# Films that don't make sense unless you understand the zeitgeist of the time **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 20, 2010, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730 "2010-02-20T03:42:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2010, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/81 "2010-02-23T06:28:18Z")
As long as we’re dumping on Jack Nicholson’s early work, I’ll join the dogpile with **Five Easy Pieces** and **Carnal Knowledge**. The scene in **Pieces** where he tells a waitress to “hold it between [her] legs” may have struck people at the time as _Sticking It To Tha Man_, but basically he went postal on an underpaid elderly waitress. And **Carnal Knowledge** has not aged well, it’s just an extended “Bernard and Huey” cartoon from **Playboy** (also by Jules Feiffer). ---
**Author:** ![salinqmind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3ec8ea/32.png) [@salinqmind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/salinqmind)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2010, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/82 "2010-02-23T16:37:57Z")
1970 film, “The Boys In The Band”, by William Friedkin, based on Mart Crowley’s play. It was an eye-opener for a lot of people. Though today it seems positively quaint, it was the first ‘gay cinema’ produced for mass consumption, according to what I’ve read. ---
**Author:** ![whiterabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/cab0a1/32.png) [@whiterabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whiterabbit)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2010, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/83 "2010-02-23T17:30:24Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > My vote is for “West Side Story”-I mean-young punks snapping their fingers and chanting “cool it”? And Officer Krumpke? > Nobody in his or her’s teens would understand this film. Born in 1976, adored the movie when I was in my early teens. I had no problem with the punks being rather…dated. I haven’t watched it in years, though. I hope it’d hold up. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2010, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/84 "2010-02-23T19:16:21Z")
> [@Bytegeist](#): > > I’ll nominate **Network** , from 1976. I’m sure younger people with some knowledge of history and a dark sense of humor can appreciate most of the film. Nevertheless, it probably helps a lot to have lived through that time — in particular: > [ol] > [li]The shallow pursuit of high ratings had not yet taken over television news reporting. (It soon would though.)[/li][li]There was a real malaise in the air, in 1970s America. Not that we all walked around moping every day. But, after Vietnam, Watergate, inflation, rapidly rising crime rates in the major cities, not to mention the Cold War always rumbling in the background, there was a widespread sense that society was severely broken, degenerating, and that no one really knew what to do about it.[/li][/ol] I think an audience today would get Network just as well as a 70s audience. Network at the time was a cautionary tale of where media was headed. Now we are there.. and Network was right. And your telling me the 2000s haven’t been also filled with the same malaise? 9/11, two wars, housing bust, etc etc etc. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2010, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/85 "2010-02-23T19:37:43Z")
> [@Jim\_s\_Son](#): > > The only time I saw “Rebel without a Cause” was 35 years ago in a theater with horrible sound. I thought it was an overwrought piece of bad soap-opera. But my main memory was the 1960s TV actors that had roles: Jim Backus (Gilligan’s Island) as the father. William Hopper (Perry Mason) as Natalie Wood’s father. Edward Platt (Get Smart) as the police chief. I saw it for the first time a few years ago and I agree with you. It just seemed so angsty and (if you’ll excuse the phrase) emo. The Graduate was only tolerable because I thought the ending made it clear that Benjamin was going to grow up and stop being such a jackass. Charlie Webb wrote a sequel called [Home School](http://www.amazon.com/Home-School-Charles-Webb/dp/0312376308) that actually says that’s how they ended up. ---
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2010, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/86 "2010-02-23T20:55:46Z")
Stand-up comedy is afflicted by this. In particular, Eddie Murphy **Delirious** and **Raw** no longer come across as raucous or subversive, but now sound more like that embarrassing bigoted uncle at the picnic who’s had too much to drink. I rewatched them recently and found myself more often analyzing and discussing the humor in context of the period, rather than actually smiling or laughing. ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2010, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/87 "2010-02-23T23:24:42Z")
> [@Bytegeist](#): > > I’ll nominate **Network** , from 1976. I’m sure younger people with some knowledge of history and a dark sense of humor can appreciate most of the film. I was born after **Network** was made. I saw it a few years ago - knowing nothing about it, my dad was on some kind of mission to show me every movie he thought was important, and he got it from Netflix - and I loved it. I thought it was really brilliant. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/88 "2010-02-25T15:26:53Z")
I’m thinking of _High Time_, with Bing Crosby. A 51 year old widower goes back to college. That’s bad enough, but he meets a female French teacher, and they have a dilemma: She wants to get married, but, is he too old? best wishes, handsomeharry ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/89 "2010-02-25T15:34:50Z")
> [@](#): > > In particular, Eddie Murphy Delirious and Raw no longer come across as raucous or subversive, but now sound more like that embarrassing bigoted uncle at the picnic who’s had too much to drink. Raw is a great example. I saw this when it was new, and only remembered how rebellious and screamingly funny it was. Then it was on Cable a couple months ago and I thought I would rewatch it. I could only watch 10 minutes before I gave up in embarrassment for Eddie, and shame for myself. ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/90 "2010-02-25T15:53:45Z")
> [@wolfman](#): > > Raw is a great example. I saw this when it was new, and only remembered how rebellious and screamingly funny it was. Then it was on Cable a couple months ago and I thought I would rewatch it. I could only watch 10 minutes before I gave up in embarrassment for Eddie, and shame for myself. I had parallel experiences with Eddie. Not so Richard Pryor. One was a genius, the other funny for a while and now a joke himself. ---
