# First Contact Scenario **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 11, 2010, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360 "2010-09-11T01:07:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/61 "2010-09-17T17:26:56Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > > [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > > > And why would you try to kill them? > > Because they attempt to impose their will on us. Oak don’t play that shit. Oh, you shot up your parents then. Noted. And if you try to stand between me and my new alien technology inspired high tech VR sex doll, you will be in serious trouble my friend. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/62 "2010-09-17T17:31:15Z")
Some of the responses here remind me of Kirk and the Klingon commander being really pissed off at the Organians for stopping the war. Sure NK is run by dangerous psychotics, but they are our psychotics, so don’t interfere. Ditto with extremist religious sects who shoot their opposition. I think **Shodan** had the best suggestion in the thread. Learn, learn, learn, so we could take our place as quickly as possible in the Galaxy. Just make sure that they aliens don’t look like devils, and, if they do, keep an eye on your kids. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/63 "2010-09-17T17:41:39Z")
What do devils look like? ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/64 "2010-09-17T18:12:04Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > What do devils look like? You’re just beggin’ to get RickRolled ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/65 "2010-09-17T23:26:01Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > > [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > > > It’s not clear to me why the aliens would focus on the most militarily and geopolitically insignificant actors such as N Korea and the Taliban. Heck, I’d think they would want to keep a couple of dictatorships around, if only to demonstrate how awful and ineffective they are. > > I think you have to get inside **Curtis** ’ head who, it seems to me, looks at everything from a conservative Christian perspective, and believes everything that happens in the universe is somehow directly connected to Christianity/Jesus/the Christian God. I think conservative Christians, especially the American variety, have difficulty separating events, even hypothetical ones, from their religious beliefs. For example, conservative Christians _generally_ believe N Korea and the Taliban are evil, so naturally aliens would believe the same. If aliens have the rational secular humanist ethical system of basically the Golden Rule and what benefits the majority is usually the best they will of course believe Kim Jong Il and Osama Bin Laden to be evil. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/66 "2010-09-17T23:47:22Z")
Why would they have a “humanist” ethical system? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2010, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/67 "2010-09-18T00:18:57Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Why would they have a “humanist” ethical system? Because our vocabulary for such things was codified under the assumption that people = human. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2010, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/68 "2010-09-18T00:52:32Z")
“Sapient ethical system” or “Intelligent being ethical system”. You know what I mean. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2010, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/69 "2010-09-18T01:35:35Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > > [@Oakminster](#): > > > > Because they attempt to impose their will on us. Oak don’t play that shit. > > Oh, you shot up your parents then. Noted. > > . Yeah. That’s a fair implication of what I said. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2010, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/70 "2010-09-18T02:08:49Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > “Sapient ethical system” or “Intelligent being ethical system”. You know what I mean. You are proposing that there is some sort of “universal” ethical system? ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2010, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/71 "2010-09-18T03:03:08Z")
If we are lucky, aliens will treat us like cats and dogs. Neutering line forms on the right, spaying line to the left. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2010, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/72 "2010-09-18T04:36:02Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > > [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > > > I think you have to get inside **Curtis** ’ head who, it seems to me, looks at everything from a conservative Christian perspective, and believes everything that happens in the universe is somehow directly connected to Christianity/Jesus/the Christian God. I think conservative Christians, especially the American variety, have difficulty separating events, even hypothetical ones, from their religious beliefs. For example, conservative Christians _generally_ believe N Korea and the Taliban are evil, so naturally aliens would believe the same. > > If aliens have the rational secular humanist ethical system of basically the Golden Rule and what benefits the majority is usually the best they will of course believe Kim Jong Il and Osama Bin Laden to be evil. …but they might have bigger fish to fry. Ref: The Congo (worst war in the past 50 years), Sudan, [or maybe some of these issues](http://www.un.org/en/events/tenstories/08/). If you’re going to liberate the Chinese, start in Beijing, not on the Mongolian border or some remote province like Henan. Again, the Taliban and N Korea are strictly marginal geopolitically and even ethically at least when there is no famine. > [@Voyager](#): > > Some of the responses here remind me of Kirk and the Klingon commander being really pissed off at the Organians for stopping the war. Sure NK is run by dangerous psychotics, but they are our psychotics, so don’t interfere. Ditto with extremist religious sects who shoot their opposition. Oddly enough, I suspect that the aliens would be pretty well bunkered. Crazies and lunkheads don’t tend to think too deeply about consequence or futility, so I suspect that human collaborators would be targeted, even if they were lawful or democratically elected. Somebody has to pay, or so the thinking goes. