# Fighting a bear... **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 9, 2005, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083 "2005-02-09T00:01:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/41 "2005-02-09T16:26:25Z")
> [@Laughing Lagomorph](#): > > BTW I hear Billy Pilgrim has come unstuck in time. True, but he’s been in Montana ever since! I just wanna say that I got the Lord Of The Flies reference and laughed myself silly. I also remembered the pepper spray & bells joke and was hoping to crack that one off myself. Gizzlies don’t climb trees–no clavicles, is that right? And they also don’t run well downhill for the same reason. But you shouldn’t run from a bear or any earth-spawned predator anyway because “dinner runs” and if they weren’t thinking about eating you before, you have just demonstrated that you are a tasty treat indeed. So no rifles on a trip to the Canadian outback. What about pointed sticks? Big, sturdy ones for poking, not throwing. No…best not to piss off a bear. Ever wrestle a trained black bear? You can’t win. I bet even an untrained one would be pretty good. And their claws are longer and more useful than yours. If for some reason you get into it with even a black bear 50 miles from the trail head, you will become part of the local ecology. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/42 "2005-02-09T17:55:36Z")
Since no one has done it yet, I might as well be the one to advise you to file off the sights of your pistol before you go into bear country. That way it won’t hurt so much when the bear takes it away from you and shoves it up your ass. Seriously, taking a gun on the off chance you’ll need to shoot a bear is probably not the best way to handle the situation. Sure, you can kill a bear with a gun sometimes. But if you are in a situation where you have a good chance of killing the bear with your gun you are probably better off not shooting it anyway. If the bear isn’t attacking you, you should try to warn it off and do all the standard things…make noise, not run away, not leave food out, give the bear your food if he asks for it, etc. If the bear is attacking you, you probably won’t have the time or the reflexes to shoot him before he mauls you. Are you that good a shot that you can draw your weapon and get off a disabling shot in the 5 seconds or so that you’ll have? If the bear is charging you, you won’t have time to shoot it. If it’s not charging you, you won’t want to shoot it because you don’t want to piss it off. Either way, there probably will never come a time when a gun would be a useful tool against a bear. ---
**Author:** ![danceswithcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9e8a1a/32.png) [@danceswithcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/danceswithcats)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/43 "2005-02-09T18:15:40Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > If the bear is charging you, you won’t have time to shoot it. If it’s not charging you, you won’t want to shoot it because you don’t want to piss it off. Now I have to ask the question, how much do bears charge? Do they accept American Express? ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/44 "2005-02-09T19:05:42Z")
> [@danceswithcats](#): > > Now I have to ask the question, how much do bears charge? Do they accept American Express? No. [announcer voice] So, if you’re going to Alaska, don’t forget your Visa card. Because Smokey doesn’t take American Express. Visa…it’s everywhere you want to avoid. [/announcer voice] Stranger ---
**Author:** ![BF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b5ac83/32.png) [@BF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BF)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/45 "2005-02-09T19:59:01Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > If the bear is charging you, you won’t have time to shoot it. If it’s not charging you, you won’t want to shoot it because you don’t want to piss it off. Either way, there probably will never come a time when a gun would be a useful tool against a bear. I must respectfully disagree. There are many recorded instances where a handgun or rifle was used to stop an attacking bear, just check out any hunting magazines. The links I posted previously are to firearms commonly called “guide guns” and are carried by game wardens, hunting guides and the like from Montana to Alaska. They are big bore, short length, short action and designed to be absolutely lethal inside 30-50 yards. It has already been established that the OP cannot bring a handgun into Canada. However, there are a number of handguns made specifically for big North American game, such as moose and elk, in which bears (Grizz, Brown, and Black) are included. On a side note, one of my shooting partners brought back a 300 lb black bear from Maine with a bow two years ago. His backup gun was a Ruger Redhawk in .44 magnum. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/46 "2005-02-09T22:44:28Z")
> [@Duckster](#): > > I hope you meant this in jest because you never would have made it through my scout troop with that type of opinion. This is GQ so I’ll just leave it at that. I don’t know about the OP but do remember that not everyone is from the US. Here in the UK, for example, bears are not found in the wild. ---
