# First Contact Scenario **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 11, 2010, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360 "2010-09-11T01:07:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2010, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/41 "2010-09-12T03:16:51Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > I would think it would be far more likely that they are atheists, and one of their instructions to the human race is to get over all our god delusions. > > What if they tell us we can have virtual immortality through their medical technology, and an interstellar drive to go out and visit the universe, if we dump our religious beliefs – all of them. We could get that on our own if we dump our religious beliefs – all of them. Do you see that happening? Why would an alien’s offer of the same thing, only quicker, cause us to take them up on their offer? ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2010, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/42 "2010-09-12T03:27:09Z")
No, actually, I don’t see it happening. Rather, I can see the offer being made, but it would be rejected. For awhile at least. ---
**Author:** ![tclouie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/838e76/32.png) [@tclouie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tclouie)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2010, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/43 "2010-09-12T03:38:30Z")
Damon Knight, _Rule Golden_. The aliens really are benevolent, and forcibly stop all killing and suffering inflicted by vertebrates on other vertebrates, even if this means the extinction of every carnivorous species. When it’s over, they really do pack up and leave. Robert Silverberg, _The Alien Years_. The aliens really are untouchable (like the OP), but they are not benevolent or even understandable (unlike the OP). This, to me, is the more likely scenario. After all, if you’re advanced enough to travel between the stars, why would you pay attention to the opinions of the amoebae you just landed on??? In _TAY_, the aliens basically ignore humanity until the first dumbass attack on them, and then they retaliate massively, first by negating electricity, then by worldwide plague. With the help of human traitors, they gradually assert more and more control over human society. Cities are walled off and life turns to hell. Then, fifty years later, they just leave, again giving no reason. The story is told from the point of view of the human “resistance,” which survives principally by 1) being materially self-sufficient, and 2) by not being able to do squat against the aliens. Resistance strategy meetings are divided between “Let’s do something!” and “Noooo, don’t for God’s sake!!!” They can’t even launch a lethal attack until the aliens are nearly ready to leave, and even then the attacker has to be trained to be an emotionless drone so that his emotional state won’t be detected. The Silverberg scenario to me is more credible than the “get you ready to join galactic civilization” scenario. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2010, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/44 "2010-09-12T04:09:42Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#): > > I’d also be worried about the practical aspects of their protectorate. They might have honestly, genuinely good motivations, but have flawed points of ideology they’d want to impose, or have a completely perfect plan for what they want to impose, but flawed means of trying to implement it. Yeah, if they care about something specific like North Korea, that’s kind of a red flag. I’d expect serious mature aliens to just show up, explain the situation and lay down the terms for our accession to civilized-species status, and leave it to us to get with the program. If North Korea (or whoever) doesn’t and _we_ can’t make them, they’ll just keep our planet in the time-out corner for a few more centuries. I don’t imagine they’re in any particular rush to incorporate petulant youngsters. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2010, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/45 "2010-09-12T06:12:44Z")
> [@](#): > > Suppose they are deists but tolerate all religions as long as it non-violent and doesn’t oppose their “protectorate” violently. Suppose they don’t believe in any sort of diety at all? I think that would be far more likely. While religion has played a role in education and advancement in the past, today it serves more as a hindrance to progress, especially scientific progress. I mean, we STILL have people who believe in Creationism/ID, and who want those subject taught in public science classes, and who DON’T want evolution taught. Understanding evolution is critical to understanding all life sciences. And we have various religious groups oppressing various segments of society (women or certain ethnic groups), and some religious leaders restrict the kind of aid that’s offered around the world. And, of course, there’s the religious people who don’t want public money spent on scientific research, especially space travel. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2010, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/46 "2010-09-12T07:11:11Z")
> [@spark240](#): > > > [@Ranchoth](#): > > > > I’d also be worried about the practical aspects of their protectorate. They might have honestly, genuinely good motivations, but have flawed points of ideology they’d want to impose, or have a completely perfect plan for what they want to impose, but flawed means of trying to implement it. > > Yeah, if they care about something specific like North Korea, that’s kind of a red flag. > > I’d expect serious mature aliens to just show up, explain the situation and lay down the terms for our accession to civilized-species status, and leave it to us to get with the program. If North Korea (or whoever) doesn’t and _we_ can’t make them, they’ll just keep our planet in the time-out corner for a few more centuries. I don’t imagine they’re in any particular rush to incorporate petulant youngsters. Maybe they’ll decide Lil Kim is truly our greatest leader. I wouldn’t put dumbshit aliens out of the realm of possibility. I rather like David Brin’s universe where most of the aliens are way crazier than us, and way more powerful too. ---
