# First time gun owner. The Liberal Gun Club is tiny. **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 7, 2016, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404 "2016-04-07T02:15:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![kopek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kopek/32/337_2.png) [@kopek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kopek)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/61 "2016-04-13T00:45:41Z")
> [@SeaDragonTattoo](#): > > Putting my range bag together. I don’t need to carry the cleaning kit, right? As long as it’s cleaned regularly, I should just need the bore snake for just in case, and a towel, right? Correct unless you get some funky cheap reloads or reload and do a stupid yourself. (I spent almost an hour trying to get a “primer no powder” cleared out of my S&W 25-5 without the proper tools. So I keep this little “hunter’s outfit” in the one pocket of my shooting bag in case I get stupid again.) ---
**Author:** ![SeaDragonTattoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@SeaDragonTattoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SeaDragonTattoo)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/62 "2016-04-13T00:58:08Z")
Cool. If I get a jam that doesn’t clear with tap/rack/bang, I’ll get one of the staff to take a look at it. The ranges I go to, they’re well staffed and want to help, and seem to know their stuff. I buy Winchester 115gr FMJ to use for range practice. The only other place I would be shooting would be my cousin’s farm where there is a barn full of tools. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 8:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/63 "2016-04-13T08:53:15Z")
I’d make sure you’ve got a Swiss Army Knife or a Leatherman tool as well. They’re surprisingly useful for adjusting screws that might have worked loose or helping extract stuck brass from chambers if necessary. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 10:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/64 "2016-04-13T10:00:34Z")
> [@kopek](#): > > Correct unless you get some funky cheap reloads or reload and do a stupid yourself. > > (I spent almost an hour trying to get a “primer no powder” cleared out of my S&W 25-5 without the proper tools. So I keep this little “hunter’s outfit” in the one pocket of my shooting bag in case I get stupid again.) > [@SeaDragonTattoo](#): > > Cool. If I get a jam that doesn’t clear with tap/rack/bang, I’ll get one of the staff to take a look at it. The ranges I go to, they’re well staffed and want to help, and seem to know their stuff. I buy Winchester 115gr FMJ to use for range practice. The only other place I would be shooting would be my cousin’s farm where there is a barn full of tools. I assume **kopek** means a squib load - when the bullet is shot out of the case but there isn’t enough charge to actually push it out of the muzzle. I got a bullet stuck just past my chamber (new to reloading), but I’m sure it had powder, maybe the crimp wasn’t tight enough? Anyway, I [bought this to remove squibs from rifles](http://www.amazon.com/Unpolished-Finish-Temper-0-1875-Diameter/dp/B000H9OUR8?ie=UTF8&psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage), get something shorter for pistol. That’s for any .30 cal or 7.62mm, adjust diameter as needed. > [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > I’d make sure you’ve got a Swiss Army Knife or a Leatherman tool as well. They’re surprisingly useful for adjusting screws that might have worked loose or helping extract stuck brass from chambers if necessary. I recommend a good gunsmithing screwdriver set. Less crucial for pistols than rifles, but as I like C&R, a quality screwdriver reduces the chance of stripping the heads, and that is a royal pain in the ass. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/65 "2016-04-13T12:21:56Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > I recommend a good gunsmithing screwdriver set. Less crucial for pistols than rifles, but as I like C&R, a quality screwdriver reduces the chance of stripping the heads, and that is a royal pain in the ass. Definitely worth having at home but I’m not sure it’s _de rigeuer_ for a range kit; depends on what you’re shooting perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![Orwell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/dfb087/32.png) [@Orwell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orwell)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/66 "2016-04-13T15:06:48Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > Gun ownership is a big tent. Welcome to the club where all are invited. There is no secret handshake. 