# Films with average gunmen **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 16, 2007, 7:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463 "2007-02-16T07:08:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2007, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/21 "2007-02-18T20:20:57Z")
Oh, I’d say Samuel L. Jackson managed to hit a few people. Besides, Bruce Willis was using a submachine gun at a range of 3 feet. Hard to miss, really. ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2007, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/22 "2007-02-18T20:24:57Z")
I really don’t mean to be a spoil-sport nor to take away from the fun of the thread, but if you go back to the B Westerns and TV Westerns from the 30’s-50’s (at least, maybe even more recently, too) it was rare to find anyboidy in the cast except the hero who could hit anything. They shot up a lot of smoky powder from guns that would hold unlimited ammo and rarely if ever hit anything. In almost every showdown, only one of them could shoot. Guess which. The only genre where you find real marksmen are the sniper movies. Tom Berenger for sure. These guys can tear the wings off gnats at 500 yards. Which movie is that has one of the heroes (somebody like Quigley) waiting until the bad guy is about to top a rise maybe a mile away then shoots him out of the saddle and bitches, “I was aiming at the horse.”? Gunplay in most movies is about noise. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2007, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/23 "2007-02-18T20:26:22Z")
That would be Robert Vaughn in _The Magnificent Seven._ ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2007, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/24 "2007-02-18T20:31:07Z")
[QUOTE=silenus] That would be Robert Vaughn in _The Magnificent Seven._ [/QUOTE] Or was it Coburn? I know Coburn was way past mean with a knife. Now I have to make a point of seeing this again. One of the better movies. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2007, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/25 "2007-02-18T20:38:29Z")
I sit corrected. It _was_ Coburn. He had that “disgusted with himself” expression when he said it that was classic. ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2007, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/26 "2007-02-18T20:45:20Z")
[QUOTE=silenus] I sit corrected. It _was_ Coburn. He had that “disgusted with himself” expression when he said it that was classic. [/QUOTE] Shit! I was about to post that you were right about Vaughn. I guess we both need the reviewing, huh? Have you seen _Seven Samurai_ (I can’t ever remember its IMDB title) where Coburn’s counterpart is Mr. Slice and Dice? I gather the M7 cast must have seen the Kurosawa flic before they settled on their own portrayals, and if so, Coburn seems to have been most faithful to his. At least the other guys marvel at his cool the way the other movie’s guys do. Isn’t Vaughn the sole survivor? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2007, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/27 "2007-02-18T20:57:19Z")
Nope. He dies in the final battle. Chris, Vin and Chico all survive. The young kid stays with the village as Chris and Vin ride away. I have _The Seven Samurai_ on DVD. Time I watched it again. **Chico:** _Ah, that was the greatest shot I’ve ever seen_. **Britt:** _The worst! I was aiming at the horse._ ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2007, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/28 "2007-02-18T20:59:07Z")
[QUOTE=silenus] Nope. He dies in the final battle. Chris, Vin and Chico all survive. The young kid stays with the village as Chris and Vin ride away. I have _The Seven Samurai_ on DVD. Time I watched it again. [/QUOTE] I admit my question about surviving was ambiguous. I meant the M7 actors. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2007, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/29 "2007-02-18T21:01:24Z")
Of the actors…I believe you’re right. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![TV\_time](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f17d59/32.png) [@TV\_time](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TV_time)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2007, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/30 "2007-02-18T22:35:25Z")
Among John Wayne films, El Dorado comes to mind. The Duke’s character gives James Caan’s character a sawed off shotgun because he was such a terrible shot. ---
**Author:** ![TV\_time](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f17d59/32.png) [@TV\_time](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TV_time)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2007, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/31 "2007-02-18T22:45:11Z")
In comedies, a couple come to mind (all dentists interesting to note) Shakiest Gun in the West with Don Knotts and Paleface and Son of Paleface with Bob Hope. ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2007, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/32 "2007-02-19T19:17:43Z")
from \*The Shootist \* (John Wayne as John Bernard Books and Ron Howard as Gillom Rogers) > [@](#): > > **Gillom Rogers:** Mr. Books, my grouping of shots was tighter than yours. How is it you’ve killed so many men? > > **John Bernard Books:** First thing is, that target wasn’t shooting back at you. Second, most men at that last second will flinch; I won’t. ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2007, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/33 "2007-02-19T19:25:42Z")
[QUOTE=TV time] Among John Wayne films, El Dorado comes to mind. The Duke’s character gives James Caan’s character a sawed off shotgun because he was such a terrible shot. [/QUOTE] I had to go to IMDB to find Caan’s character’s name (other than “Mississippi”) because in my foggy memory it’s [Albert Payson Terhune](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Payson_Terhune) who wrote (among other things) the first book I can remember reading: _Lad, A Dog._ Maybe I even have that fused with Trevanian. Not that it matters. I always had the feeling that _Rio Bravo_ and _El Dorado_ were basically the same movie with two different drunks. ---
**Author:** ![TV\_time](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f17d59/32.png) [@TV\_time](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TV_time)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2007, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/34 "2007-02-19T22:04:23Z")
[QUOTE=Zeldar] I always had the feeling that _Rio Bravo_ and _El Dorado_ were basically the same movie with two different drunks. [/QUOTE] Pretty much, except apparently Ricky Nelson (Colorado) could shoot well and James Caan (Mississippi) couldn’t. Probably had something to do with the states’ names. Another title that might be mentioned could be the Jimmy Breslin book and film based on it,\* The Gang That Couldn’t Shoot Straight\*. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2007, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463/35 "2007-02-20T02:53:26Z")
[QUOTE=Peter Morris] Star Wars Stormtroopers are all incredibly bad shots. [/QUOTE] And hence not “average,” per the op. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/films-with-average-gunmen/392463.md?page=1)