# First paycheck! Hooray! Got to keep a whole 28% of it... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 17, 2016, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203 "2016-09-17T21:58:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/81 "2016-09-20T12:01:43Z")
So you’re both alleging I’ll receive the money back _before_ filing tax returns, and it won’t ever make its way to the IRS’s bank account? So you’re saying it’s still in the company’s coffers? Cuz if so, cool, let’s blame payroll and get my money back. But if the company says “sorry, we already sent it and there’s no way to undo it” and I have to wait 'til April to get paid, then it’s 100% consistent with my bitching. In other words, I’m well aware I’ll at least get it back when I file my return. That was never in doubt. I’m asking if I’ll get it back sooner or if someone (payroll or IRS) with play “finders, keep-for-nowers”. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/82 "2016-09-20T12:10:59Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > So you’re both alleging I’ll receive the money back _before_ filing tax returns, and it won’t ever make its way to the IRS’s bank account? So you’re saying it’s still in the company’s coffers? Cuz if so, cool, let’s blame payroll and get my money back. > > But if the company says “sorry, we already sent it and there’s no way to undo it” and I have to wait 'til April to get paid, then it’s 100% consistent with my bitching. In other words, I’m well aware I’ll at least get it back when I file my return. That was never in doubt. I’m asking if I’ll get it back sooner or if someone (payroll or IRS) with play “finders, keep-for-nowers”. You should be able to alter your tax withholding with your payroll department to get that money back in your next paycheck or two, though it may require some careful calculation (and then restoring the withholding back to normal afterwards). ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/83 "2016-09-20T12:15:34Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > I earned $100 (4 days) but they treated it like it was $250 (10 days). What kind of job only pays $25 per _day_? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/84 "2016-09-20T12:50:18Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > So you’re both alleging I’ll receive the money back _before_ filing tax returns, and it won’t ever make its way to the IRS’s bank account? So you’re saying it’s still in the company’s coffers? Cuz if so, cool, let’s blame payroll and get my money back. > > But if the company says “sorry, we already sent it and there’s no way to undo it” and I have to wait 'til April to get paid, then it’s 100% consistent with my bitching. In other words, I’m well aware I’ll at least get it back when I file my return. That was never in doubt. I’m asking if I’ll get it back sooner or if someone (payroll or IRS) with play “finders, keep-for-nowers”. The way pretty much every payroll works is that they withhold the money, then usually monthly (sometimes quarterly), they send that money in to the government. They do still have your money. It is sitting in your employer’s bank account right now. Whether or not they lie and blame the IRS, or own up to their error, however, is anybody’s guess. ---
**Author:** ![StrangeBird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e480ec/32.png) [@StrangeBird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StrangeBird)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/85 "2016-09-20T12:55:14Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > What kind of job only pays $25 per _day_? I suspect he’s using those as example figures, and doesn’t want to give us actual pay numbers (nor does he need to in order to illustrate his point). ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/86 "2016-09-20T12:55:41Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > What kind of job only pays $25 per _day_? Pretty sure we were to take that as an example. **Chessic** , I’m not sure where the money sits right now. I’m 100% sure it’s inappropriate to lay responsibility for this error at the IRS’s doorstep, as your OP did. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/87 "2016-09-20T12:58:22Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > What kind of job only pays $25 per _day_? Crackwhore? Wait, nevermind. According to Glassdoor they typically get around $30 a day. Assistant crackwhore. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/88 "2016-09-20T13:16:12Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > So you’re both alleging I’ll receive the money back _before_ filing tax returns, and it won’t ever make its way to the IRS’s bank account? So you’re saying it’s still in the company’s coffers? Cuz if so, cool, let’s blame payroll and get my money back. > > But if the company says “sorry, we already sent it and there’s no way to undo it” and I have to wait 'til April to get paid, then it’s 100% consistent with my bitching. In other words, I’m well aware I’ll at least get it back when I file my return. That was never in doubt. I’m asking if I’ll get it back sooner or if someone (payroll or IRS) with play “finders, keep-for-nowers”. When you say “first paycheck” do you mean first in your life, or just first at this new job? If the latter, have you never had to adjust your withholding before? It should be very simple to submit a new W2 so that things even out over time. Just be careful you don’t end up under-withholding too much for the year and then end up paying a penalty in April. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/89 "2016-09-20T13:17:11Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > Thank you for reminding me why I don’t post here anymore, much less start threads. I temporarily forgot. SDMB is like Arrakis for conservatives, living here will make you stronger or it will kill you. I’m not conservative by most standards but I am definitely right of center for this board. We get pretty good rational liberals on this board (some very good) but like the thin blue line of cops that won’t turn in other bad cops, the good liberals won’t turn on the shitty ones (this is NOT directed at any particular poster, I’m talking in general terms) with enough regularity to keep them from being shitty. Where you see this most in those rare situations where the facts are contrary to the liberal argument. They are used to having the facts on their side and don’t know what to do when they are not so a lot of the shittier ones just keep acting like the facts are on their side. > [@](#): > > I left a message, but for some reason, they didn’t answer Saturday or Sunday. Weird.