# Flag Burning post- 9/11? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 10, 2002, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812 "2002-04-10T11:22:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/121 "2002-04-12T19:58:47Z")
Curb stompings, body piercings, ad hominem arguments, Cynthia McKinney, presidential elections… This thread has had more highjacks than Turkish Airways. ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/122 "2002-04-12T20:09:37Z")
**gobear** , I’m not comparing you to posters like **JDM**. Frankly, I _expect_ to see hysterics from some posters. (BTW, **JDM** , have you considered taking 10 deep breaths before posting?) It’s the well-spoken and generally considerate, well respected posters who begin to worry me when they start foaming… ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/123 "2002-04-12T20:12:15Z")
**Xenophon** , do you not see that flagburning is, is in essence, saying “Fuck AmeriKKA” unless it is placed in context as **Rjung** suggested? It is an act performed only by leftist radicals. I dare you to find Republicans burning flags during the Clinton scandal or during the Florida vote-count. (although a lot of them acted like thugs) I dare you to find moderate Democrats who burn flags. It is an act performed only by people with extreme political views. You see flagburning as an innocuous form of protest; I do not. We approach this from very different points of view. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/124 "2002-04-12T20:16:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Beeblebrox \* > \*\*Curb stompings, body piercings, ad hominem arguments, Cynthia McKinney, presidential elections… This thread has had more highjacks than Turkish Airways. \*\* Yeah, and here comes another one: [start hijack] > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by xenophon41_ > Oh, and that’s xenophon 41, EM2 (SS), Navy nuke and ‘Cold Warrior’, 1976-1982. Really? What boat? I’m guessing COMSUBPAC if you never made it to Arlington. [/end hijack] ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/125 "2002-04-12T20:31:30Z")
> [@](#): > > It is an act performed only by leftist radicals. OK. You’ve driven me to it: :rolleyes: If there were a “beating head against wall” smilie, I’d use it. You can have the debate back now; I’ve knocked enough bricks loose to’ve retained my dignity, I s’pose. However, on my way out----- [hijack continuation] **kaylasdad99** : Casimir Pulaski SSBN 633. (Gold crew, until we consolidated and went to drydock in Newport News, summer of '80.) New London, Holy Loch, Kings Bay, and… no trips to Arlington.[/hijack] ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/126 "2002-04-12T20:36:51Z")
> [@](#): > > OK. You’ve driven me to it: > > :rolleyes: > > If there were a “beating head against wall” smilie, I’d use it. You can have the debate back now; I’ve knocked enough bricks loose to’ve retained my dignity, I s’pose. We’ll have to agree to disagree. All you need do is show me that flagburning is a common, everyday form of protest that is not limited to one narrow segment of the political spectrum. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/127 "2002-04-12T21:32:33Z")
First, a note: it is the unanimous decision of the Central Committee that the Garrison joke posted by **gobear** is worthy of an amnesty. Hence, his name is removed from the list of First to the Wall Come the Revolution. This becomes official as soon as Comrade **Stoid** signs off. to the matter at hand: no flag is sacred. All this crap about men dying for it is just that: crap. Military mush like we havent seen since John Wayne made _The Green Berets_. German soldiers “died for their flag”, did the swastika suddenly become sanctified? A thousand years will not remove the evil from that symbol, regardless of who died for it. Nationalism is a pathology of humankind, flags are a symptom, like pustules on a pox victim. My love for America is not based on geography, America is not that chunk of dirt between the oceans. It is the dream of the Revolution that I hold dear. Liberty, justice, equality, the Work in Progress that is our heritage and our duty. If you can’t contain all that in a single human heart, how then in a piece of cotton manufactured in China? ---
**Author:** ![David\_Simmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de053/32.png) [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2002, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/128 "2002-04-13T06:36:35Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by elucidator \* > \*\* > to the matter at hand: no flag is sacred. All this crap about men dying for it is just that: crap. Military mush like we havent seen since John Wayne made The Green Berets_\* Couldn’t agree more. I spent from early Novermber 1944 to the end of the war in Europe in the ETO. I never once heard any person say that they were going to take one for the good old Stars and Stripes. In fact, until the war was over and we moved on to occupation duty in Germany I never even saw a US flag. I suppose there was one up at Group Headquarters, maybe, but out in the squadron areas we managed to carry on the war without one. The claptrap that I hear about the “sanctity of the flag” makes me realize how shrewed the ancient Hebrew sages were to outlaw graven images. Allowing them soon leads to the image becoming more revered than the ideas that it represents. ---
**Author:** ![Toaster52](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/50afbb/32.png) [@Toaster52](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toaster52)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2002, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/129 "2002-04-15T20:54:08Z")
**JDM** _On the other hand, back in December of 2000 Antonin Scalia and his cohort not only wiped their asses on another symbol of our country: the United States Constitution, but they also had the power to turn their hatred of democracy, of the Liberty of the People, of the very idea that the United States of America was founded upon- that the government should only govern with the consent of the governed- into the mockery that is the Bush “presidency.” Some skinny hippy’s torching of a piece of cloth vanishes next to that obscenity. JDM_ look here: [http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/florida.ballots/stories/main.html](http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/florida.ballots/stories/main.html) Please…get over it…Bush won. I’m sorry for you that you want to deny this, but in recount after recount after recount, BUSH WON. In study after study after study, BUSH WON!! And please…don’t insult my intelligence with: “But Gore had more popular votes!” That’s true; and nobody denies this. However, understand this: \*\*That is totally irrelevant!\*\*The Presidency is elected by _Electoral votes_. Both Bush and Gore knew this going into the election. We could try to say Bush is President because he won more states, but we would be wrong (even though he did). We could try to say Bush is President because he won more counties, but we would be wrong (even though he did). The ONLY counting criteria involved is electoral votes, and THAT voting made Bush President. And pre-emptive strike: the Supreme Court would have not gotten involved if the Democrats had not tried to steal the election by changing the rules of counting AFTER POLLS HAD CLOSED!!! The only thing the Supreme Court did was to certify that Florida’s methods of counting were constitutional and that the Democrats attempt to change the methods after the fact were unconstitutional. …end hijack…and waits for the flaming to begin… ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/130 "2002-04-16T19:08:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > I dare you to find Republicans burning flags during the Clinton scandal Nah, Republicans prefer more treasonous acts, like making public death threats against the President (Helms to Clinton, remember?), or blowing up Federal office buildings (Tim McVeigh, clearly a non-liberal). ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/131 "2002-04-16T19:35:56Z")
And with that, “Tim McVeigh is a Republican,” this debate has formally degenerated beyond all hope of redemption… ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2002, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/132 "2002-04-16T20:05:33Z")
So much for arguing points and not attacking people. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812/133 "2002-04-17T20:48:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by furt \* > “Tim McVeigh is a Republican” Who said that? Remember, kids, “non-liberal” != “conservative”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flag-burning-post-9-11/102812.md?page=6)