# Firefox browser? Attraction? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 21, 2004, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352 "2004-10-21T05:13:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Larry\_Griffin-Kentzel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_griffin-kentzel/32/14787_2.png) [@Larry\_Griffin-Kentzel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Griffin-Kentzel)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2004, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/21 "2004-10-21T15:50:14Z")
This thread is better suited for **IMHO**. I’ll move it for you. **Cajun Man** for the SDMB ---
**Author:** ![MysteryFellow63427](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e4f/32.png) [@MysteryFellow63427](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MysteryFellow63427)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2004, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/22 "2004-10-21T16:53:50Z")
> [@Keapon Laffin](#): > > Unless you tweak the settings for Firefox, it performs much lower. > Here are the [benchmark results](http://www.neowin.net/forum/lofiversion/index.php/t195461.html) to prove it. > > Stop saying BS unless you can back it up. This cite is not a serious benchmark, it’s just a web forum with some people anecdotally sharing non-scientifically obtained data points. I’m not saying IE is slower or faster, just that your cite doesn’t prove anything. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2004, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/23 "2004-10-21T18:37:38Z")
I’m not going to get into an argument over something so inconsequential as what browser I prefer but just want to say that **XJETGIRLX** ’s post mirrors what I would have said. Even as a self-admitted _layman_, my _subjective_ opinions on the benefits of IE vs. Firefox are just as valid as your’s, **Keapon** , especially since, as \*\*neuroman \*\*stated, your cite is anecdotal, meaning you have no objective proof yourself. In the end, it all comes down to what is preferred and I’m quite content with Firefox for my stated reasons: it’s easy to install and use even for a neophyte; prevents too many hijacks (which are not caused only by porn sites, thanks); and has a faster page load _in my experience_. ---
**Author:** ![Tentacle\_Monster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ba9def/32.png) [@Tentacle\_Monster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tentacle_Monster)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2004, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/24 "2004-10-21T18:43:45Z")
I dive into the seamy underbelly of the 'Net pretty often with Firefox. Hell, I’ve got extensions installed pretty much exclusively for porn sites (NextImage, DownThemAll). I have _never, ever_ been hijacked, or had spyware install itself, or even so much as had my start page changed. 'Course, I also run Linux exclusively. Anyone ever caught malware on Firefox for Windows? ---
**Author:** ![XJETGIRLX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9fc29f/32.png) [@XJETGIRLX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XJETGIRLX)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2004, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/25 "2004-10-21T21:57:13Z")
> [@Tentacle Monster](#): > > 'Course, I also run Linux exclusively. Anyone ever caught malware on Firefox for Windows? _Very_ rarely. I run spybot and Ad-aware once a week and have noticed a sizable decrease in the number of suspicious objects since switching. I’ve also had exactly zero unwanted popups. I’ve been running it for a few months now. ---
**Author:** ![ticker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d07c76/32.png) [@ticker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ticker)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2004, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/26 "2004-10-21T23:23:18Z")
> [@cowgirl](#): > > The only thing I don’t like about Firefox is that when you go ‘back’ to a page it takes you to the top of the page, instead of the last place you were. > > Anyone know how to remedy that? Are you using the latest version? I had that using 0.91 (I think) but now I am on 1.0 seems to be OK. 1.0 seems to be just a tad better in all sorts of little ways. ---
**Author:** ![Keapon\_Laffin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e274bd/32.png) [@Keapon\_Laffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keapon_Laffin)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2004, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/27 "2004-10-22T01:54:33Z")
> [@nueroman](#): > > This cite is not a serious benchmark, it’s just a web forum with some people anecdotally sharing non-scientifically obtained data points. > > I’m not saying IE is slower or faster, just that your cite doesn’t prove anything. > [@Aesiron](#): > > Even as a self-admitted _layman_, my _subjective_ opinions on the benefits of IE vs. Firefox are just as valid as your’s The cite was supposed to prove that claims that Firefox is faster than IE are \*\*not \*\* true. All these Firefox converts who tout the fact that Firefox is faster are just plain ignorant. Subjective opinions lead to bias, and if you moved to Firefox because you believed that it is faster or bug-free, you are sadly mistaken. Since Firefox lends itself to so much tweaking and it is impossible to get a fully objective review, here are some links to Firefox tweaks: [A simpler Firefox tweak guide](http://www.tweakfactor.com/articles/tweaks/firefoxtweak/) [A more comprehensive tweak explanation](http://forums.mozillazine.org/viewtopic.php?t=53650)(fyi, Gecko is the layout engine used by Firefox) [An objective benchmark from last year for older browsers](http://www.greymagic.com/dagon/results.html) If you check out the forums on Mozilla, or the Net for that matter, you’ll see many such optimization pages and tips-and-tricks pages because Firefox requires you to customize it to your PC in order to get the best performance. ---
