# Fire and Fury Book the "Book Club" Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 9, 2018, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274 "2018-01-09T22:10:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/1 "2018-01-09T22:10:43Z")
I started reading through _Fire and Fury: Inside the Trump White House_, by Michael Wolff. I’m starting this thread for other interested readers who would like to discuss the book as we read it. Book blurb: > [@](#): > > With extraordinary access to the Trump White House, Michael Wolff tells the inside story of the most controversial presidency of our time > > The first nine months of Donald Trump’s term were stormy, outrageous—and absolutely mesmerizing. Now, thanks to his deep access to the West Wing, bestselling author Michael Wolff tells the riveting story of how Trump launched a tenure as volatile and fiery as the man himself. > > In this explosive book, Wolff provides a wealth of new details about the chaos in the Oval Office. Among the revelations: > – What President Trump’s staff really thinks of him > – What inspired Trump to claim he was wire-tapped by President Obama > – Why FBI director James Comey was really fired > – Why chief strategist Steve Bannon and Trump’s son-in-law Jared Kushner couldn’t be in the same room > – Who is really directing the Trump administration’s strategy in the wake of Bannon’s firing > – What the secret to communicating with Trump is > – What the Trump administration has in common with the movie The Producers > > Never before has a presidency so divided the American people. Brilliantly reported and astoundingly fresh, Michael Wolff’s Fire and Fury shows us how and why Donald Trump has become the king of discord and disunion. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/2 "2018-01-09T22:18:01Z")
I am about 42% of the way through the book so far. I don’t think that quoting page numbers will help, since we’re all likely have different books or editions but we can try it. Let me know what you think. Thoughts so far: -I found it interesting how thoroughly unprepared they were to win -The descriptions of Trump’s behavior, even just this far in, make me curious to know if this is a lifelong form of narcissicism, or if it’s mental deterioration. We’re told that even before he’s sworn in he could tell the same story over and over again, and had no capacity for listening to others. He doesn’t read. His interest in TV seems to be self-based. Was it always this bad, or has it gotten worse? -I’m finding the section on the centers of power in the White House fascinating, particularly the part about Jared representing liberal Democrats. I would not have guessed. Anyone else reading it? What else has stuck out for you so far? ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/3 "2018-01-09T23:17:07Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > -The descriptions of Trump’s behavior, even just this far in, make me curious to know if this is a lifelong form of narcissicism, or if it’s mental deterioration. We’re told that even before he’s sworn in he could tell the same story over and over again, and had no capacity for listening to others. He doesn’t read. His interest in TV seems to be self-based. Was it always this bad, or has it gotten worse? > > Anyone else reading it? What else has stuck out for you so far? I personally think he has always had a narcissistic disorder (either malignant narcissism or narcissistic personality disorder), but I think he also has some kind of dementia on top of it too. That isn’t a controversial opinion either, lots of people came to the same conclusion. There is something deeply wrong with him, and I’ve seen many people who’ve either worked in elder health care or who have seen their parents or grandparents decline say they see the same thing in Trump that they see in old people suffering from dementia. I couldn’t begin to count the number of people I’ve read who’ve either seen their family and friends decline, or who work in medical care (as psychologists, physicians, nurses, etc) who said Trump seems like someone in decline from dementia. Didn’t the book mention how he wasn’t able to recognize lifelong friends? I vaguely recall something about that. Here is a video of Trump getting lost walking down some airplane steps to his presidential limo. Trump wasn't always like this, here is he in 1999. He was far more eloquent and informed, and was better able to control his emotions and maintain a steady train of thought. [![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_joQ1kxxZs) ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2018, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/4 "2018-01-09T23:26:58Z")
The book mentions how just a year ago, Trump may tell the same story every 30 minutes. Now he tells it every 10 minutes. Repeating the same story over and over could be perseveration > **[Perseveration](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perseveration)** > > Perseveration, in the fields of psychology, psychiatry, and speech-language pathology, is the repetition of a particular response (such as a word, phrase, or gesture) regardless of the absence or cessation of a stimulus. It is usually caused by a brain injury or other organic disorder. Symptoms include "lacking ability to transition or switch ideas appropriately with the social context, as evidenced by the repetition of words or gestures after they have ceased to be socially relevant or approp In... > **[Verbal perseveration of dementia patients - PubMed](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/3161580/)** > > Patterns of perseveration and frequency of carrier phrases were studied in the verbal descriptive discourse of dementia patients controlled for etiology and severity. Dementia patients were found to perseverate significantly more frequently than... Yeah, I can see why the 25th amendment comes up daily in the white house. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2018, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/5 "2018-01-10T01:13:24Z")
