There have been plenty since the '70s – my question was which was the first.
I don’t consider Saturday Night Fever to be a musical. While it has an extensive soundtrack, at no time during the movie do the characters sing the dialogue instead of just speaking it.
So you wouldn’t call All That Jazz a musical, either?
Huh.
I never said that. All That Jazz uses musical death-dream sequences that forward the storyline, and not merely enhance it.
Saturday Night Fever clearly isn’t a musical. It’s a film which has music and some plot-centric dancing in it. If Satuday Night Fever is a musical then so are countless other films that have scenes in night clubs.
The difference (to my mind) is that in musicals the song and dance numbers are usually conducted out of a context in which singing and dancing is usually carried out. Frequently the fact that people will have been singing and dancing is then completely ignored by the characters. There are obvious exceptions to this though, such as FAME.
I’ve never seen ‘All that Jazz’ but from the Wiki page it seems like musical to me. Wikipedia even decribes it as a ‘musical film’, though I admit that the context of a guy imagining musicals from his death bed (is that correct?) could be seen as ambiguous.
Whatever. I consider any film in which the characters do extensive singing and/or dancing a musical – and find it interesting to look at the changes in how that singing and dancing have been contextualized over the years.
I think the difference is that, in a musical the singing and/or dancing does more than enhance the storyline-it provides the storyline.
Heh.
♪*What’s the matter, Graverobber? Can’t get it up if the girl’s breathing? (I can’t feel nothing at all) *♫
Making Saturday Night Fever a musical, Q.E.D.
The characters neither sing nor dance in situations where they would not otherwise do so in real life. Dialog is said, not sang. Dancing is done either on the dance floor or in practice sessions, not in the streets or other public settings.
Not a musical, Q.E.D.
Guess we’ll just have to agree to disagree.
I don’t agree to that!
I am on your side..offered as proof:
Characters sing all of their lines = Opera (Phantom of the Opera, Miss Saigon)
Characters sing some of their lines = Musical (Oklahoma, South Pacific, Guys and Dolls, West Side Story)
Characters sing none of their lines = Movie
SNF is a movie. Hair (with Beverly D’Angelo) was a movie based on the Broadway MUSICAL of the same name. Same with Godspell, Annie, and Jesus Christ Superstar.
Nope, you’re on Czarcasm’s side, not mine – I don’t find singing by the characters necessary to call something a musical.
Sorry about that…realized it after the timeout. :smack:
So, I do disagree with you, because singing IS one watermark in defining a musical.
"…Musical theatre is closely related to another theatrical performance art, opera. These forms are usually distinguished by weighing a number of factors. **Musicals generally have a greater focus on spoken dialogue **(though some musicals are entirely accompanied and sung through; and on the other hand, some operas, such as Die Zauberflöte, and most operettas, have some unaccompanied dialogue); on dancing (particularly by the principal performers as well as the chorus); on the use of various genres of popular music (or at least popular singing styles); and on the avoidance of certain operatic conventions. In particular, a musical is almost always performed in the language of its audience. "
John Travolta did not sing any song in SNF. None of the principals did. SNF, by definition, cannot be a musical or an opera, no more than **Urban Cowboy **is.
**Grease **could be considered a musical, since Travolta and Newton-John (and the rest of the cast) sang and danced.
I’m not seeing a statement in your cite that the singing has to be by the characters.
(Gotta say, though, that I don’t really care – if you guys think some movies I’d call musicals aren’t, fine, go ahead and think that. I’m not particularly invested in the label one way or another.)
twickster, you are so wrong that when I read your OP I assumed a musical remake of Saturday Night Fever was coming out, because the 1977 movie is not a musical.
Would it help if we cited the Wikipedia entry for “musical film”? It starts off by saying,
“The musical film is a film genre in which several songs sung by the characters are interwoven into the narrative.”
Fine, whatever.
Saturday Night Fever is not a musical.
How about a “dansical”? 