😛 Do you work for a small business? > [@](#): > > Ding ding ding ding! Winners! I had the same thought in the car this morning, so I punched it into the calculator and got the most likely explanation: They deducted as if it were a two-week period. > > I earned $100 (4 days) but they treated it like it was $250 (10 days). > > On $250, they would take: > $31.56 Federal (13.1% of post-insurance amount) > $14.92 Soc Sec (6.2%) > $3.49 Medicare (1.45%) > $12.56 State tax (5.25%) > $9.66 insurance (4%) > > But when I only earned $100 and they still took the same dollar figures, the percentages shoot up. I leave it to **Antibob** , math wonder, to calculate what percentage $14.92 of $100 is. > > It _should_ be a percentage, but it looks like they jacked it up. > > Special thanks to **Damuri Ajashi** , who made me realize not only are the taxes jacked up, but they charged me 2 weeks of insurance for 4 days of coverage! That’s the only charge that can’t be sorted out April 15th, worst-case. Someone owes me a refund! NP. It sounds like they owe you some money and if your insurance premium is ~$10/2 weeks I have to ask how much coverage you are getting because that is dirt cheap. You pay in a year what I pay in a month. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/90 "2016-09-20T13:24:23Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > Sure. Just quote the post you want me to apologize for. Is it “The government took 62%.”? Cuz it did. Or technically, payroll kept 62% on its behalf. I don’t care if payroll says “our bad” or “the government makes us do that.” Someone’s to blame. I’m still missing half a paycheck. > > All these folks saying I’m saying “Rawr! The gubmint took my money!” (lookin’ at you, **Deth** and **Euphonious** ) are reading what they want into it. _Someone_ took my money, cuz I sure as f don’t have it. > > I’ll report back whether payroll takes the blame or if they point a finger up the chain. I’m interested to know which it’ll be. Anyone wanna predict? I predict that your payroll department is using some free payroll app off of iTunes that was created by a 15 year old. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/91 "2016-09-20T13:28:47Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Like I also said "_No payroll dept could make this mistake, unless it was one person, by hand, and drunk." True, since the Op blamed this on the government, and I knew it could not_ be the Governments fault I imputed incorrect motives to the OP. I was wrong. \* Mea culpa\* for that. > > Still, the government made no mistake, the government is not getting this money\* (they will only get the correct %, not the errors) and indeed the Op’s payroll dept _is_ one drunk idiot who does payroll by crayon. > > My Bro worked 20 years for the IRS. When I contacted him about the OP, he said “Impossible, no withholding table or program in the world would do this. This can not be a IRS error. I think your Op is pulling your leg.” > > \*When the person who does the IRS taxes pays the IRS, they should do it by the overall correct rate. Errors like this are not sent to the IRS, they should be refunded to the employee. If this error shows up on the OP’s W-2 then he needs to contact the IRS who will send a carload of agents at their earliest convenience to assist the payroll dept in correcting this oversight.😛 I don’t know that Chessic works at a small business but the payroll department is frequently just someone the boss trusts with money. Payroll departments fuck up all the time unless you are using something like ADP, there are not enough checks in place to make sure that fuck ups get caught before they go out the door. The IRS would probably just call the employer if there was a fuck up. Same with the state tax agency. The insurance company will look at the extra money shrug its shoulders and stick it in the bank. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/92 "2016-09-20T13:34:35Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > So you’re both alleging I’ll receive the money back _before_ filing tax returns, and it won’t ever make its way to the IRS’s bank account? So you’re saying it’s still in the company’s coffers? Cuz if so, cool, let’s blame payroll and get my money back. > > But if the company says “sorry, we already sent it and there’s no way to undo it” and I have to wait 'til April to get paid, then it’s 100% consistent with my bitching. In other words, I’m well aware I’ll at least get it back when I file my return. That was never in doubt. I’m asking if I’ll get it back sooner or if someone (payroll or IRS) with play “finders, keep-for-nowers”. Companies send their estimated taxes and withholdings on a quarterly basis (they gather all your taxes and stuff, hold onto it for up to three months and then send it in), they true up every time they make a quarterly payment. So it is likely that haven’t sent the money out the door yet and even if they did, they can make you whole and just send less on their next quarterly estimated tax payment. Even if this was a billion dollar fuck up, there is really no reason they shouldn’t make you whole within three months but it is likely that they will make you whole immediately because the penalties for shorting your payroll in many states is pretty severe and we’re talking about ~$40. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/93 "2016-09-20T13:39:08Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > What kind of job only pays $25 per _day_? Part time jobs. If you are a stay at home mom and you work the lunch shift at some diner. If you are a student and you work the counter at McDonald’s for a couple of hours. etc. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/94 "2016-09-20T13:40:32Z")
> [@StrangeBird](#): > > I suspect he’s using those as example figures, and doesn’t want to give us actual pay numbers (nor does he need to in order to illustrate his point). Really? Damn, my first job paid less than that and it was full time. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/95 "2016-09-20T13:49:04Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Part time jobs. > > If you are a stay at home mom and you work the lunch shift at some diner. > > If you are a student and you work the counter at McDonald’s for a couple of hours. > > etc. The OP doesn’t strike me as a student or a stay at home mom. