# Fighting misogyny - but "cunt" and "bitch" are still okay words **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [May 14, 2020, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769 "2020-05-14T04:16:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2020, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/61 "2020-05-15T17:49:02Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > I think that big events like the banning of a long time poster stir stuff up and that’s ok. It’s a good time to reevaluate entrenched attitudes. The same thing happened when Starving Artist was banned, there was a lot of soul searching. I agree with this. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2020, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/62 "2020-05-15T17:52:12Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > The examples you gave were certainly about a poster hating specific things and people, but that’s not what “hate speech” is. If there’s something in those quotes you think qualifies as hate speech, point it out, because I’m not seeing it. I disagree. Hate speech is when you lump a bunch of people and make disparaging and hateful statements about them. Dehumanize them. Its a step in the process of committing violence against them. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2020, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/63 "2020-05-15T18:03:23Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > I disagree. Hate speech is when you lump a bunch of people and make disparaging and hateful statements about them. Dehumanize them. Its a step in the process of committing violence against them. This is interesting. Would you say “Men are pigs!” is hate speech? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2020, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/64 "2020-05-15T18:15:57Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > I personally don’t care what words people use to insult others because none of them hurt me. That’s my privilege as a white, heterosexual, gender-typical male. > > I’d rather you just say “I don’t want limits on insulting people in Great Debates because I might feel the need to call Melania Trump a cunt, and I don’t want to get warned for it” Seems like we have a lot in common. However, maybe we should both give it a rest before people start to talk about us getting a room. What do you say? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2020, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/65 "2020-05-15T18:17:40Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > I disagree. Hate speech is when you lump a bunch of people and make disparaging and hateful statements about them. Dehumanize them. Its a step in the process of committing violence against them. I didn’t lump. No lumping. It could not have been any more specifically targeted. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2020, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/66 "2020-05-15T18:23:39Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Seems like we have a lot in common. However, maybe we should both give it a rest before people start to talk about us getting a room. What do you say? \*\*\* scratches “Get a room with QuickSilver” off of my end-of-quarantine bucket list. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2020, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/67 "2020-05-15T19:20:36Z")
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**Author:** ![chela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chela/32/21582_2.png) [@chela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chela)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2020, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/68 "2020-05-15T20:43:13Z")
The point of slinging slurs at other people (not say slamming your hand in the car door)are to make a comment personally demeaning and vulgar. Regardless of context saying punt that motherfucking cunt back to that son of a bitch, whore son coxksucker? Is that an honest expression of emotion when I the heat of a verbal exchange? Find better words to express yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Modesty\_Blaise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Modesty\_Blaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Modesty_Blaise)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2020, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/69 "2020-05-16T14:44:03Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > The rule on hate speech as posted in the Pit: > > I generally include sexual orientation and gender in there, also. However, I don’t consider “bitch” or “cunt” to necessarily be hate speech. I think there’s an argument to be made that “bitch” is a gendered pair with “dick,” like how “waitress” is a gendered pair to “waiter,” and doesn’t necessarily indicate group-level animosity the way racial slurs do. And, of course, the general offensiveness of “cunt” varies greatly by geographic region. So neither of these terms is strictly verboten. However, context matters, and the excessive use of these terms (“cunt” in particular) or using them in ways that expressly disparage women in general would be open to moderation. I find this truly insulting. This is an obvious statement that gender slurs are not taken as seriously as racial slurs. Why? The two most offensive misogynistic slurs are somehow not as bad as “harpy”? One must have context for these two slurs because reasons. I cringe and/or wince whenever these two words are used in any context because they are used so casually without thought as to how they will be received. They are hate words. Period. Drop the n word into ANY conversation (in ANY context) and it’s like a bomb being dropped. These two hate words get not even a double take. There seems to be this excuse that comes up often: these two words have very common usage so we can’t just ban words that are commonly used. I’d like to remind people that the n word was very commonly used once upon a time until people started recognizing how awful it was and started monitoring the use of it. Why is this any different? Why aren’t we doing this? Because it’s still okay by and large to degrade women. It’s just not that important because it’s about women. Part of the problem is that these two words ARE so casually and commonly used. If we don’t bother to call it out they will continue to be casually and commonly used. It really makes it obvious misogyny is just not as important as other kinds of bigotry on the SDMB. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2020, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/70 "2020-05-16T17:42:54Z")
> [@Modesty\_Blaise](#): > > I find this truly insulting. This is an obvious statement that gender slurs are not taken as seriously as racial slurs. Why? > > The two most offensive misogynistic slurs are somehow not as bad as “harpy”? One must have context for these two slurs because reasons. > > I cringe and/or wince whenever these two words are used in any context because they are used so casually without thought as to how they will be received. They are hate words. Period. > > Drop the n word into ANY conversation (in ANY context) and it’s like a bomb being dropped. These two hate words get not even a double take. > > There seems to be this excuse that comes up often: these two words have very common usage so we can’t just ban words that are commonly used. I’d like to remind people that the n word was very commonly used once upon a time until people started recognizing how awful it was and started monitoring the use of it. Why is this any different? Why aren’t we doing this? Because it’s still okay by and large to degrade women. It’s just not that important because it’s about women. Part of the problem is that these two words ARE so casually and commonly used. If we don’t bother to call it out they will continue to be casually and commonly used. > > It really makes it obvious misogyny is just not as important as other kinds of bigotry on the SDMB. What are some other words that ought to be removed from the common english lexicon for fear they may offend someone in some way? ---