**Author:** ![TeaElle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8491ac/32.png) [@TeaElle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TeaElle)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2004, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/28 "2004-10-22T02:03:07Z")
> [@Keapon Laffin](#): > > Firefox is a smaller browser, therefore, it is not targeted by hackers as much as IE. Which makes it safer to use. Close, but no cigar. Firefox’s smaller user numbers aren’t why it’s safer, it’s lack of gaping security holes, standard “security” settings that allow the execution of malicious scripts and code, standard permission of pop-up windows (which are where a lot of the junk lurks) and lack of back-end lock into the operating system (for Windows users) which makes _everything_ on the hard drive vulnerable. > [@XJETGIRLX](#): > > Very rarely. I run spybot and Ad-aware once a week and have noticed a sizable decrease in the number of suspicious objects since switching. I’ve also had exactly zero unwanted popups. I’ve been running it for a few months now. What are you using for e-mail? If you’re using Outlook, that’s the likely source for anything suspicious that’s still sneaking in. Thunderbird would help. ---
**Author:** ![Keapon\_Laffin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e274bd/32.png) [@Keapon\_Laffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keapon_Laffin)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2004, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/29 "2004-10-22T02:14:17Z")
> [@TeaElle](#): > > Close, but no cigar. Firefox’s smaller user numbers aren’t why it’s safer, it’s lack of gaping security holes, standard “security” settings that allow the execution of malicious scripts and code, standard permission of pop-up windows (which are where a lot of the junk lurks) and lack of back-end lock into the operating system (for Windows users) which makes _everything_ on the hard drive vulnerable. I disagree. You just don’t see the gaping holes because the hackers don’t target Firefox as much as they do IE. Again, if you think that Firefox is bug-free, its not. Firefox releases patches to fix security vulnerabilites as often as Microsoft. ---
**Author:** ![Cazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cazzle/32/75_2.png) [@Cazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cazzle)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2004, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/30 "2004-10-22T03:12:56Z")
> [@Aesiron](#): > > And Keapon, to try to imply that all Firefox users use it simply because it’s the new shiny toy is not only erroneous, it’s offensively condescending. I’m the last person to try new programs due to my lack of computer knowledge but after having used this browser, I much prefer it due to the aformentioned reasons, not because I’m a sheep, mindlessly following the rest of the flock. I agree. I have a fair amount of computer knowledge but am resistant to change. I tried Firefox out of curiosity, and loved it so much that I made it my default browser. The tabbed browsing is the key feature that I enjoy, and the AdBlock extension works really well for me. I find it faster than IE. ---
**Author:** ![leenmi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f1d935/32.png) [@leenmi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leenmi)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2004, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/31 "2004-10-22T04:40:42Z")
**Cisco** , it might be that you are an Opera user. I love my Opera browser the mostest. I like Firefox, but there is something about it that makes me itch for Opera when I use it. I’ve noticed many other Opera users feel the same way. As to why they would pick it over Opera or IE: It’s free. I love my Opera browser enough to pay for it. Other people get caught up on the Free as in Beer definition of Free and scoff at paying. It’s a browser without the bloat. Any bloat in Firefox is an extension added by the user. That’s a pretty nice feature. It’s easily extensible and themeable. It works on so many platforms. You can have the same browser experience/feel at work, at home, on Windows, on Linux, on \*BSD - heck I can even use it on Solaris and Solaris x86 (Opera failed me on Solaris x86). There are more, but those are the ones I’ve used it on. For those of you that only use one operating system, that’s not such a big deal, but for those of us that do, it means a lot. Opera and Firefox are not tightly integrated with Windows. This separation makes it more difficult (not impossible) to attack. Opera and Firefox actually add features/improvements/fixes regularly. Microsoft let IE stagnate. Horribly. They are just now adding features to a release that will come out in their definition of soon that have been in other browsers for quite some time now. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2004, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/32 "2004-10-22T06:58:36Z")
> [@Ponder Stibbons](#): > > As Mr. Laffin says, a lot of people are using it simply because all the popular kids are using it and don’t really know why they’re using it. 🙂 Even if this were true—and it demonstrably is not—so what? Using Firefox just because it’s the new popular thing is no more or less silly than using IE just because it happens to come as part of a monopoly operating system. I’m not especially concerned with explaining why i use Firefox, because i don’t care what other people think of my computer settings. But i’ll just say one thing: even if Firefox were no better in any way than IE, the very fact that it’s no worse, and is open source and non-Microsoft to boot, would be a good enough reason to use it, in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Hanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b3f665/32.png) [@Hanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hanna)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2004, 10:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/33 "2004-10-22T10:49:36Z")
