# Firefly/Serenity 'verse question **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 28, 2005, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858 "2005-09-28T15:35:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/21 "2005-09-29T00:12:37Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Agreed, but a solar system with many planets, not a single habitable planet. > Why do you guys readily accept artificial gravity and guns that need air to fire but not FLT? šŸ™‚ > > Is the hollow sphere canon from the film, or speculation like my effort? The hollow sphere idea is total speculation on my part. I havenā€™t seen the movie yet. ā˜¹ ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/22 "2005-09-29T00:38:45Z")
> [@Menocchio](#): > > I think itā€™s a yellow sun, just like ours I read someplace that our sun is actually tinged very slightly green. Am I misremembering? ---
**Author:** ![Angel\_of\_the\_Lord](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/angel_of_the_lord/32/2949_2.png) [@Angel\_of\_the\_Lord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Angel_of_the_Lord)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/23 "2005-09-29T00:55:19Z")
Grr! The google ads had a link for a Firefly soundtrack, but it went away. . . ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/24 "2005-09-29T01:01:10Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > I read someplace that our sun is actually tinged very slightly green. Am I misremembering? No, no, Iā€™ve seen it definitely greenish sometimes. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/25 "2005-09-29T03:28:51Z")
We are still being surprised by what we find as we discover extra-solar planets, so I donā€™t know why itā€™s so hard to believe there could be a much hotter star than ours that happens to have a really big habitable zone. I think some people might be getting confused by the way astronomers talk about habitable stars. If you are going to assume that life evolved elsewhere, then you need a star somewhat like our Sun. Hotter stars donā€™t last long enough or have other problems that make them poor candidates for life. But when your only requirement is that you have a bunch of planets close enough to a star that they are reasonably warm, then all bets are off. It could be a hot, young star, or a red giant with a huge habitable zone. Or perhaps thereā€™s still things we donā€™t understand about solar system formation and weā€™ll find out later that our own solar system is relatively sparse with planets compared to the average. Basing the whole universe of the show in one solar system makes a lot more sense in many ways, and not just because you donā€™t need FTL drive. For example, if you really have faster-than-light drive, you donā€™t need to have conflict. The universe is huge. In Star Trek, you had the Klingons and Humans basically fighting for real estate, with borders, demilitarized zones, and all that stuff. But if youā€™ve got FTL drive, you have access to trillions of worlds. Why in hell would you even bother bumping up against Klingons? They have this chunk of space? Fine. There are plenty of others. But if everyone has to share the same solar system, then that opens the door for population pressure and conflict. Also, if you are travelling in interstellar space, the chances of running into anyone else are vanishingly small. On Star Trek they used to happen across other ships all the time. Good bloody luck. Itā€™d never happen. But if people are flitting from moon to moon around the same planet, itā€™s much more likely that they might pass within radio or visual range of each other, especially if there are pre-defined orbits much like traffic lanes. And if two ships depart the same planet for another planet, theyā€™re likely to be in roughly similar orbits. So there are lots of reasons to consider that the **Firefly**'verse is much more reasonable than one with an intergalactic civilization and FTL drive. ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/26 "2005-09-29T05:18:07Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Agreed, but a solar system with many planets, not a single habitable planet. > Why do you guys readily accept artificial gravity and guns that need air to fire but not FLT? šŸ™‚ Iā€™m still chuckling over the concept of FTH (Faster Than Horse) technology that someone brought up in a previous thread. Also, do we KNOW that the guns need air to fire in the Firefly universe? It strikes me as remotely possible that Jayne just didnā€™t know what he was talking about. Also, from a practical standpoint, wouldnā€™t an air-cooled firearm (like most tend to be) have serious issues in a vacuum where thereā€™s no air to do the cooling? ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/27 "2005-09-29T07:00:37Z")
