# Fighting depression. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 20, 2009, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996 "2009-12-20T22:52:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![freckafree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/freckafree/32/3050_2.png) [@freckafree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/freckafree)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/21 "2009-12-21T13:08:48Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > But I am considering medication (and hope to get on a CBT scheme too). Does anyone know what kind of non-SSRI antidepressants out there, and their effectiveness and contraindications? Wellbutrin (bupropion) is one that’s been around for quite a while. There are several others. However, get thee to your psychiatrist and have him/her work with you on the medication issue, because everybody reacts differently. **torie,** I don’t have a whole lot to add that hasn’t already been said (and said better) by others, so I’ll just offer my support. I, too, suffer from chronic depression. I second **Markxxx** ’s advice about researching side effects on the Internet. The people who have good experiences with a particular medication are generally NOT the ones who post in forums about side effects. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/22 "2009-12-21T13:11:54Z")
**fessie** , the title of that book is one of my favorite quotes! It sounds phenomenal. I MUST check it out! ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/23 "2009-12-21T13:18:25Z")
> [@olivesmarch4th](#): > > **fessie** , the title of that book is one of my favorite quotes! It sounds phenomenal. I MUST check it out! 🆒 I’m confident you’d enjoy it! This one \*\* 38. We must learn the power of living with our helplessness. \*\* really resonates with me right now - I SO don’t want to visit my flaws on my children, yet constantly trying to police myself is exhausting and ultimately self-defeating. It just puts me in a state of doubt and anxiety. I was just thinking that I need to accept that I really _can’t_ protect them from my imperfect self - and they’ll survive me. ---
**Author:** ![kaiwik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaiwik/32/3978_2.png) [@kaiwik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaiwik)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/24 "2009-12-21T13:33:55Z")
Since I am in the midst of a dark period in my life all I can really do is echo that meds have, literally, saved my life. They don’t make everything fabulous, but they keep me off the emotional roller coaster. Feel free to pm or email me anytime, I’ll be in the basement digging holes. ---
**Author:** ![Crowbar\_of\_Irony\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f08c70/32.png) [@Crowbar\_of\_Irony\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crowbar_of_Irony_3)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/25 "2009-12-21T13:45:49Z")
There isn’t anything I can say that others had not, but just to let you know, **torie** , things do get better. ---
**Author:** ![Antigen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/848f3c/32.png) [@Antigen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antigen)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/26 "2009-12-21T13:55:25Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > My experience with meds for depression is that they don’t change who I am, or make me some godawful perky bimbo – they just get me in a place where life doesn’t suck. I second this. The medication gets me to a place where I can actually use the tools I’ve learned in CBT sessions. Without the meds, I look at my exercises and decide they’re retarded and will never help me. I keep trying to get off the meds but I can’t seem to go more than a few months without slipping back into the dark places. I’ve come to the conclusion that my problem is likely chemical and I’ll need these pills for a very long time. But (and this is big) the pills don’t do enough on their own. Getting past the depression and breaking down the bad patterns of thinking is hard work. But it can be done. Good luck, and please come back to talk to us about it. ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/27 "2009-12-21T18:16:29Z")
Go for the medication. I’ve been on prescription since I was ten or so, and it’s probably not an exaggeration to say that Zoloft saved my sanity. I haven’t noticed any real side effects (although it’s hard to say what’s a side effect, given that I’ve been taking it for a stright decade). You’ll be amazed at how much difference even a partial cure makes. ---
**Author:** ![MLS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/919ad9/32.png) [@MLS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MLS)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/28 "2009-12-21T18:23:59Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > … > One thing I’d really like to stress is that medication alone for the rest of your life is not the answer. I strongly recommend that you see an effective counsellor, too - someone who moves you forward in treatment, not someone who just wants to talk about your childhood for an hour a week for the rest of your life… I have to nitpick here. You don’t know whether the she will need meds for the rest of her life or not. Counseling may (or may not) be helpful, along with all of the other fine suggestions. But it’s entirely possible that there may be a chemical imbalance that will need correction through medication. I know I tried EVERYTHING that was previously mentioned. Nothing helped me until I was on Paxil for a few weeks. Nothing. And I tried them all with the serious belief that each