**Author:** ![BayouHazard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d78d45/32.png) [@BayouHazard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BayouHazard)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2010, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/47 "2010-09-12T07:11:24Z")
Would they treat us as individuals or as a species? Probably as a species. Which is pretty depressing. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2010, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/48 "2010-09-16T16:41:43Z")
> [@fuzzypickles](#): > > There will always be a sizeable group of people who perceive the new alien overlords as a threat and fight against them, no matter how benevolent the extraterrestrials appear to be. Heck, we’ve still got people protesting the G8 Summit on an annual basis, fer cripe’s sake. > > And who’s to say they would choose our democracy over all the other government forms? Perhaps the extraterrestrials would consider the Taliban or the NK dictatorship to be _their_ ideal form of government, according to their own particular moral standards. > > > [@Doo\_Gettalong](#): > > > > Since the only extraterrestrial life is the Creator and His angels, and since you will see the destruction of those who oppose His chosen people very soon, I don’t think you will have any recourse but to surrender to Him, or face the Lake. That’s just my understanding of the truth. > > Now there’s a classic example of Poe’s Law. But Poe’s Law states: “Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humour, it is impossible to create a parody of fundamentalism that someone won’t mistake for the real thing.” and I’m not sure this is a parody. So - **Doo Gettalong** - parody or real? Did I get whooshed? ---
**Author:** ![mack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mack)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2010, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/49 "2010-09-16T17:52:09Z")
> [@Washoe](#): > > Are their females hot? and…do they have…waginas? [/Chekov] [QUOTE=Curtis LeMay] How would you react? [/QUOTE] I’d probably grab the wife, kids, and cat, and hole up in our dacha upstate. We can monitor the situation from there. I’d be a little antsy staying on a small island with a million and a half people and aliens wandering around. Even if they do enjoy our wonderful museums. You never know when something might snap. “Hey Glort, check this out!” ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2010, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/50 "2010-09-16T18:05:26Z")
Pester them non-stop for an encyclopedia. I want to know as much as possible about the other members of the Galactic Federation. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![clnilsen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecccb3/32.png) [@clnilsen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clnilsen)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2010, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/51 "2010-09-16T18:20:17Z")
One scenario I am surprised to never have seen in Sci-Fi is the traditional “Hi Earthlings, we’re aliens here in Peace” situation is a group of aliens arrive on the _moon (or even Mars)_, and send a nice little message about how they’re here to colonize that place, but have no interest in Earth and have no plans to come down. Just taking a piece of open real-estate and all. Practically speaking, we can’t do diddly squat to them from where we are given current (or even foreseeable future) technology. I would imagine that the UN would get mightily strong under the control of some of the larger nations, and probably much more militaristic. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2010, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/52 "2010-09-16T18:37:45Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Pester them non-stop for an encyclopedia. I want to know as much as possible about the other members of the Galactic Federation. Heh. Not a bad idea…except that you’ll either want the Encyclopedia Galactica in a Terran language, or you’ll want language lessons in Lingua Federation. Actually, ask for TWO copies of the encyclopedia, one in Terran, and one in Federation, and for language lessons as well. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2010, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/53 "2010-09-16T21:21:54Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > I have a question. Sorry for the hijack, but I just noticed your title, I have a question for _you_, and you don’t allow PMs. (Seriously, who turns those off?) “I love the scent of women”? ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2010, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/54 "2010-09-16T21:28:30Z")
> [@tclouie](#): > > The aliens really are benevolent, and forcibly stop all killing and suffering inflicted by vertebrates on other vertebrates, even if this means the extinction of every carnivorous species. When it’s over, they really do pack up and leave. If they are benevolent, there’s no way they can force an obligate carnivore to stop killing for food without providing it with another source of nourishment. Otherwise, they cease to be benevolent. > [@clnilsen](#): > > One scenario I am surprised to never have seen in Sci-Fi is the traditional “Hi Earthlings, we’re aliens here in Peace” situation is a group of aliens arrive on the _moon (or even Mars)_, and send a nice little message about how they’re here to colonize that place, but have no interest in Earth and have no plans to come down. Just taking a piece of open real-estate and all. The Moon especially I would see as a piece of real estate that would be incredibly pointless to grab unless every other open inch of space in the galaxy is colonized, because of its size (small) and proximity to Earth. Mars, maybe. But even then it would probably have to be terraformed to be of any use, or have sealed bases put on it. So then why not pick a solar system that isn’t already inhabited by a species that’s probably pretty close to the cusp of the point when \*it \*will want to start expanding? ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/55 "2010-09-17T01:38:04Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > > [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > > > I have a question. > > Sorry for the hijack, but I just noticed your title, I have a question for _you_, and you don’t allow PMs. (Seriously, who turns those off?) > > “I love the scent of women”? :p:p:p. Hoooah! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/56 "2010-09-17T04:20:20Z")
