# Flag at half mast used to mean something **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 15, 2011, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833 "2011-03-15T20:59:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2011, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/41 "2011-03-18T01:26:14Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > Common usage always trumps the dictionary. You don’t mean that. Think about it–that would mean the loss of countless useful words. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2011, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/42 "2011-03-18T08:30:05Z")
> [@spark240](#): > > You don’t mean that. Think about it–that would mean the loss of countless useful words. No, it wouldn’t. If they are useful, they are currently being used. The problem though is that dictionaries are descriptions of what words are in common use. Some contain obsolete words, but a good dictionary will label them as such. What he’s really arguing is that the dictionary is out of date. Real prescriptivists don’t take any dictionary as gospel. ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2011, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/43 "2011-03-18T15:39:45Z")
> [@j66](#): > > Back to appropriate management of the U.S. flag: > > Does anyone know how one person is supposed to take down and fold a flag? I know how! ---
**Author:** ![Misnomer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/misnomer/32/14897_2.png) [@Misnomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Misnomer)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2011, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/44 "2011-03-18T18:25:54Z")
> [@Spavined\_Gelding](#): > > For the last time you bunch of freaking illiterates: the flag is a HALF-STAFF. It is only at half-mast if there is a mast, like on a boat. No one used the term “half mast” between the post where **ascenray** pointed this out and your post. How about instead of getting all worked up over a “bunch of freaking illiterates” you work on your reading comprehension skills? ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2011, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/45 "2011-03-18T22:08:25Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > If they are useful, they are currently being used. What if they are widely misused as synonyms for other words that previously had different meanings? When the distinction is lost, the utility is lost, even if people continue to make the sounds with their mouths. That’s as far as I’ll take this here. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/46 "2011-03-19T00:28:44Z")
> [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > I know how! Wow, that’s great! Very impressive. I’m so proud of and happy for you. \*… tap … … tap tap tap … … TAP … … TAP TAP …\* **Well?** Are you going to tell me? ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/47 "2011-03-19T01:01:45Z")
The flag above Buckingham Palace is only flown at half-mast/staff/IDon’tCare when the reigning monarch dies. Which is why it didn’t occur to Queen Liz to lower the flag when her ex-daughter-in-law died, but the Dianamania at the time forced her to concede. ---
**Author:** ![Spavined\_Gelding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@Spavined\_Gelding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spavined_Gelding)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/48 "2011-03-19T03:59:06Z")
> [@Misnomer](#): > > No one used the term “half mast” between the post where **ascenray** pointed this out and your post. How about instead of getting all worked up over a “bunch of freaking illiterates” you work on your reading comprehension skills? How about you get a life, Sport? ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/49 "2011-03-19T04:10:49Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Real prescriptivists don’t take any dictionary as gospel. Your ‘real prescriptivists’ sound like descriptivists to me. > [@spark240](#): > > What if they are widely misused as synonyms for other words that previously had different meanings? When the distinction is lost, the utility is lost, even if people continue to make the sounds with their mouths. If it was that important to maintain the differentiation between concepts, the distinct words would survive. For example, in English ‘blue’ and ‘green’ are not in any danger of becoming synonyms, regardless of the Sinitic influences that brought us idioms like ‘long time no see’: Our culture regards them as distinct, and regards the distinction as important, so the words remain separate. Contrast this ‘half-staff’/‘half-mast’ nonsense, which is only relevant to a small number of people who exert very little influence on the language. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 9:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/50 "2011-03-19T09:18:07Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > Hijack – one of the worst examples is “supermodel.” There used to be plenty of models, and only the uber ones whose names became household words and who eventually got to call the shots in their own careers or run media and fashion empires were called supermodels to distinguish them from the rest. > > now every single time a model’s career is mentioned, somebody or everybody calls her a supermodel, even when it turns out it’s some 17-year-old foreign chick who’s a complete unknown and was hired a month ago, and no one offstage has ever heard her speak. > > Supermodel isn’t a profession any more than “all-star” is or “Ph. D.” is. It’s a superlative form of the word model. Or for that matter, “hero.” Not everyone who risks their life is a hero - most of the time, they’re just doing their duty. Rule of thumb: if the other soldiers (or cops, or firefighters) serving with you think you’re a hero, \*then \*you’re a hero.. ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/51 "2011-03-19T13:55:38Z")