🙂 I agree wholeheartedly with this sentiment, but the reality is a bit murkier. Buying, owning and shooting guns is non-political, but gun laws are not. If you are liberal, that means you probably vote for the people who insist on undermining the second amendment, and institute things like the FOID law, waiting periods, etc… And want to put heavy taxes (heavier than current) on guns and ammo. And won’t issue carry permits except to people who are politically-connected. And if you’re liberal, you might agree with some of these things, but it shouldn’t be surprising that gun owners, in general, don’t. Now, conservative issues like abortion, welfare, health insurance, etc. are completely divorced from gun laws and 2nd amendment rights, but you’ll likely have to put up with unwelcome comments on these issues. Grin and bear it, unfortunately. I have taken visitors from Spain, Germany and Austria to the gun range, and they all enjoyed it very much, even though they really couldn’t wrap their heads around the idea that I could go to a store and walk out with a gun and then keep it in my house. They were impressed, yet shocked at the same time. They were not, however, indignant or terrified or outraged like many anti-gun Americans. As for the NRA, frankly I don’t understand the liberal hate for the organization. The NRA is focused on gun safety, marksmanship and gun rights. They stick up for gun owners, and don’t get involved in non-firearm politics. I belong to the NRA, as well as GOA (Gun Owners of America) and SAF (Second Amendment Foundation). I’ve never seen any of these groups get involved in non-gun lobbying. I want these groups to support my gun rights and fight anti-gun laws, which is why I send them money every year. If that means they oppose democratic candidates, it is because of the candidates’ views on gun laws, nothing else. There are some democrats who support gun laws, though they seem to be disappearing, unfortunately. ---
**Author:** ![lost4life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@lost4life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lost4life)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/67 "2016-04-13T16:49:46Z")
I finally understand Poe’s law. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/68 "2016-04-13T17:58:02Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > I’d make sure you’ve got a Swiss Army Knife or a Leatherman tool as well. They’re surprisingly useful for adjusting screws that might have worked loose or helping extract stuck brass from chambers if necessary. Isn’t this the general rule for always, every day? The only exceptions are on airlines and in public buildings like when serving on jury duty, where there’s a metal detector at the entrance. In those cases, there’s the Swiss Utili-Key: [swiss utili key - Google Search](https://www.google.com/search?q=swiss+utili+key&client=safari&hl=en-us&prmd=sivn&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiutNb-l4zMAhUUS2MKHYwRDcoQ_AUICCgC&biw=1024&bih=672). ---
**Author:** ![BeeGee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b5a626/32.png) [@BeeGee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeeGee)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/69 "2016-04-13T18:03:11Z")
Moderate Democrat in Texas (social liberal, fiscal conservative, work is DOD related) with a .38 S&W. My dad is a dealer and was a CHL instructor. He’s not happy that I won’t get my concealed license, but I don’t go anywhere where I could carry. Furthermore, I don’t WANT to carry my gun around. The only reason you should see my gun is if we’re going to the range or if I’m about to kill you. And I’d really rather not. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/70 "2016-04-13T18:04:55Z")
> [@Orwell](#): > > As for the NRA, frankly I don’t understand the liberal hate for the organization. The NRA is focused on gun safety, marksmanship and gun rights. They stick up for gun owners, and don’t get involved in non-firearm politics. I belong to the NRA, as well as GOA (Gun Owners of America) and SAF (Second Amendment Foundation). I’ve never seen any of these groups get involved in non-gun lobbying. I want these groups to support my gun rights and fight anti-gun laws, which is why I send them money every year. If that means they oppose democratic candidates, it is because of the candidates’ views on gun laws, nothing else. There are some democrats who support gun laws, though they seem to be disappearing, unfortunately. my problem with the NRA is twofold: 1. they can’t keep Wayne LaPierre from shooting his mouth off and making us all look like nutjobs. The NRA’s “official response” after Sandy Hook was disgusting. 2. they stepped outside of their stated goals by throwing Harry Reid (usually solidly-pro-2A) under the bus for reasons not having to do with gun rights. ---
**Author:** ![River\_Hippie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/river_hippie/32/26_2.png) [@River\_Hippie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/River_Hippie)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/71 "2016-04-13T18:15:35Z")
> [@Orwell](#): > > … > As for the NRA, frankly I don’t understand the liberal hate for the organization. The NRA is focused on gun safety, marksmanship and gun rights. They stick up for gun owners, and don’t get involved in non-firearm politics. I belong to the NRA, as well as GOA (Gun Owners of America) and SAF (Second Amendment Foundation). I’ve never seen any of these groups get involved in non-gun lobbying. I want these groups to support my gun rights and fight anti-gun laws, which is why I send them money every year. If that means they oppose democratic candidates, it is because of the candidates’ views on gun laws, nothing else. There are some democrats who support gun laws, though they seem to be disappearing, unfortunately. I see the NRA as a lobbying group for the gun manufacturers. They full on oppose anything they think could negatively effect gun sales. Yes, they have the safety and marksmanship programs but that’s not their main focus as far as I can see. I was a member for years but haven’t been in a very long time. ---