> [@clnilsen](#): > > One scenario I am surprised to never have seen in Sci-Fi is the traditional “Hi Earthlings, we’re aliens here in Peace” situation is a group of aliens arrive on the _moon (or even Mars)_, and send a nice little message about how they’re here to colonize that place, but have no interest in Earth and have no plans to come down. Just taking a piece of open real-estate and all. > > Practically speaking, we can’t do diddly squat to them from where we are given current (or even foreseeable future) technology. I would imagine that the UN would get mightily strong under the control of some of the larger nations, and probably much more militaristic. Larry Niven did something close to that with the short story _Losing Mars_. The aliens, who as it happened were water breathers from the moon Europa showed up to ask if we intended to dispute their ownership of Mars seeing as they’d colonized it a few centuries ago. We just haven’t noticed because they were all underground in a subsurface ocean they’d “Europaformed”. Since the Chirpsithra, a race that basically claims to own the galaxy said they recognized the Europan claim there wasn’t a great deal we could do about it. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/57 "2010-09-17T04:31:08Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Suppose out of nowhere extraterrestrials appeared out of nowhere and broadcast their arrival on all radio, TV, and Internet networks. Their basic message is the following: They are highly advanced aliens who form one member state of a gigantic Galactic Federation that encompasses most of the Milky Way. They have recently discovered humanity and after analyzing what to do decided to make contact. They wish to make humanity advanced so as to become a member of the GF however since humans are primitive and petty they must establish a protectorate while they give advanced technology so humans will not abuse it. National governments will still exist but they will overthrow outright dictatorships (ie North Korea) and wipe off such groups as the Taliban once and for all. > > The aliens are genuine in their desire and will not for instance attempt to colonize Earth or anything like and they will withdraw their protectorate once the uplift is done. The aliens are essentially invincible to human weapons and advanced beyond human comprehension although they’re still mortal (think sort of like the Yithians in Lovecraft). How would you react? Wouldn’t you be afraid for the most aggressive country in the world?. The one that goes into one nation after another? Would you worry about the nation that does the most polluting of the planet? How about the one that does the most economic exploitation? We would have to change our ways. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/58 "2010-09-17T04:42:25Z")
It’s not clear to me why the aliens would focus on the most militarily and geopolitically insignificant actors such as N Korea and the Taliban. Heck, I’d think they would want to keep a couple of dictatorships around, if only to demonstrate how awful and ineffective they are. Arms control might be another matter, if only to get us into the proper habits. And there might be certain forbidden technologies that they don’t want developed here. Or maybe they don’t believe in arms control or collective government – according to this view, the only thing that could persuade the Earth from building weapons of mass destruction is invasion and overwhelming force. Or maybe that’s just a pretext that would allow the alien advance-men a profitable genome harvest. Intergalactic politics can be tricky. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/59 "2010-09-17T13:55:23Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > It’s not clear to me why the aliens would focus on the most militarily and geopolitically insignificant actors such as N Korea and the Taliban. Heck, I’d think they would want to keep a couple of dictatorships around, if only to demonstrate how awful and ineffective they are. I think you have to get inside **Curtis** ’ head who, it seems to me, looks at everything from a conservative Christian perspective, and believes everything that happens in the universe is somehow directly connected to Christianity/Jesus/the Christian God. I think conservative Christians, especially the American variety, have difficulty separating events, even hypothetical ones, from their religious beliefs. For example, conservative Christians _generally_ believe N Korea and the Taliban are evil, so naturally aliens would believe the same. **Curtis** has come up with some very interesting topics lately. I just wish he’d engage and respond to posters a little more before abandoning the threads he starts. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/60 "2010-09-17T14:10:12Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > … **Curtis** has come up with some very interesting topics lately. I just wish he’d engage and respond to posters a little more before abandoning the threads he starts. Perhaps at some level he recognizes that many of his positions are indefensible. They are literally a matter of faith, and there is very little point to discussing them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360.md?page=4)