be Keyser Soze, or he could be an intermediary, or even just a smart guy cashing in on a myth. The Hungarian identifies Kevin Spacey as “Keyser Soze,” not one of Soze’s men and not as Verbal Kint. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2012, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/46 "2012-02-05T23:50:06Z")
> [@Disposable Hero](#): > > Thanks, that does sound interesting. I have that stop motion [Cthulhu movie](http://www.cthulhulives.org/cocmovie/). It is quite excellent. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/47 "2012-02-06T00:24:38Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > The Hungarian identifies Kevin Spacey as “Keyser Soze,” not one of Soze’s men and not as Verbal Kint. Yes, no harm in perpetuating the myth eh? How would a lowly hungarian merchant seaman know what he looks like anyway? ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/48 "2012-02-06T01:17:25Z")
> [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](#): > > Awww, man, my library system doesn’t have it. Is it worth ordering on Amazon? Ellery Queen is fun reading, but a LOT dated. They were written back in the good old days of puzzle mysteries with twist endings; I enjoyed them a lot. They’re worth reading, so long as you know what you’re getting into. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/49 "2012-02-06T01:20:20Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > Yes, no harm in perpetuating the myth eh? How would a lowly hungarian merchant seaman know what he looks like anyway? Kint’s story about Keyser Soze in Turkey involved a feud with a Hungarian gang. If anyone would know, it would be another member of that same Hungarian gang. ---
**Author:** ![typoink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@typoink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/typoink)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/50 "2012-02-06T03:40:56Z")
Not trying to derail, but just wanted to mention regarding The Usual Suspects: I’ve always been a little confused just how “twist” the ending really is. I watched it having been incorrectly spoiled: I was under the impression that the ending was that Keyser Soze didn’t exist and his name was a boogeyman somebody was using. The weird thing is that, watching the movie, the whole time I thought it was supposed to be setting up Spacey-as-Soze as a false twist – like it was so obvious that he was going to turn out to be Keyser Soze that it would be a huge twist when he wasn’t. When he _was_, it really surprised me, but only because it felt so obvious and I’d always heard TUS hinged on a big twist ending. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/51 "2012-02-06T04:04:06Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > I think the even better thing with TUS is that, even after the ending we still don’t really know either way. Sure…he _could_ be Keyser Soze, or he could be an intermediary, or even just a smart guy cashing in on a myth. > > . I always wondered why they didn’t contact authorities internationally to try to substantiate some of the stories, surely SOME record exists somewhere in the world. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/52 "2012-02-06T04:22:15Z")
> [@grude](#): > > I always wondered why they didn’t contact authorities internationally to try to substantiate some of the stories, surely SOME record exists somewhere in the world. They likely did. Which is why several parts of Kint’s story have to be true: [spoiler]\* The lineup. - The heist from the New York’s Finest Taxi Service. - Fenster’s death (though it’s possible this was a fake as his body may not have been found).[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/53 "2012-02-06T04:40:48Z")
> [@typoink](#): > > Not trying to derail, but just wanted to mention regarding The Usual Suspects: > > I’ve always been a little confused just how “twist” the ending really is. I watched it having been incorrectly spoiled: I was under the impression that the ending was that Keyser Soze didn’t exist and his name was a boogeyman somebody was using. The weird thing is that, watching the movie, the whole time I thought it was supposed to be setting up Spacey-as-Soze as a false twist – like it was so obvious that he was going to turn out to be Keyser Soze that it would be a huge twist when he wasn’t. When he _was_, it really surprised me, but only because it felt so obvious and I’d always heard TUS hinged on a big twist ending. It’s been so long since I’ve seen the movie that I can’t be sure, but I think there’s enough left unexplained that the incorrect spoilers you received could be considered a reasonable interpretation of the ending even if it’s not explicitly what was revealed. [spoiler]Maybe there’s a sort of Dread Pirate Roberts thing going on with Keyser Soze. Perhaps the Kevin Spacey character (the name he gave to the police was Verbal Kint) wasn’t the original Soze, but stepped into the role after the original Soze died, or after Kint worked out that there was no original Soze and the whole thing was a myth. I do remember not being very surprised by the ending of _The Usual Suspects_ because the Kint persona seemed so stupid and useless that I couldn’t believe he was for real. I can’t recall if I actually realized he was Keyser Soze, but I know I thought he was putting on an act and was misleading the police.[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 9:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/54 "2012-02-06T09:02:45Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Kint’s story about Keyser Soze in Turkey involved a feud with a Hungarian gang. If anyone would know, it would be another member of that same Hungarian gang. I see I’ve painted myself into a corner here, I’m not suggesting that any single interpretation is absolutely correct. Your suggestion here makes perfect sense as do other alternatives. What I’m saying is that the ending pull the trick (the greatest trick?) of a satisfying conclusion with multiple valid interpretations. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGauss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/karlgauss/32/3713_2.png) [@KarlGauss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGauss)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/55 "2012-02-06T09:42:04Z")
What? No-one’s mentioned [Sleuth](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0069281/combined)? Either I’m misremembering it or I’m dating myself. Neither one’s particularly appealing! ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/56 "2012-02-06T11:58:57Z")
> [@bashere](#): > > I came in here to post this, believing I was the only person on the planet who had read that book. Also, the reveal in Spares (the Gap, not the reason for the title). …ha ha! I too came in to post this, for practically the same reason, believing that I too was the only one on the planet who had read the book. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/57 "2012-02-06T12:31:46Z")
> [@KarlGauss](#): > > What? No-one’s mentioned [Sleuth](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0069281/combined)? Either I’m misremembering it or I’m dating myself. Neither one’s particularly appealing! Actually, even better than Sleuth, to my mind, was its half-brother **The Last of Sheila**. But I don’t think it’s awesome, just an excellent by-the-rules mystery. To me, _awesome_ is more the Sense-of-Wonder things I described upthread. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGauss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/karlgauss/32/3713_2.png) [@KarlGauss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGauss)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2012, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225/58 "2012-02-06T13:10:05Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Actually, even better than Sleuth, to my mind, was its half-brother **The Last of Sheila**. > But I don’t think it’s awesome, just an excellent by-the-rules mystery. To me, _awesome_ is more the Sense-of-Wonder things I described upthread. Indeed. The Last of Sheila was another excellent 1970’s mystery. That being said, the copy I watched most recently was almost unwatchable - very, very dark; sometimes virtually impossible to see the characters. Almost ruined a terrific movie. Almost. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fictional-works-where-the-revealed-mystery-is-awesome/611225.md?page=2)