**Author:** ![Orwell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/dfb087/32.png) [@Orwell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orwell)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/72 "2016-04-13T18:37:37Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > my problem with the NRA is twofold: > > 1. they can’t keep Wayne LaPierre from shooting his mouth off and making us all look like nutjobs. The NRA’s “official response” after Sandy Hook was disgusting. > > 2. they stepped outside of their stated goals by throwing Harry Reid (usually solidly-pro-2A) under the bus for reasons not having to do with gun rights. I can agree somewhat with #1. For such a prominent lobbying organization, LaPierre can be terribly tone-deaf and abrasive. Not that I necessarily disagree with many of his positions, but he lacks finesse and tact. The Sandy Hook situation is a good example. I don’t disagree with LaPierre’s stance, but the NRA needs a better spokesperson. But my real problem with the Sandy Hook aftermath was how the NRA was painted into a corner by the media, as if they were responsible for the murders. It would be like demanding a response/apology from AAA when a drunk driver kills someone. As for #2, I’m not sure I follow. I thought the NRA endorsed a replacement candidate who was more pro-gun than Reid. What is the reason you are implying? (I didn’t pay that much attention to this, other than knowing that Reid introduced some anti-gun legislation, but I’m not sure on the timing.) ---
**Author:** ![Orwell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/dfb087/32.png) [@Orwell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orwell)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/73 "2016-04-13T18:41:32Z")
> [@River\_Hippie](#): > > I see the NRA as a lobbying group for the gun manufacturers. They full on oppose anything they think could negatively effect gun sales. Yes, they have the safety and marksmanship programs but that’s not their main focus as far as I can see. > I was a member for years but haven’t been in a very long time. I hear that complaint, but would appreciate some follow-up. How do they lobby for gun manufacturers? And why is that a problem, if manufacturers are part of their natural support group? I get all of the normal mailings and emails from the NRA, and I don’t recall much huckstering or marketing for manufacturers. I do see certain manufacturers, like Ruger and Taurus, helping customers join the NRA. To me, the NRA opposes infringements on buying, owning, carrying and using guns, which seems appropriate for their members. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/74 "2016-04-13T21:14:48Z")
I live in Alabama and lean left, as do most of my friends. I own guns and so do they. Partly it’s the culture we grew up in, partly it’s because we live in a place that’s armed to the teeth. I will say that we are all very responsible gun owners (i.e. use all safety precautions when we take them out to fire them, keep them away from kids [where applicable], don’t carry them unless there’s a good reason [e.g. going into an area where rattlesnakes or AmWay salesman are a possibility], etc.). ---
**Author:** ![River\_Hippie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/river_hippie/32/26_2.png) [@River\_Hippie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/River_Hippie)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/75 "2016-04-13T21:41:43Z")
> [@Orwell](#): > > I hear that complaint, but would appreciate some follow-up. How do they lobby for gun manufacturers? And why is that a problem, if manufacturers are part of their natural support group? I get all of the normal mailings and emails from the NRA, and I don’t recall much huckstering or marketing for manufacturers. I do see certain manufacturers, like Ruger and Taurus, helping customers join the NRA. > > To me, the NRA opposes infringements on buying, owning, carrying and using guns, which seems appropriate for their members. [Here’s the first thing I read after a quick Google search.](http://www.businessinsider.com/gun-industry-funds-nra-2013-1) [Her’s another.](http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/12/whom-does-the-nra-really-speak-for/266373/) One key takeaway (for me) is that some manufacturers give a portion of the money made on each gun they sell directly to the NRA. More guns sold=more money to the NRA. This would explain why the NRA fights against things [most gun owners support.](http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/01/28/strong-majority-of-americans-nra-members-back-gun-control) [Have you watched this? The Politics and Power of the NRA. Recommended.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cjy3uopvhpc&list=PL_pPc6-qR9ZwRVd7_JO2k2mP3tPCs9Cxj) ---