Another annoyance I have with Firefox (And I’m not that annoyed, really, I just realize I need to use IE to view certain pages) is pages like [NFL.com](http://NFL.com). It opens, then loads, then loads again, and again, etc. It’s too jittery to view with Firefox. Does anyone else have that problem? There are a few other sites that are like that, they won’t load properly in Firefox. Since the FF experts seem to be gathered here, what is up with that? I like Firefox, I really do. But I get annoyed when I have to switch back to IE to view pages that won’t load. And does anyone have random crashes with FF? Java will crash FF, and opening gmail will shut it down. I’m trying to figure out why. ---
**Author:** ![Hanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b3f665/32.png) [@Hanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hanna)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2004, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/34 "2004-10-22T11:51:37Z")
Nevermind - I just noticed I was still using vers. 0.9 and I updated to 1.0, the [NFL.com](http://NFL.com) problem seems to be solved. ---
**Author:** ![KidCharlemagne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2004, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/35 "2004-10-22T12:57:39Z")
Firefox isn’t much until you set it up (which admittedly, is a pain in the ass). The most potent combo of extensions is tab browser extensions with Mouse Gestures. Mouse gestures is just unreal. I thought it would be gimmicky but it isn’t. I suggest everyone who hasn’t tried it to try it. I also love how on the link bar you can put folders that open up all the web pages in it at once. For Example, I have all the boards and the subcription page for the SDMB in one folder. Middle click and they all open. ---
**Author:** ![Ponder\_Stibbons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponder_stibbons/32/343_2.png) [@Ponder\_Stibbons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponder_Stibbons)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2004, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/36 "2004-10-22T13:33:18Z")
> [@myself](#): > > As Mr. Laffin says, a lot of people are using it simply because all the popular kids are using it and don’t really know why they’re using it. > [@mhendo](#): > > Even if this were true—and it demonstrably is not—so what? Well, that was kinda _my_ point. I’m sure I overstated it, but some people out there have loaded Firefox just because other people are doing it. _As a Firefox user myself_ the implication I was getting at (and apparently failed) was “so what?” pretty much as you say above. ---
**Author:** ![Hanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b3f665/32.png) [@Hanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hanna)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2004, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/37 "2004-10-24T17:46:02Z")
> [@](#): > > ``` > Nevermind - I just noticed I was still using vers. 0.9 and I updated to 1.0, the NFL.com problem seems to be solved. > > ``` I take that back. I am still having problems viewing [NFL.com](http://NFL.com) with Firefox. Checking gmail has only caused the latest version to crash once, so that is a slight improvement. I also have problems with a few other pages in Firefox…anyone else experience these problems? ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2004, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/38 "2004-10-24T20:31:27Z")
Maybe it’s a flash plug-in problem? I just got a new desktop and have been installing all the components that I had on my old one and for the first couple days, flash and firefox just did not get along. It seems to work fine for me now though. ---
**Author:** ![Elysian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c77e96/32.png) [@Elysian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elysian)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2004, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/39 "2004-10-24T20:54:25Z")
Who cares what browser another person is using? Really. I use either Opera or Firefox, because IE sucks on my computer. I’m not sure why, but I’ve added all the updates and screwed around with the preferences and ran a couple .dll files that the support techs recommended, and IE still hangs for as much as twenty second for a popup window, even a wanted popup window. I added popup blocking toolbars, and they blocked the popups, but IE would still hang. So now I use the alternative browsers. I mostly use Firefox even though I love Opera better, because Firefox handles Westlaw and LexisNexis better than Opera. Sometimes I can’t even log into those pages using Opera. However, I would use Opera exclusively over Firefox if those pages weren’t an issue. Opera is just sleeker-looking and I find the tabbed browsing easier. I also like the options available on Opera to suit my needs better. I didn’t know that you could add on stuff to Firefox to make it look better. I think I will spend the rest of the day surfing for that. Oh, and shoes of course. But really, who cares if I don’t use IE? I think this **Kaepon** fellow has a private issue he’s not telling us about. ---
**Author:** ![emekthian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecae2f/32.png) [@emekthian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emekthian)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2004, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352/40 "2004-10-24T20:54:39Z")
The major problem I have with Firefox and Mozilla is the lack of a way to customize the tab bar. In Opera, I often have 20-30 pages open in the windows panel, which I have set to the left of the screen. But in Firefox, the only way to manage seperate pages is with the tab bar on the top of the screen. That, and the lack of Opera’s ability to add bookmarked pages directly to a subfolder were the biggest reasons why I didn’t continue using Firefox. Also, Opera looks more slick than Firefox. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/firefox-browser-attraction/270352.md?page=3)