**Author:** ![N9IWP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/n9iwp/32/3154_2.png) [@N9IWP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N9IWP)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2005, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/47 "2005-02-09T22:59:44Z")
Re: fighting bears: \ Nuke 'em from orbit, it is the only way to be sure \ Brian ---
**Author:** ![Bag\_of\_Mostly\_Water](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bag_of_mostly_water/32/1029_2.png) [@Bag\_of\_Mostly\_Water](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bag_of_Mostly_Water)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/48 "2005-02-10T01:01:17Z")
> [@](#): > > Now that’s absolutely true, and they’re clever bastards about it, too. People often hang food, but they’re strong and smart enough to bring it down if they’re determined. You’re better off with a [bear-proof canister](http://www.rei.com/product/4877.htm?) (and they are required in some places), which you can find in any outdoor store. [This](http://www.rei.com/online/store/ProductDisplay?storeId=8000&catalogId=40000008000&productId=47830865&parent_category_rn=5760752&vcat=REI_SEARCH) canister is better. Large bears can and will break into the Garcia ones referenced. ---
**Author:** ![racer72](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/racer72/32/3075_2.png) [@racer72](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racer72)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/49 "2005-02-10T01:31:57Z")
[Kick em in the nards…](http://www.visit4info.com/details.cfm?adid=1976&type=coolad) ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/50 "2005-02-10T07:33:23Z")
> [@Ex\_Chemist](#): > > [This](http://www.rei.com/online/store/ProductDisplay?storeId=8000&catalogId=40000008000&productId=47830865&parent_category_rn=5760752&vcat=REI_SEARCH) canister is better. Large bears can and will break into the Garcia ones referenced. Hmmm. Have you had personal experience with this type of canister or know of a study about it? REI carries both, and I picked the Garcia because in casually handlin both the mechanism on the Garcia seems more secure. (The hatch opens inward, and is held in place with inset quarter-turn “knobs”.) I haven’t done or read of any testing comparing one to the other. The Bear Vault (that you reference) looks like it is more convenient to use (and clear to boot, whereas the Garcia is black.) I’m not contesting your opinion; I’m just curious as to your assessment. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Valgard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/7feea3/32.png) [@Valgard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valgard)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/51 "2005-02-10T07:51:43Z")
> [@Stranger On A Train](#): > > Hmmm. Have you had personal experience with this type of canister or know of a study about it? > > REI carries both, and I picked the Garcia because in casually handlin both the mechanism on the Garcia seems more secure. (The hatch opens inward, and is held in place with inset quarter-turn “knobs”.) I haven’t done or read of any testing comparing one to the other. The Bear Vault (that you reference) looks like it is more convenient to use (and clear to boot, whereas the Garcia is black.) > > I’m not contesting your opinion; I’m just curious as to your assessment. > > Stranger We brought both on my last trip to Mount Whitney. No bears attempted to get in so can’t say which one is better when Yogi drops by for a midnight snack. I found the plain one with the catches easier for a human to open than the clear one which was a pain. I think both are pretty pick-proof from a bear’s perspective but dunno about the crush test. However as I was packing up at home my roommate asked to take a look at the black one (with the little catches you turn with a coin or whatever). You can see this coming a mile away I’m sure. He sat on the couch getting increasingly frustrated trying to open the damn thing while I laughed so hard my ribs hurt. Back on-topic (or at least a little closer to it) my old college roomie did a 10-day canoe trip waaaaay up north where the mosquitoes are plentiful and the bears are big and hungry. Everyone took turns standing guard with a 12ga loaded up with slugs. Dunno if that’d kill an angry grizzly but it’d probably make it think twice. ---