Or maybe the gun senses air pressure, windage, and humidity, so that its computer can compensate for bullet drop. Put it in a vacuum, and the computer shuts down the gun. But itā€™s a niggling point. Iā€™d be mad about it if it was an example of lazy writing, but Joss actually went to a technical expert to find out if guns need air to fire, and was given bad information. Stuff happens. Itā€™s curious to hear people argue this point when we never argue about ā€˜phasersā€™ that seem to be able to make matter vanish, or heat it, or just ā€˜stunā€™ people, or do all kinds of other magical things. Hell, they can even power a shuttlecraft. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 8:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/28 "2005-09-29T08:48:37Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Iā€™d be mad about it if it was an example of lazy writing, but Joss actually went to a technical expert to find out if guns need air to fire, and was given bad information. Not disbelieving, but interested in reading about this in detail, soā€¦ cite? ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/29 "2005-09-29T09:41:37Z")
Itā€™s in the DVD commentary for the episode. ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/30 "2005-09-29T11:50:13Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Itā€™s curious to hear people argue this point when we never argue about ā€˜phasersā€™ that seem to be able to make matter vanish, or heat it, or just ā€˜stunā€™ people, or do all kinds of other magical things. Hell, they can even power a shuttlecraft. Well, thatā€™s because phasers are perfectly reasonable, while guns that canā€™t fire in a vacuum is just SILLY šŸ˜ƒ ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/31 "2005-09-29T13:54:21Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Itā€™s a joke (one of the best), from the show. If you were explain to **RaguLeader** , Iā€™m pretty sure he whooshed you good. Anyway, a solar system with a lot of terraformable planets and moons? Well, the people fleeing Earth-that-was had hundreds of millions of systems to choose from, so naturally they went for the best. It doesnā€™t strike as particuarly improbable, compared to some of the (otherwise enojoyable) movieā€™s other flaws. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/32 "2005-09-29T16:19:40Z")
> [@Bryan Ekers](#): > > If you were explain to **RaguLeader** , Iā€™m pretty sure he whooshed you good. > Anyway, a solar system with a lot of terraformable planets and moons? Well, the people fleeing Earth-that-was had hundreds of millions of systems to choose from, so naturally they went for the best. It doesnā€™t strike as particuarly improbable, compared to some of the (otherwise enojoyable) movieā€™s other flaws. Yeah, as soon as I hit the Post button I remembered Washā€™s reply. Figured if I didnā€™t bring any attention to it no one would. But I guess this is something I gotta do myself! ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/33 "2005-09-29T16:20:22Z")
> [@Bryan Ekers](#): > > hundreds of millions of systems to choose from, so naturally they went for the best. I agree, whether they found it with sophistocated telescopes, Faster Than Horse trave,l or heard about it on AM radio late at night. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/34 "2005-09-29T16:46:49Z")
> [@Bryan Ekers](#): > > Anyway, a solar system with a lot of terraformable planets and moons? Well, the people fleeing Earth-that-was had hundreds of millions of systems to choose from, so naturally they went for the best. It doesnā€™t strike as particuarly improbable, compared to some of the (otherwise enojoyable) movieā€™s other flaws. Just to nit-pick a bit, I believe they had far fewer systems to choose from than that. Their propulsion systems seem more advanced than ours, but not much faster, really. Figure it would still take decades to travel the 4.5 light years to our nearest star, and weā€™ve only got 500 years to play with before Firefly takes place. There are something like 1300-1800 star systems within 50 light years from Earth, and some of those would be red giants, white dwarves (dwarfs?), binaries, ect. So maybe they reasonably had 600 star systems to choose from, at most. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/35 "2005-09-29T18:02:50Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > Just to nit-pick a bit, I believe they had far fewer systems to choose from than that. Their propulsion systems seem more advanced than ours, but not much faster, really. Figure it would still take decades to travel the 4.5 light years to our nearest star, and weā€™ve only got 500 years to play with before Firefly takes place. There are something like 1300-1800 star systems within 50 light years from Earth, and some of those would be red giants, white dwarves (dwarfs?), binaries, ect. So maybe they reasonably had 600 star systems to choose from, at most. Yes, but that presumes they have no FTL travel at all. As some other posters have indicated, itā€™s possible future humans have FTL, but itā€™s preposterously expensive