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2010, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/73 "2010-09-18T05:41:12Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > > [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > > > I think you have to get inside **Curtis** ’ head who, it seems to me, looks at everything from a conservative Christian perspective, and believes everything that happens in the universe is somehow directly connected to Christianity/Jesus/the Christian God. I think conservative Christians, especially the American variety, have difficulty separating events, even hypothetical ones, from their religious beliefs. For example, conservative Christians _generally_ believe N Korea and the Taliban are evil, so naturally aliens would believe the same. > > If aliens have the rational secular humanist ethical system of basically the Golden Rule and what benefits the majority is usually the best they will of course believe Kim Jong Il and Osama Bin Laden to be evil. Thank you for responding, **Curtis.** I appreciate it. I see no reason to believe aliens would have anything akin to human motivations for actions they take or decisions they make. However, you did say “if”. Okay, so if we stipulate that aliens, inexplicably, have the same ethical underpinnings we consider all “good” people do, how do you know they wouldn’t arrive at different assumptions than yours, based on circumstances as presented? Who knows? Maybe aliens would find America’s undying support for Israel ridiculous, selfish, and not at all in-keeping with what benefits the majority. Think about it. Aliens wouldn’t have any of the emotional and theological baggage humans do. Without that, and armed solely with facts, don’t you think they’d conclude, for example, that Iran has every right to feel as it does about America and Britain based on a series of transgressions under which it suffered since the 1950s when BP tried reestablish its control over the Iranian oil industry, culminating in the US-backed coup resulting in Mossadeq’s (sp?) ousting? I think aliens’ conclusions on who the good and bad guys are would be very surprising to you. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2010, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/74 "2010-09-18T07:24:06Z")
Well, I’m a Keith Laumer fan. _And God bless each one of them The Monitors…_ ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2010, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/75 "2010-09-18T07:41:13Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > I think you have to get inside **Curtis** ’ head who, it seems to me, looks at everything from a conservative Christian perspective, and believes everything that happens in the universe is somehow directly connected to Christianity/Jesus/the Christian God. I think conservative Christians, especially the American variety, have difficulty separating events, even hypothetical ones, from their religious beliefs. For example, conservative Christians _generally_ believe N Korea and the Taliban are evil, so naturally aliens would believe the same. I think this is more a matter of youth & inexperience in thinking “outside the box” than religious affiliation. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/76 "2010-09-20T19:24:44Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > > [@Voyager](#): > > > > Just make sure that they aliens don’t look like devils, and, if they do, keep an eye on your kids. > > What do devils look like? It’s a reference to [a novel by Arthur C. Clarke](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Childhood%27s_End). ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/77 "2010-09-20T20:33:06Z")
Yeah, for me this whole scenario swings on _how_ they remove dictators and the taliban. Even assuming that they have some godlike way to know exactly who the bad guys are, do they get a trial? Do they get rehabilitated, or just poofed? The remaining population would almost certainly not thank the aliens for their intervention (e.g. in north korea, thanks to the propaganga, KJI is like a messiah), what would the aliens do about that? Keep killing people until there are no supporters of the old regime? If we omit the stuff about removing bad guys without prior consultation, I’d see the scenario as cause for cautious celebration. As I’ve said on previous threads, the scenario of aliens attacking is far less likely than many assume, IMO. And even if they were to attack, there’s no reason for them to _lie_ about it – they’d just attack; we’re no threat. [Citizen Kang](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treehouse_of_Horror_VII#Citizen_Kang) type scenarios are fun, but they aren’t going to happen. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2010, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/78 "2010-09-20T21:14:09Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > Yeah, for me this whole scenario swings on _how_ they remove dictators and the taliban. My WAG, and the best possible scenario I could envision, is that they remove the ability of anyone to harm anyone else or coerce them by force. So it’s not that they’d actively remove regimes so much as defang them. > [@](#): > > e.g. in north korea, thanks to the propaganga, KJI is like a messiah The question there’s unfortunately no way to answer is, how many people actually \*believe \*the propaganda, versus go along with it on the surface because that’s the only way to survive? ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360/79 "2010-09-21T16:17:04Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > > [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > > > What do devils look like? > > It’s a reference to [a novel by Arthur C. Clarke](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Childhood%27s_End). I once read an enthusiastic review of it which hoped for a movie version… would you believe it was by C.S. Lewis? Yep! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-contact-scenario/553360.md?page=3)