# Fill a gap in my knowledge. When to use ' and when to use " ? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 9, 2004, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704 "2004-09-09T00:23:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704/21 "2004-09-09T20:19:39Z")
> [@Catalyst](#): > > That’s how I was taught. Of course, it doesn’t matter at all on this board, because any spaces beyond the first are ignored in HTML. When we were taught typing, back in medieval times, one always allowed two spaces after terminal punctuation. 😃 :eek: ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704/22 "2004-09-09T20:37:16Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I’d like to see a citation on this, because I’m pretty certain that most style guides allow quotations marks to be used to indicate irony (AP, APA, and the Chicago Manual of Style all agree on this. > > Plus, the best I’ve found online in a cursory search so far: > > from [http://bss.sfsu.edu/jacksonc/g-write.htm](http://bss.sfsu.edu/jacksonc/g-write.htm) > Also, double quotation marks are not just used for direct quotes. They are also used in the titles of shorter works (e.g. The Beatles sang “I Am The Walrus”), setting off slang words, and probably some other uses I am forgetting. Duoble quotes are often used where italics, underlining or bold is not available. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2004, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704/23 "2004-09-09T21:00:49Z")
Just for what it’s worth, even the American edition of _Eats, Leaves, & Shoots_ is practically worthless for American style. Truss simply doesn’t know enough to make intelligent comments on the subject. There are many specialized styles for particular professions. Law has the weirdest style guides I’ve ever seen. But for the worst of all worlds, try this one: For one book I did I was told to use the Chicago Manual of Style **and** I was given a page of exceptions to Chicago style that I had to follow. (What did I do? The obvious. I looked at the exception page and let the copyeditor sort out the rest. 😃 ) ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2004, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704/24 "2004-09-10T06:58:50Z")
The number one rule of style is that there are very few hard and fast rules of style. Your best bet is to pick an American convention that works for you (and there are several) and run with it until you have a reason to do otherwise. Outside of quotes-within-quotes, I generally use single quotes for sarcasm or irony. And I don’t care what the rest of you ‘experts’ have to say about it. For the record, my AP Style Guide (2002 edition) says to use double quotes to indicate irony. It doesn’t mention single quotes at all outside of quotes-within-quotes. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2004, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704/25 "2004-09-10T13:40:36Z")
Have we had any discussion of what these things are properly called? To my knowledge, the thing people here are calling “double-quotes” is really called a “quotation mark.” The “single quote” I learned in the olden days as an “apostrophe.” The backwards-slanted apostrophe in computer parlance is called a backtick, but I’m not aware of any non-computer use for this character. Computer types used it I think because Any objections to this from right-pondians? Since y’all use them differently, maybe we should internationalize the terms and call them “foot marks” and “inches marks”! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2004, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704/26 "2004-09-10T13:44:04Z")
…because they weren’t already used for anything else. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2004, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704/27 "2004-09-10T14:01:39Z")
> [@Misnomer](#): > > Also, at least in the States, " is only used for actual quotes: if you are using a word in a way that implies ‘so-called,’ single quote marks are correct (for example: The guy tried to pass himself off as a police officer, but his cover was blown when the ‘officer’ couldn’t remember the Miranda warning). So if you are ever tempted to put " marks around a word or phrase, only do so if you are actually quoting someone/something (or, I believe, for some titles). I know of no such rule in American usage. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2004, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704/28 "2004-09-10T14:03:30Z")
> [@Catalyst](#): > > That’s how I was taught. Of course, it doesn’t matter at all on this board, because any spaces beyond the first are ignored in HTML. Two spaces after a period is the style for **fixed-width** type only (like on an old typewriter). If you’re using a **proportionally spaced** typeface (which is likely if you’re using a modern word processor, the rule is **one space**. The software automatically works out how much space to put in. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2004, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704/29 "2004-09-10T14:15:00Z")
> [@CurtC](#): > > The “single quote” I learned in the olden days as an “apostrophe.” The backwards-slanted apostrophe in computer parlance is called a backtick, but I’m not aware of any non-computer use for this character. Computer types used it I think because If by “backtick” you mean that character under the tilde – then to me it is not a quotation mark. It is an accent grave and is not used in English. In American typography, the single quote (the straight/noncurly/dumb quote) was made with only one character, both for opening and closing (the key between the semicolon and the return carriage). Typsetter’s quotations marks (curly/smart quote) is possible in American typography only with word processors, not with traditional typewriters and does not make use of the tilde key, except in certain specialized software for professional publishers (now out of date). ---
**Author:** ![quothz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/da6949/32.png) [@quothz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/quothz)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2004, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704/30 "2004-09-11T22:50:37Z")
Well, I blew the dust off my Little, Brown Handbook the other day and it’s still at hand, let’s see what it says. Oh, yeah, the formalities: Fowler, H. Ramsey & Aaron, Jane E., \_The\_Little,_Brown\_Handbook_, 4th Edition (1989), Little, Brown and Company. Chapter 24, “Quotation Marks” Hmm, according to these two, the apostrophe is not the same as a single quotation mark. Here’s the rules they lay out, with some of my commentary. a. Use double quotation marks to enclose direct quotations. b. Use single quotation marks to enclose a quotation within a quotation c. Set off quotations of dialogue, poetry, and long prose passages according to standard practice. This one probably needs more fleshing out. In dialogue, you’re reminded to begin a new paragraph for each speaker, and to omit quotation marks at the end of a paragraph of dialogue when the next paragraph is also dialogue from the same speaker. In poetry, quotation marks are only required for quoting one line of poetry, which is quoted within the running text. They are optional when quoting two or three lines, and never used when quoting more than three lines. Instead, specialized formatting is used. In long prose passages, do not use quotation marks. Instead, specialized formatting is used. d. Put quotation marks around titles according to standard practice. Not -your- title, silly, when you’re -quoting- a title. e. Occasionally, quotation marks may be used to enclose defined words and words used in a “special” sense. Those quotes around “special” are mine. In definitions, the use of italics or underlining is more common than quotation marks. f. Avoid using quotation marks where they are not needed. Avoid quotation marks around common nicknames. Don’t refer to someone as James “Jim” DeGriz. Just Jim is fine. Don’t put quotation marks around slang terms or trite expressions, even if you want to. Don’t use quotation marks around technical terms unless you’re defining 'em on the spot. g. Place other marks of punctuation inside or outside quotation marks according to standard practice. Standard practice on this one is a bit iffy. The times, they are a changin’, and a lot of people - such as myself - prefer to place punctuation in its logical position with respect to quotation marks. This ain’t the subject at hand, though, so I’ll step lightly past it. And that’s it. According to LBH, single quotation marks are -only- used when placing a quote within another. I can’t say I’ve adhered to that rule perfectly, but it seems reasonable enough. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fill-a-gap-in-my-knowledge-when-to-use-and-when-to-use/263704.md?page=1)