**Author:** ![Bag\_of\_Mostly\_Water](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bag_of_mostly_water/32/1029_2.png) [@Bag\_of\_Mostly\_Water](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bag_of_Mostly_Water)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/52 "2005-02-10T16:40:17Z")
Last summer while backpacking near Kearsarge Pass we met a couple who had a bear break into their Garcia canister. The bear pushed really hard on the cover, broke the flange which holds the cover in place, and then pushed the cover inside. This happened near Yosemite – the bears there are very aggressive. The other canister I referenced (I didn’t see a manufacturer) can’t be broken into in this manner. The entire lid screws on. It’s also a bit larger and lighter, but does cost $10 more. What I was told was that the Garcia canister is fine for nearly all situations. It’s certainly better than nothing. However, if you need to buy a new canister, you should buy the new style. ---
**Author:** ![EmeraldGrue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dc4da7/32.png) [@EmeraldGrue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EmeraldGrue)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/53 "2005-02-10T19:20:57Z")
To reinforce the point: come on, you don’t need a gun. If you take the right precautions, you won’t have to fight bears. Keep your food (or anything else a bear might want, like beer or whatever) secure and a good distance away from your tent. Scare things off with loud noises. Now, the raccoons…those are the devil! _sigh_ Trigger-happy Americans… ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/54 "2005-02-10T19:46:28Z")
> [@Ex\_Chemist](#): > > What I was told was that the Garcia canister is fine for nearly all situations. It’s certainly better than nothing. However, if you need to buy a new canister, you should buy the new style. Okay, thanks for the response. BTW, what do you do with the container in camp? I notice that some people hang it (which just seems like a waste of time to me), but I usually just throw a laminated wire-rope around a small tree or branch just to keep it from wandering off and call it good. I figure if the bear is that interested it’s better just to make it accessible and let him get frustrated quickly rather than have him hang around, climbing the tree and leaping at it to bring it down. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/55 "2005-02-10T21:08:34Z")
> [@EmeraldGrue](#): > > _sigh_ Trigger-happy Americans… Yeah, we’re all alike. All 300 million of us. We all think the same, and we all want to shoot everything that moves. Give it a rest. _sigh_ Intolerant furriners ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/56 "2005-02-10T21:31:56Z")
**Scarface Z** , a [moment](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=301765) of your time, please. ---
**Author:** ![BF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b5ac83/32.png) [@BF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BF)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/57 "2005-02-11T13:49:47Z")
Yo, **Scarface** ya didn’t forget about your thread did ya? I’m curious to see what decision you’ve made concerning your OP. ---
**Author:** ![Scarface\_Z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/50afbb/32.png) [@Scarface\_Z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scarface_Z)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/58 "2005-02-11T20:25:54Z")
> [@BF](#): > > Yo, **Scarface** ya didn’t forget about your thread did ya? I’m curious to see what decision you’ve made concerning your OP. No I didn’t forget, just momentarily occupied with college life. Anyhow, I’m glad i asked. I’m quite glad that a gun would be useless, and I look forward to hiking in a forest and not worrying too much about being mistaken for game and shot. I’m going to look into those bear canisters (or rather anti-bear) and maybe get my friends to chip in and buy one. We’ll see, I have to get in touch with them and lay down some details (they are at other colleges). Thanks for the info guys! 🙂 Hey, compensating with a gun is much cheaper than buying a porsche… ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/59 "2005-02-11T21:13:07Z")
> [@Scarface Z](#): > > I’m going to look into those bear canisters (or rather anti-bear) and maybe get my friends to chip in and buy one. We’ll see, I have to get in touch with them and lay down some details (they are at other colleges). For large groups out for a long time, the bear canisters can pose some problems, as they are relatively small. You should also plan on hanging food, cookware, toiletries, etc. In some places (like the Adirondacks starting next year) they will be required due to the huge problems with bears. There, canisters are really the only way to safeguard your food. ---
**Author:** ![Scarface\_Z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/50afbb/32.png) [@Scarface\_Z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scarface_Z)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083/60 "2005-02-11T21:28:44Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > For large groups out for a long time, the bear canisters can pose some problems, as they are relatively small. This is why I was unfamiliar with canisters as all my previous trips have been with large groups (e.g. my scout troop). We alway hung our food and stuff. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-a-bear/289083.md?page=4)