There’s a story in the book about CPAC, where Trump gives a speech. It talks about how throughout most of his public life Trump used speaking notes. He used them the last time he spoke at CPAC. This time, he had a prepared speech, and he got up and ad-libbed the entire thing. The ad libs were the silly sort of nonsense we’ve gotten used to (lines 6 blocks long to get in, news is hiding the truth). It was surprise to me that he had ever followed notes for speeches. Another clue, I suppose. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2018, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/6 "2018-01-10T04:37:12Z")
I wasn’t going to read it, but it was too easy to download to my Kindle, so I did. I’m about 85% through it. There really isn’t too much new, but there are things that stick out for me so far that I haven’t seen much discussed: 1. The assertion that Trump didn’t expect or want to win. This wasn’t really a revelation, in my opinion, as I had suspected as much ever since I watched events unfold on election night. Before Trump spoke, I half expected him to step aside and concede in favor of Pence. The whole scenario screamed, “Oh, _shit_! This was not supposed to happen!” The look on every face on that stage was mute shock. And fear. So in that respect, the book confirmed my suspicions. This means that we’re all living through a cynical, accidental presidency with a complicit administration and Republican congress playing along like it was all meant to be, so they can thieve from the American public for as long as possible before they are ousted. There’s not enough lipstick to put on this pig to hide what’s going on. Makes me even more sad for the people who got duped into thinking they were actually getting a champion. 1. Bannon does not come off looking good in this book. Not at all. His quotes and conversations portray him for exactly who he is: A megalomaniac in love with the sound of his own voice who overestimated his own importance to the “movement” and used Trump only to pursue his own selfish purposes, and the destructive goals of crazy rich people with the last name Mercer. Other than that, not a lot of surprises. Despite the interests that bind them, I recently heard someone describe the Trump and Bannon relationship as like two scorpions in a bowl. I found it an apt comparison. The book just confirms it with a little more detail. ---
**Author:** ![Buttercup\_Smith](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buttercup_smith/32/473_2.png) [@Buttercup\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buttercup_Smith)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2018, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/7 "2018-01-10T17:19:46Z")
I read it last weekend and did not find too many surprises. Trump had a bad reputation prior to accidentally being elected. I believe he did not truly want to be president. He is a Con Man and he conned a bunch of Americans. I do believe he is mental. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2018, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/8 "2018-01-10T19:16:02Z")
I’ve been reading it, but I have to do it in pieces - the horror that this is all happening right now overwhelms me and I have to do something else and imagine a world where all this nonsense is over and this book is used in the coursework in an abnormal psychology class. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2018, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/9 "2018-01-14T05:12:59Z")
I haven’t read it, although I plan to eventually do so. Some people have accidentally ordered this book. Check out the current prices; the author definitely never thought his book would be something of a best-seller. > **[Fire and Fury: The Allied Bombing of Germany, 1942-1945: Hansen, Randall:...](https://www.amazon.com/Fire-Fury-Bombing-Germany-1942-1945/dp/0451230086)** > > Fire and Fury: The Allied Bombing of Germany, 1942-1945 \[Hansen, Randall\] on Amazon.com. \*FREE\* shipping on qualifying offers. Fire and Fury: The Allied Bombing of Germany, 1942-1945 ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/10 "2018-01-15T01:01:40Z")
I have read it, and found it entertainingly gossipy. It doesn’t seem to really matter if all of it is true, because if any of it is true, it’s still a meltdown. Many of the items were very reminiscent of what I’ve read elsewhere. Any work that puts Steve Bannon out of a job is okay on my list. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/11 "2018-01-15T02:38:32Z")
Trump isn’t insane and he isn’t senile- he’s just the same egomaniacal asshole we’ve known him to be for 30 years. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/12 "2018-01-15T03:36:33Z")
The entire book seems to be about the Allied Air Forces bombing of Germany in WWII. I can’t see anything about Trump in it at all. Unless his grandfather is one of the civilians undergoing the bombing. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/13 "2018-01-15T17:26:59Z")
Wolff is a horrible reporter. Some of what he wrote is definitely true, some of it is demonstrably false, and the rest is in the middle ( “Somebody says that somebody heard Trump say this or that… But there’s no documentation, still, it SOUNDS like the kind of thing Trump would say, so why not put it in the book?” ). The overall portrait ( “Trump is an out to lunch windbag who doesn’t know what the hell he’s doing”) seems accurate. But then, I always thought Trump was an out to lunch windbag who doesn’t know what the hell he’s talking about. Wolff tells us nothing new, certainly nothing that will change anyone’s mind. ---
**Author:** ![Poysyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Poysyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Poysyn)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2018, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fire-and-fury-book-the-book-club-thread/806274/14 "2018-01-15T19:29:19Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > The entire book seems to be about the Allied Air Forces bombing of Germany in WWII. > > I can’t see anything about Trump in it at all. Unless his grandfather is one of the civilians undergoing the bombing. 😃