and difficult to use. I can imagine the advanced telescopes of the next century or so being able to give a fairly accurate assessment of a star system, then FTL robot ships are sent to the most promising systems to compile detailed reports, and the best overall system is chosen for the colonists, who travelled on FTL ships with only enough fuel (or whatever) for the one-way trip. Iā€™m willing to suspend my disbelief that much, and once FTL travel is in the mix, it may not matter how far from Earth-that-was the Alliance is. If the movie is successful enough to get them to restart the series (my preferred outcome) it might be amusing if they establish that the Alliance system is five to six hundred light years from Earth and they are starting to detect 20th century radio and TV broadcasts. I expect westerns like _Bonanza_ would be popular. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/36 "2005-09-29T21:34:41Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > We are still being surprised by what we find as we discover extra-solar planets, so I donā€™t know why itā€™s so hard to believe there could be a much hotter star than ours that happens to have a really big habitable zone. With a big habitable zone, several gas-giant planets with orbits at different places in the habitable zone, each with a dozen or two moons big enough to be worth terraforming, plus maybe some binary planets in the zone (think of our Earth-Moon system, only with the two having closer to the same mass) and youā€™ve got yourself a decent _Firefly_-verse, with core planets and worlds out there on the fringe where former Independents would have a chance to operate under the Allianceā€™s radar. > [@levdrakon](#): > > Joss Whedon asks us to suspend disbelief for two important things. These are mentioned early on, then never spoken of again. One, sometime in the next 500 years or so, humans develop amazing terraforming technology. Two, humans develop amazing artificial gravity technology. The terraforming technology of the Firefly-verse, amazing as it might be, also involved a large input of unskilled human labor, per the bar conversation at the beginning of _Shindig_. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2005, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/37 "2005-09-29T23:08:49Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > The terraforming technology of the Firefly-verse, amazing as it might be, also involved a large input of unskilled human labor, per the bar conversation at the beginning of _Shindig_. That is pretty amazing on a planet or even moon scale. Did you have a couple hundred guys smashing up rocks? šŸ™‚ What did they say? ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2005, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/38 "2005-10-02T20:48:47Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Basing the whole universe of the show in one solar system makes a lot more sense in many ways, and not just because you donā€™t need FTL drive. For one thing, if you have relatively cheap and simple (i.e. capable of being obtained and run by a scruffy little band operating under the radar) FTL, itā€™s hard to explain why ā€œEarth that wasā€ isnā€™t being regularly revisited for salvage of valuable artifacts, etc. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2005, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/39 "2005-10-02T22:36:01Z")
> [@Steve MB](#): > > For one thing, if you have relatively cheap and simple (i.e. capable of being obtained and run by a scruffy little band operating under the radar) FTL, itā€™s hard to explain why ā€œEarth that wasā€ isnā€™t being regularly revisited for salvage of valuable artifacts, etc. Not really. Earth was ā€œused up.ā€ Humans have amazing terraforming technology, so to ā€œuse upā€ the Earth to the extent that you couldnā€™t revive it using your amazing terraforming technology, Earth would have to be a pretty thoroughly burnt-out husk. and for them to not have terraformed Venus, Mars, the Moon, and the assorted moons of Jupiter & Saturn, Iā€™m guessing the whole solar system must be an unusable husk. Or, by ā€œused upā€ the humans of the Firefly 'verse are just retelling a mythology about why the Chinese & US governments sent humans out to colonize a different solar system. Perhaps Earth is still out there somewhere, doing just fine. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2005, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858/40 "2005-10-02T23:06:34Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > Or, by ā€œused upā€ the humans of the Firefly 'verse are just retelling a mythology about why the Chinese & US governments sent humans out to colonize a different solar system. Perhaps Earth is still out there somewhere, doing just fine. Iā€™d go with that. The analogy of Europe and ā€œNew Worldā€. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefly-serenity-verse-question/323858.md?page=3)