Everyone please cool it re: half-staff or half-mast. It’s been beaten to death and everyone’s prickly over it. We need not discuss it any more, nor do we need to snipe about it. **Ellen Cherry IMHO Moderator** ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/52 "2011-03-19T14:41:07Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > A similar example: “porn star.” > [@](#): > > Appearing in over 2000 adult films during the past two decades, Cynthia was last night recognized for her body of work by the Adult Film Actors Guild. No longer just a porn actress, she can now proudly claim the title of porn star. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Snnipe\_70E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5a626/32.png) [@Snnipe\_70E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snnipe_70E)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/53 "2011-03-19T15:29:14Z")
> [@Ellen\_Cherry](#): > > Everyone please cool it re: half-staff or half-mast. It’s been beaten to death and everyone’s prickly over it. We need not discuss it any more, nor do we need to **snipe** about it. > > **Ellen Cherry > IMHO Moderator** Hey! Snipe is not a bad word ---
**Author:** ![chacoguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/50afbb/32.png) [@chacoguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chacoguy)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/54 "2011-03-19T17:22:33Z")
> [@j66](#): > > Are you going to tell me? You rest it on your shoulder as you fold it into that classic, triangular shape. ---
**Author:** ![Susanann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7ab992/32.png) [@Susanann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Susanann)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/55 "2011-03-19T19:39:55Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > When I was a child if I saw a flag at half mast my first question was, “which ex president died?” > Now I just wonder who’s cat has the sniffles. > I suspect it’s some tribute to the soldiers losing their lives in Afghanistan and Iraq, but when did this great honor get watered down so much? Yeah, I remember WW2 when our boys were dying somewhere every day of that war, yet we generally let all of our flags fly high unless there was a very “unusual” or out-of-the-ordinary death that needed special recognition. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/56 "2011-03-19T19:42:31Z")
> [@Susanann](#): > > Yeah, I remember WW2 when our boys were dying somewhere every day of that war, yet we generally let all of our flags fly high unless there was a very “unusual” or out-of-the-ordinary death that needed special recognition. Sensible. Like, say, the last remaining veteran of one of our great wars. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/57 "2011-03-19T19:44:10Z")
> [@chacoguy](#): > > You rest it on your shoulder as you fold it into that classic, triangular shape. Oh. I think I can see that. But how does one person fold it in quarters length-wise? Do you cheat and fold it in half first so it doesn’t drag on the ground? ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/58 "2011-03-19T19:58:36Z")
> [@Susanann](#): > > Yeah, I remember WW2 when our boys were dying somewhere every day of that war, yet we generally let all of our flags fly high unless there was a very “unusual” or out-of-the-ordinary death that needed special recognition. That **was** a very out-of-the-ordinary death, though, as pointed out. That day and flag-lowering honored the passing of the last WWI vet of the US. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2011, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/59 "2011-03-20T02:06:04Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Or for that matter, “hero.” Not everyone who risks their life is a hero - most of the time, they’re just doing their duty. Rule of thumb: if the other soldiers (or cops, or firefighters) serving with you think you’re a hero, \*then \*you’re a hero.. Oh yeah, that’s another good one - I like Stephen Colbert’s lampooning of the way everyone who gets their taxes done on time is a hero these days. ---
**Author:** ![TexasDriver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f04885/32.png) [@TexasDriver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TexasDriver)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2011, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833/60 "2011-03-20T04:33:31Z")
> [@fubbleskag](#): > > Oh for christ’s sake, enough with this pedantry already. > > [Half-mast - definition of half-mast by The Free Dictionary](http://www.thefreedictionary.com/half-mast) > > [http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/half-mast](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/half-mast) > > [http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/half-mast](http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/half-mast) So “half-pole” would be correct, too. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-at-half-mast-used-to-mean-something/574833.md?page=4)