one would be the answer. Please note I’m not saying my answer is everyone’s answer, but nobody’s answer is everyone’s answer. ---
**Author:** ![torie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/77aa72/32.png) [@torie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/torie)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/29 "2009-12-21T18:50:21Z")
All these responses are thoughtful and rational, which is exactly what I need right now. Thank you. **Olives** , I’m glad you responded. Your response to the life you’ve lived is inspiring to me. CBT is something I’ll ask my doctor about (maybe he can give me a referral.) and I’ve put those books on my wishlist on Amazon, since I always end up with Visa Giftcards for Christmas. I’m going to do a workbook in absence of anything else, since you said those are effective. **Cat Whisperer** , you aren’t out to lunch at all. I don’t have a car, so I really don’t get to indulge interests unless other people are willing to accompany me. So I sit in the house all day long (Someone mentioned triggers. That’s a huge one.) unless I’m in school or I end up doing what other people like. I don’t know anyone around here that doesn’t find museums, plays, operas, comic books, gaming and history tedious. That was fine when I could carry myself to the things that inspired me and made me happy, but now it’s tiresome. I do feel like I’m constantly fitting myself in the wrong peg as a result. Cosmetology is great and I love it, but I hate the people I go to school with. This can be a very incestuous, catty, mean industry. I’ve been trying to work on my self-esteem to be able to do what I love and deal, but it’s hard to get picked on for being different all the time. I’m 27 years old, there’s no reason I should feel like I went back to high school. **Fessie** , the hormonal angle is interesting. The depression seems to have started at about the same time as my migraines, interestingly enough. Another question for my doctor. I’m feeling a little better today. I got out finally last night and took my sons to the holiday lights and to see Santa, got into the Christmas spirit a little. Plus, this thread is enabling me to step back from the blackness and think about it logically, which from my reading on CBT, is sort of the point, right? Similar approach anyway? I definitely need more logic in my life when I’m in these slumps, but it’s hard to think that way. ---
**Author:** ![Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/bc8723/32.png) [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unauthorized_Cinnamon)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/30 "2009-12-21T19:04:05Z")
**torie** , I’m glad things are letting up a bit. You deserve to feel better. For those who are interested, I’ve formed a CBT support group thread [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=544772). ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/31 "2009-12-21T19:42:38Z")
> [@Antigen](#): > > I second this. The medication gets me to a place where I can actually use the tools I’ve learned in CBT sessions. Without the meds, I look at my exercises and decide they’re retarded and will never help me. I keep trying to get off the meds but I can’t seem to go more than a few months without slipping back into the dark places. I’ve come to the conclusion that my problem is likely chemical and I’ll need these pills for a very long time. But (and this is big) the pills don’t do enough on their own. Getting past the depression and breaking down the bad patterns of thinking is hard work. But it can be done. > > Good luck, and please come back to talk to us about it. For me, I can use the CBT tools unmedicated. And they seem to keep things from getting WORSE, but they don’t help - because I CANNOT stop the thoughts. I’m not rational. I know I’m not rational, but that doesn’t keep me from thinking. Medicated, I don’t need them. When I use them, my results don’t show my thinking is screwed up and so they are pretty useless. ---
**Author:** ![Kelby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a587f6/32.png) [@Kelby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kelby)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/32 "2009-12-21T19:53:49Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > I want to second (third?) this. It works for anxiety, too (anxiety and depression often go hand-in-hand). Positive thoughts stimulate the same part of the brain as Selective Serotonin Re-uptake Inhibitors (SSRIs like Paxil), and the goal of CBT is to get you weaned off those negative thoughts and into the habit of more positive thoughts. If you’re thinking now, “I tried thinking positively, but it didn’t make any difference,” it might be because you were trying to go from, “I suck. I can’t do anything right.” to “I’m a great person! Everything’s wonderful!” and you didn’t believe the positive thoughts, because they weren’t true - everything _isn’t_ wonderful. You have to ease yourself off the negative thoughts and into the positive ones; things like, “I don’t feel great today, but I’m going to get up and have a shower anyway. I usually feel better when I’m clean and dressed.” > > Fresh air, sunshine and \*\*exercise \*\*are also your first line of defense against depression. There are physical reasons for why these things help lift a mood. > > One thing I’d really like to stress is that medication alone for the rest of your life is not the answer. I strongly recommend that you see an effective counsellor, too - someone who moves you forward in treatment, not someone who just wants to talk about your childhood for an hour a week for the rest of your life. > > I get the impression from your OP that you are not happy with your life as it is, and taking medication for your depression is not going to change the fact that you aren’t living the life you want to live. The depression may be a symptom of you forcing yourself to be someone you don’t want to be. Any thoughts on that? Am I completely out to lunch? Good points all, but I want to emphasize the exercise point: The sedentary lifestyle many of us leads feeds into those depressive moods. You can make your own feel-good drugs through vigorous exercise. It ain’t easy, but it’s part of the solution, I think. ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/33 "2009-12-21T20:00:03Z")
I didn’t realize you were so young! Yeah, being in your 20’s is rough. I remember age 27 as especially lousy for some reason. The nice thing about the cosmetology angle is, over time you’ll develop a following among clients with whom you share those interests. 'Cause everybody gets their hair cut! It won’t happen overnight, and certainly not with every customer, but I’ll bet anything you’ll attract people like yourself. It just tends to happen - I do portraits at art fairs, and I love my customers, I pull in the neatest people & we have a great time chatting. **Unless** ~~~ I happen to be having a crappy day. If I’m in a foul mood (which is rare, but it has happened) strangers read it instantly and the cool ones steer clear. ---
**Author:** ![Blackberry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecd19e/32.png) [@Blackberry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blackberry)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/34 "2009-12-21T20:05:53Z")
I know how you feel. I get the same way, and as much as I love my daughter, it’s just too much to deal with her sometimes because I feel so irritable and don’t want to interact with anyone. But then it’s just a cycle because the more I keep to myself, the worse I feel. I do take medication though. I take Wellbutrin, which is a different type of drug than other antidepressants (most of the others are in the same class, I believe). The other ones (I’ve tried several) killed my libido and they can make you gain weight, and those were the two side effects that concerned me the most. Wellbutrin doesn’t do either one of those things and I haven’ t had many side effects with it at all, except I had insomnia at first, but that went away within a couple/few weeks. So I would recommend you considering Wellbutrin. Also, I recently started exercising daily. I had always heard that that can help with depression, but I guess I didn’t really believe that it would for me. Well, I’ve been very surprised how much it has helped me get out of my rut. And I just exercise at home, so it’s not even getting out of the house and being around people at a gym or anything. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/35 "2009-12-21T20:11:00Z")
> [@Kelby](#): > > Good points all, but I want to emphasize the exercise point: The sedentary lifestyle many of us leads feeds into those depressive moods. > > You can make your own feel-good drugs through vigorous exercise. It ain’t easy, but it’s part of the solution, I think. Can be, not always. I was running about three miles three times a week before I went on medication this last time around. I say this because a lot of these ‘cures’ come across to those struggling as “blame the victim” - if you’d only eat right and exercise and do these CBT exercises - you wouldn’t NEED medication. I ate right, was running nine miles a week, got enough sleep - but not too much sleep, avoided alcohol, did my CBT exercises - and was still looking at the edge of a cliff feeling like taking a step off the edge would be a relief. ---
**Author:** ![Kelby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a587f6/32.png) [@Kelby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kelby)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/36 "2009-12-21T20:21:19Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Can be, not always. I was running about three miles three times a week before I went on medication this last time around. > > I say this because a lot of these ‘cures’ come across to those struggling as “blame the victim” - if you’d only eat right and exercise and do these CBT exercises - you wouldn’t NEED medication. > > I ate right, was running nine miles a week, got enough sleep - but not too much sleep, avoided alcohol, did my CBT exercises - and was still looking at the edge of a cliff feeling like taking a step off the edge would be a relief. Yeah, shouldn’t try to paint everyone with the same brush. What’s helping now? Something, I hope. ---
**Author:** ![FallenAngel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@FallenAngel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FallenAngel)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/37 "2009-12-21T20:41:03Z")
This thread [The Cognitive Behavioral Therapy Support Thread - Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=544772) may offer some help. Oftentimes, CBT can help to overcome depression without the need for drugs, as it did for me. In some cases, CBT combined with meds is the better path for an individual. With or without meds, it gives you a toolset for coping with life in a rational way that is hugely helpful. Whatever ends up working for you, I wish you all the best. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/38 "2009-12-21T20:48:39Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Can be, not always. I was running about three miles three times a week before I went on medication this last time around. > > I say this because a lot of these ‘cures’ come across to those struggling as “blame the victim” - if you’d only eat right and exercise and do these CBT exercises - you wouldn’t NEED medication. > > I ate right, was running nine miles a week, got enough sleep - but not too much sleep, avoided alcohol, did my CBT exercises - and was still looking at the edge of a cliff feeling like taking a step off the edge would be a relief. The problem is depression is a complex illness. There are dozens of biochemical anomalies that can cause depression. Problems with histamine, dopamine, adrenaline, testosterone, estrogen, thyroid, serotonin, various vitamins and minerals, medication side effects, etc. Thats on top of all the cognitive causes. There are easily dozens of different causes and factors. It sucks. I saw a study once on men with treatment resistant depression who weren’t responding to SSRIs. The reason they weren’t is because their depression was due to low testosterone levels. When those were fixed, many got better. I doubt any amount of talk therapy will fix a malfunctioning thyroid, as an example. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/39 "2009-12-21T21:41:05Z")
> [@MLS](#): > > I have to nitpick here. You don’t know whether the she will need meds for the rest of her life or not. Counseling may (or may not) be helpful, along with all of the other fine suggestions. But it’s entirely possible that there may be a chemical imbalance that will need correction through medication. I know I tried EVERYTHING that was previously mentioned. Nothing helped me until I was on Paxil for a few weeks. Nothing. And I tried them all with the serious belief that each one would be the answer. Please note I’m not saying my answer is everyone’s answer, but nobody’s answer is everyone’s answer. Hell, I KNOW there’s a chemical imbalance - she’d be feeling better if there wasn’t. What I’m trying to get across is that if all you do is see a doctor, you’ll probably just get a prescription for anti-depressants, see the doctor again in a month, he’ll ask how it’s working, he’ll adjust your meds or just give you another refill, and in my opinion, that’s just not good enough, when you also need to change habits of negative thinking and behaviour. The risk of taking medication alone without any longterm behavioural changes is that the medication probably _will_ work - **Torie** will start feeling better, and will want to keep taking the medication and not doing any other work, because she doesn’t want to risk feeling bad again. I volunteer as a leader of an anxiety support group, and we see this _all_ the time - people selling their recovery short by just staying on meds, and not working on their anxiety or depression any further. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996/40 "2009-12-21T21:57:10Z")
“…the only thing more effective is regular exercise!” -Pharm Rep, The Simpsons (explaining the benefits of ‘Focusyn’) Excuse my ignorance on the subject, but how much of depression is caused by some sort of chemical imbalance where there is litterally something wrong with your brain and how much is caused by living a depressing life? For example, just a couple of things the OP said, it’s not out of the realm of possibility that you might have legitimate reasons for being disappointed with your friends. Or maybe you find your family tedious because maybe you wanted to be something more or other than a housewife? And it’s pretty easy to see how these things might cause a great deal of inner termoil and guilt because you believe that feeling this way might make you a horrible person. And actually, I hadn’t read this part yet: > [@torie](#): > > Cat Whisperer, you aren’t out to lunch at all. I don’t have a car, so I really don’t get to indulge interests unless other people are willing to accompany me. So I sit in the house all day long (Someone mentioned triggers. That’s a huge one.) unless I’m in school or I end up doing what other people like. I don’t know anyone around here that doesn’t find museums, plays, operas, comic books, gaming and history tedious. That was fine when I could carry myself to the things that inspired me and made me happy, but now it’s tiresome. I do feel like I’m constantly fitting myself in the wrong peg as a result. Cosmetology is great and I love it, but I hate the people I go to school with. This can be a very incestuous, catty, mean industry. I’ve been trying to work on my self-esteem to be able to do what I love and deal, but it’s hard to get picked on for being different all the time. I’m 27 years old, there’s no reason I should feel like I went back to high school. Of course you feel depressed. You’re cooped inside all day. None of the people you associate with share your interests and most of them sound like jerks and ignorami. You are feeling disenchanted with your chosen profession. It seems to me that any of these things are reason enough to feel depressed. I mean what is someone going to do? Give you a pill that makes your classmates less of a bunch of assholes or makes sitting around the house by yourself less boring (ok, they might actually have pills for that)? It seems to me that a major cause of depression, assuming nothing is actually wrong with your brain, is being stuck in some particular life circumstance that is undesirable but comfortible enough to avoid risking change. Possibly because it is what is “expected” of you or is inherent to your nature. IMHO, most people try to “fix” their problems with drugs or bullshit talk in order to try to trick themselves into fitting their square peg of a self into their round hole of their life. It is much more difficult to make real change and find a life that is more fitting because it means giving up what is comfortible. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-depression/521996.md?page=3)