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Alley\_Dweller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alley_dweller/32/430_2.png) [@Alley\_Dweller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alley_Dweller)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/96 "2016-09-20T14:21:15Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Companies send their estimated taxes and withholdings on a quarterly basis (they gather all your taxes and stuff, hold onto it for up to three months and then send it in), they true up every time they make a quarterly payment. So it is likely that haven’t sent the money out the door yet and even if they did, they can make you whole and just send less on their next quarterly estimated tax payment. > > Even if this was a billion dollar fuck up, there is really no reason they shouldn’t make you whole within three months but it is likely that they will make you whole immediately because the penalties for shorting your payroll in many states is pretty severe and we’re talking about ~$40. Not true. [Employers must deposit federal taxes either monthly, semi-weekly, or next day](https://www.irs.gov/publications/p15/ar02.html#en_US_2016_publink1000202435)depending on the size of the deposit. Form 941 is filed quarterly, but deposits must be made more often. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/97 "2016-09-20T14:38:21Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Really? Damn, my first job paid less than that and it was full time. A full-time job paying $25/day would be paying less than half the minimum wage. ---
**Author:** ![StarvingButStrong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/starvingbutstrong/32/335_2.png) [@StarvingButStrong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StarvingButStrong)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/98 "2016-09-20T14:57:05Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I predict that your payroll department is using some free payroll app off of iTunes that was created by a 15 year old. You might be giving them too much credit. True story: Several decades ago now (where does the time go?) I took on an extra part time job, described as ‘general secretarial work’ for a small medical practice. Which makes one think I’d be, oh, filing, typing, answering the phone, making appointments and such like, right? First week they handed me this pad of generic graph paper with “Ledger” written on the cover in marker, and told me to “do the payroll.” Yup, totally untrained me, a pad of paper, a checkbook and a calculator. It was, as they say, a learning experience. Oh, I wasn’t totally without help: they gave me a ten year book called “Accounting for Small Businesses” and copies of the state and federal tax withholding tables. :eek: (Even more amazing is that four months later I was not only filling out and filing all the business/employer Federal and State tax forms, I was also doing the PERSONAL income tax returns of the senior physician!) And this went on until we moved away, nearly 8 years. How there was never a problem I can’t imagine. Who turns info/responsibility like that over to an utterly untrained parttimer?? And letting the same person do the accounting and have check signing power? With no one else ever really looking at the numbers let alone getting a professional to audit it or something? Even I knew they were leaving themselves open to be robbed blind. (Fortunately I’m not a thief.) But even though I did my best to do things ‘right’, I must have screwed stuff up here and there. At the very least, I’m sure there were dozens of things that should have been done to minimize taxes due that I had not the faintest inkling of. I pointed this out to Sr. Doctor many times, but he’d just sort of pat me on the shoulder and say “You’re doing a fine job” and head off to see the next patient. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/99 "2016-09-20T15:13:47Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > A full-time job paying $25/day would be paying less than half the minimum wage. I _think_ it could happen, though in commission or agricultural work. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2016, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203/100 "2016-09-20T15:42:54Z")
> [@StarvingButStrong](#): > > You might be giving them too much credit. > > True story: Several decades ago now (where does the time go?) I took on an extra part time job, described as ‘general secretarial work’ for a small medical practice. Which makes one think I’d be, oh, filing, typing, answering the phone, making appointments and such like, right? > > First week they handed me this pad of generic graph paper with “Ledger” written on the cover in marker, and told me to “do the payroll.” Yup, totally untrained me, a pad of paper, a checkbook and a calculator. > > It was, as they say, a learning experience. > > Oh, I wasn’t totally without help: they gave me a ten year book called “Accounting for Small Businesses” and copies of the state and federal tax withholding tables. :eek: > > (Even more amazing is that four months later I was not only filling out and filing all the business/employer Federal and State tax forms, I was also doing the PERSONAL income tax returns of the senior physician!) > > And this went on until we moved away, nearly 8 years. How there was never a problem I can’t imagine. Who turns info/responsibility like that over to an utterly untrained parttimer?? And letting the same person do the accounting and have check signing power? With no one else ever really looking at the numbers let alone getting a professional to audit it or something? Even I knew they were leaving themselves open to be robbed blind. (Fortunately I’m not a thief.) > > But even though I did my best to do things ‘right’, I must have screwed stuff up here and there. At the very least, I’m sure there were dozens of things that should have been done to minimize taxes due that I had not the faintest inkling of. I pointed this out to Sr. Doctor many times, but he’d just sort of pat me on the shoulder and say “You’re doing a fine job” and head off to see the next patient. You fool! You could have embezzled for years and no one would have ever known! 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-paycheck-hooray-got-to-keep-a-whole-28-of-it/766203.md?page=6)