**Author:** ![Modesty\_Blaise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Modesty\_Blaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Modesty_Blaise)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2020, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/71 "2020-05-17T13:51:34Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > What are some other words that ought to be removed from the common english lexicon for fear they may offend someone in some way? Just the hate words. Until they are no longer commonly used. Like the we did with all of these: Jap Kike Chink Injun Nigger Spic Beaner Spear chucker rag head kraut I could go on. ---
**Author:** ![Modesty\_Blaise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Modesty\_Blaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Modesty_Blaise)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2020, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/72 "2020-05-17T13:55:22Z")
> [@Modesty\_Blaise](#): > > Just the hate words. Until they are no longer commonly used. Like the we did with all of these: > > Jap > Kike > Chink > Injun > Nigger > Spic > Beaner > Spear chucker > rag head > kraut > > I could go on. Don’t forget faggot and dike. I messed up my edit ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2020, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/73 "2020-05-17T14:01:01Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > What are some other words that ought to be removed from the common english lexicon for fear they may offend someone in some way? The “for fear they may offend someone in some way” phrase has a real edge of contempt in it. I hope you don’t mean it that way. The disdain and even outrage manifested by those who find it infuriating that their freedom to disparage whole classes of people who are less privileged than they are may be infringed, is so exhaustingly widespread that I may have misinterpreted here. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2020, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/74 "2020-05-17T15:04:16Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > What are some other words that ought to be removed from the common english lexicon for fear they may offend someone in some way? The “for fear they may offend someone in some way” phrase has a real edge of contempt in it. I hope you don’t mean it that way. The disdain and even outrage manifested by those who find it infuriating that their freedom to disparage whole classes of people who are less privileged than they are may be infringed, is so exhaustingly widespread that I may have misinterpreted here. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2020, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/75 "2020-05-17T15:44:08Z")
@Modesty Blaise - No argument at all with regards to the words you listed. I didn’t think it would need to be said that those are clearly terms that should never be used to disparage others. I thought we were talking about more commonly used swear words. I realize many of the cuss words commonly used are gender based. I’ll spare everyone the grouped list. That’s what I thought we were talking about. Which of those words, in addition to the two in the OP, would you recommend removing from common use? @Ufreida - I hope I’ve clarified my earlier statement. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2020, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/76 "2020-05-17T16:54:26Z")
> [@Modesty\_Blaise](#): > > I find this truly insulting. This is an obvious statement that gender slurs are not taken as seriously as racial slurs. Why? Well, you just quoted the reason, but to recapitulate, I don’t think those words are collective insults the way racial slurs are. > [@](#): > > The two most offensive misogynistic slurs are somehow not as bad as “harpy”? One must have context for these two slurs because reasons. No, they’re definitely worse than “harpy,” but the question I’m answering is specific to the Pit’s rules, which are very different around what is and is not acceptable language than in other forums. > [@](#): > > I cringe and/or wince whenever these two words are used in any context because they are used so casually without thought as to how they will be received. They are hate words. Period. > > Drop the n word into ANY conversation (in ANY context) and it’s like a bomb being dropped. These two hate words get not even a double take. > > There seems to be this excuse that comes up often: these two words have very common usage so we can’t just ban words that are commonly used. I’d like to remind people that the n word was very commonly used once upon a time until people started recognizing how awful it was and started monitoring the use of it. Why is this any different? Why aren’t we doing this? Because it’s still okay by and large to degrade women. It’s just not that important because it’s about women. Part of the problem is that these two words ARE so casually and commonly used. If we don’t bother to call it out they will continue to be casually and commonly used. Right, and I try to moderate based on contemporary social standards on how these words are used. I don’t try to moderate to create new social standards on how they’re used. > [@](#): > > It really makes it obvious misogyny is just not as important as other kinds of bigotry on the SDMB. I think it’s more that not everyone has the same ideas about what constitutes “obvious misogyny.” ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2020, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/77 "2020-05-17T16:59:06Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I think it’s more that not everyone has the same ideas about what constitutes “obvious misogyny.” When determining what the majority opinion is as to what constitutes “obvious misogyny”, do you factor in that the vast majority here are of the male persuasion? ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2020, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/78 "2020-05-17T17:05:03Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > When determining what the majority opinion is as to what constitutes “obvious misogyny”, do you factor in that the vast majority here are of the male persuasion? As if all women have the same opinion about what is misogynistic. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2020, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/79 "2020-05-17T17:08:57Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > When determining what the majority opinion is as to what constitutes “obvious misogyny”, do you factor in that the vast majority here are of the male persuasion? I’m not using the SDMB as the metric for that determination, I’m using the opinions of women I know in real life about how problematic those words are. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2020, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769/80 "2020-05-17T17:09:11Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > As if all women have the same opinion about what is misogynistic. I did not say or even imply that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-misogyny-but-cunt-and-bitch-are-still-okay-words/853769.md?page=5)