**Author:** ![River\_Hippie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/river_hippie/32/26_2.png) [@River\_Hippie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/River_Hippie)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/76 "2016-04-13T21:49:57Z")
[Another link to the Frontline documentary.](http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/film/gunned-down/) ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/77 "2016-04-13T22:01:32Z")
> [@Orwell](#): > > As for the NRA, frankly I don’t understand the liberal hate for the organization. The NRA is focused on gun safety, marksmanship and gun rights. They stick up for gun owners, and don’t get involved in non-firearm politics. I belong to the NRA, as well as GOA (Gun Owners of America) and SAF (Second Amendment Foundation). I’ve never seen any of these groups get involved in non-gun lobbying. I want these groups to support my gun rights and fight anti-gun laws, which is why I send them money every year. If that means they oppose democratic candidates, it is because of the candidates’ views on gun laws, nothing else. There are some democrats who support gun laws, though they seem to be disappearing, unfortunately. NRA has 3 parts: NRA proper, who advocate safety, and the NRA-ILA, and NRA-PVF, who do the political stuff. > [@Orwell](#): > > As for #2, I’m not sure I follow. I thought the NRA endorsed a replacement candidate who was more pro-gun than Reid. What is the reason you are implying? (I didn’t pay that much attention to this, other than knowing that Reid introduced some anti-gun legislation, but I’m not sure on the timing.) Reid lost the nomination because he started to change his tune. They endorsed Sue Lowden, who lost the primary. They didn’t endorse the eventual winner, Sharron Angle, which is all the best because she’s a fucking nutjob. She did get a better letter grade though (A vs B). I also imagine that they were looking long term and if Angle had won the election she probably wouldn’t have seen a second term because she makes Ann Coulter look reasonable. LaPierre sure is ineffective at making a point sometimes. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2016, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/78 "2016-04-14T08:34:04Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > Isn’t this the general rule for always, every day? The only exceptions are on airlines and in public buildings like when serving on jury duty, where there’s a metal detector at the entrance. In those cases, there’s the Swiss Utili-Key: [swiss utili key - Google Search](https://www.google.com/search?q=swiss+utili+key&client=safari&hl=en-us&prmd=sivn&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiutNb-l4zMAhUUS2MKHYwRDcoQ_AUICCgC&biw=1024&bih=672). Depends where you live. In some places there are laws against carrying knives (sometimes even Swiss Army Knives) around for the sheer hell of it, and even if you are allowed to carry an SAK, it can depend what type. The “normal” type probably isn’t a problem; but the serrated blade edges on some versions might be problematic if someone is looking for a reason to make it so. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2016, 9:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/79 "2016-04-14T09:12:44Z")
> [@Orwell](#): > > I have taken visitors from Spain, Germany and Austria to the gun range, and they all enjoyed it very much, even though they really couldn’t wrap their heads around the idea that I could go to a store and walk out with a gun and then keep it in my house. Shrug, in Spain you can do all that once you’ve had a medical exam (identical to the driver’s license exam, and very often taken concurrently; if you already have one of either type of license you don’t need the medical for the other one), passed the appropriate gun handling course and obtained your license. It takes longer for the license to be printed than for the rest. Now, apparently those SEPRONA cops love taking the weapons of people found to be carrying one without a license, but hey, it’s actually in their job description! You have several months to present the license and get the weapons back before they’re sold at auction. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2016, 10:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404/80 "2016-04-14T10:47:27Z")
> [@Ranger\_Jeff](#): > > Here’s a tip your coach might not think to tell you. I’d recommend you avoid low cut or very unbuttoned tops while shooting. I’ve seen some women shooters catch an expended hot casing between their breasts. Not on purpose. I don’t know if the shrieks are more from surprise than pain or not, but it’s a situation easily avoided. Not currently a gun owner, but this comment reminded me of [this Straight Dope column](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/3106/if-i-fired-a-pistol-and-then-stuck-it-in-my-waistband-like-on-tv-wouldn-t-i-get-burned) on the advisability (or not) of putting freshly-fired guns in your waistband. As tested by our own **Una Persson** and **fierra**. Worth a read (I won’t spoil the amusing side effects of tucking a .44 into one’s pants). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/first-time-gun-owner-the-liberal-gun-club-is-tiny/751404.md?page=5)