**Author:** ![ministryman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@ministryman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ministryman)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/91 "2010-02-25T16:11:07Z")
> [@Stephe96](#): > > Benjamin Braddock in _ **The Graduate** _ seems like an annoying, mopey jackass nowadays. A sense of entitlement. No sense of direction. Lounging around in his parent’s pool when he should have been working. Sounds like he was the 60s version of today’s slacker minus the Emo clothes and music… ---
**Author:** ![Nancarrow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c37758/32.png) [@Nancarrow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nancarrow)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/92 "2010-02-25T16:19:27Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > I found **Vixen Slut Nurses #32** to be trapped in the collective unconsciousness of the early 2000’s, while both **Vixen Slut Nurses #31** and **Vixen Slut Nurses #33** to have aged very well. Yebbut dude, you’re hardly one to come stomping in complaining about dated plots. Denmark’s a constitutional monarchy these days, your uncle hasn’t achieved shit, don’t worry about it! Yeesh. Four hundred years ago called, they want their power-play politics back. Sorry about your dad, that’s a bummer, but have you tried phoning the police? ---
**Author:** ![ministryman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@ministryman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ministryman)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/93 "2010-02-25T16:20:03Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > My vote is for “West Side Story”-I mean-young punks snapping their fingers and chanting “cool it”? And Officer Krumpke? > Nobody in his or her’s teens would understand this film. > Incidentally, in “The Graduate” (when Benjamin rents a room in Berkeley, to be near his love), he has a extremely funny interchange with the land lord: > (Landlord): “are you wunna dose outside agitators?” > (Benjamin): “no” > (Landlord): > “I hate does outside agitators”! > That was one of the best lines in the flick:D Since \*West Side Story \*is a 1960s version of _Romeo and Juliet_, I would fault the parents and the schools for not making these kids read more. Yes, gangs don’t snap their fingers and chant “cool it”, but they also don’t sing before the big fight. It was a musical, and something that yo need to explain to the teens. They will get it, just like they will get the theme: Boy and Girl from two warring cultures fall in love. Montagues and Capulets. Hatfields and McCoys. Jets and Sharks. Why not remake it with a Crips and Bloods theme? You could have some serious Gangster Rap for the background tracks, and in then end, everyone dies. I’m thinking Spike Lee, John Singleton, and Quentin Taratino need to get on this now… As a test, I will show WSS to my 13 year old and see if he gets it. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/94 "2010-02-25T17:23:43Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > I found **Vixen Slut Nurses #32** to be trapped in the collective unconsciousness of the early 2000’s, while both **Vixen Slut Nurses #31** and **Vixen Slut Nurses #33** to have aged very well. I find the whole Vixen Slut Nurses series since #29 to be shallow and pedantic. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/95 "2010-02-25T17:34:16Z")
Gone with the Wind Blow Up. I knew this film by reputation. When I finally saw it, I was so freaking let down. Really didn’t make much sense. ---
**Author:** ![jordanr2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/838e76/32.png) [@jordanr2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jordanr2)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/96 "2010-02-25T18:44:15Z")
_The Cook, the Thief, His Wife and Her Lover_. I was five when this came out, and while I’ve done a little research and understand the context of Thatcher’s Britain that the film allegorically excoriates, I think a lot of people these days view it as just a sumptuous and shocking art film while overlooking its political content. ---
**Author:** ![jordanr2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/838e76/32.png) [@jordanr2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jordanr2)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/97 "2010-02-25T18:49:04Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > Blow Up. I knew this film by reputation. When I finally saw it, I was so freaking let down. Really didn’t make much sense. Yeah, it’s embarrassing that this is Antonioni’s best-known film, and I can’t imagine but that he himself might be a little ashamed of it in the context of a career that also includes work like _L’Avventura_ and _L’Eclisse_. On the other hand, with a lot of films of that era, with the existential vibe and deliberate longueurs, it seems hard for modern audiences to get a handle on their uniqueness. I’ve seen people going on about how boring and stilted _Last Year at Marienbad_ is, or how shallow early Godard films are - yeah, all that was kinda the point. Modern art-house directors aren’t as immune to humor and lightness as some of the best filmmakers of that era were. ---
**Author:** ![Linty\_Fresh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Linty\_Fresh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linty_Fresh)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/98 "2010-02-25T19:11:42Z")
I’d add some of Peter Sellers’s older comedies to this list, especially **What’s New Pussycat** and **I Love You Alice B. Toklas!** I laughed at some parts, but I think both films are too full of 60’s kitsch and camp for me to understand. Peter O’Toole was pretty awesome in **Pussycat** , though. How is he still alive? ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/99 "2010-02-25T19:25:22Z")
> [@Linty\_Fresh](#): > > Peter O’Toole was pretty awesome in **Pussycat** , though. How is he still alive? Clean living? ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2010, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730/100 "2010-02-25T19:34:41Z")
> [@jordanr2](#): > > _The Cook, the Thief, His Wife and Her Lover_. I was five when this came out, and while I’ve done a little research and understand the context of Thatcher’s Britain that the film allegorically excoriates, I think a lot of people these days view it as just a sumptuous and shocking art film while overlooking its political content. I actually saw it in the theater when it was first released in 1989\*, and also apparently missed the political content. :smack: I just thought it was an art film with a memorable soundtrack. \*Crap–has it really been 20 years since I saw that film in college? :eek: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-that-dont-make-sense-unless-you-understand-the-zeitgeist-of-the-time/529730.md?page=6)