# Flamsterette, you crossed the line. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 24, 2003, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647 "2003-09-24T22:42:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/141 "2003-09-25T03:38:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by cmosdes \* > \*\ ***Q.E.D** > > Who the fuck are you to judge an apology to two other people??? You aren’t involved, and you weren’t the one transgressed. **Flam** made a public mistake and apologized, publicly, to the two people she offended. > > Talk about “mob mentality” and pile on. Wow. Does she need to apologize until _everyone_ thinks the apology is good enough? \*\* That was hardly a personal apology. If I had been one of the offended parties, no, that would not have been good enough for me. I have every right to express my opinion that **Flammy** ’s apolology sounded insincere. I did _not_ say she didn’t mean it. I have no doubt she did. But to my ears it came off as impersonal and insincere. I stand by my remarks. ---
**Author:** ![ResIpsaLoquitor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b3f665/32.png) [@ResIpsaLoquitor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ResIpsaLoquitor)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/142 "2003-09-25T03:38:50Z")
There’s a Hans Moleman quote popping in my head: “We paid for blood!!!” No, seriously: what do you people want? Would you prefer a millstone thrown around Flami’s neck and watch her be forced to swim the Atlantic Ocean? Or can she apologize (and mean it), and get the hell on with her life? If I can spout some principles of justice here: when a wrong is committed, something is owed. If somebody does $100 worth of damage to your car, they owe you $100. If you murder someone, you usually (although rarely in practice), you get life in prison, or worse, you give your life up to the state. However, justice doesn’t go further than that: we maintain the dignity of the human person by keeping the penalty fair. We execute prisoners; we don’t put them in a pit with a lion for public entertainment. I don’t know what’s the just repayment for publicly insulting someone or asking a stupid question about someone with MS. I’d think an apology and a commitment to not doing it again is **enough** , particularly if that’s all the person is capable of giving. Why demand more? Why cry for blood? Do you want a public flogging? Do you want a burning at the stake? I exaggerate. But I reiterate: I’m still scared. She tried to make amends, and it still isn’t enough. (Oh, and kudos to those of you who took her apology and are willing to move on.) ---
**Author:** ![Berkut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a88e57/32.png) [@Berkut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Berkut)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/143 "2003-09-25T03:42:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zette \* > **Her apology wasn’t posted when I was composting my post.** Interesting typo. ---
**Author:** ![lel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8797f3/32.png) [@lel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lel)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/144 "2003-09-25T03:46:35Z")
Thanks, **Flam**. May you continue in humility with those who have been wronged, and may you, and everyone, learn from all this. ---
**Author:** ![Tiburon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e36b37/32.png) [@Tiburon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tiburon)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/145 "2003-09-25T03:48:39Z")
I don’t need a personal apology. It took guts to come here. Hell, if John’s okay, then I’m okay. And if Flam learns something from this - then that’s even better. And to those of you who jumped to my defense - thank you. I’m very blessed and lucky to have such kind friends. And thank you to BBJ for the nice compliment. Let’s all go outside and play now! ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/146 "2003-09-25T03:48:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Happy Lendervedder \* > **This after she offers an apology?** Eh. I’ve seen better. For someone who likes to run her mouth as much as she does, it was awfully short. And frankly, there are some times when “I’m sorry” just doesn’t cut it. Although if this John guy is who I think he is, I’m pretty sure he disagrees with me. If I’m right, I hope **Flamsterette** realizes how very, very lucky she is to have a friend like that. ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/147 "2003-09-25T03:49:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zette \* > **Hey Happy- STFU.** But… but there’s a moral highground to take! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![galen\_ubal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galen_ubal/32/4440_2.png) [@galen\_ubal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galen_ubal)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/148 "2003-09-25T03:56:04Z")
Christ, this has got to be the most disgusting pile-on thread I’ve ever seen - and some of you vultures still aren’t satisfied? Get over it - the people involved have settled it. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/149 "2003-09-25T03:58:47Z")
Holy. Living. Fuck. I realize I’m coming into the ass-end of this thread but Jesus H. Christ that was a fucked up thing for Flami to do. I’ve said and done some pretty stupid shit on these boards --and there are -ahem- people here that can attest to that…-- but congratu-fucking-lations flamster! You win the gold medal for being the first poster to _physically disgust_ me. General apology not accepted from me. Maybe the two people you hurt will be more receptive to your specific apologies. ---
**Author:** ![Ashkicker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@Ashkicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ashkicker)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/150 "2003-09-25T04:00:52Z")
Good for you **Flam** , for having the guts to come in and say sorry. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/151 "2003-09-25T04:01:12Z")
Well, Flammy old kid, old sock, I think the upside here is that you are unlikely to have a similar problem next year, and _nobody_ is likely to waste 37 perfectly good cents, plus the cost of the card itself, on such a whiney, self centered, ungrateful waste of human skin. So, you got that going for ya. ---
**Author:** ![ZiggyB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b487fb/32.png) [@ZiggyB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZiggyB)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/152 "2003-09-25T04:01:54Z")
MHO: Concerning the issue of wanting to see your name written in a birthday card - never heard of it and complaining about it is just baffling. How is person X supposed to even know you want your name written in the birthday card? It verges on ridiculous. Concerning the responses in this thread: Some of them are so over the top that they go beyond ridiculous to obnoxious if not despicable. “I am shaking with the desire to punch you?” “I am writing myself a note to remember to hate you?” “You are a waste of skin?” Not even a :rolleyes: can express the sheer overreaction. Get a life people! Concerning the “degenerate” comment - if that’s because Tiburon is gay then it’s a hateful comment. But I don’t understand why everyone is saying “that came out of the blue.” In the post immediately before that Tiburon called Flamsterette\_X a bitch. ---
**Author:** ![Hamadryad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6de8d8/32.png) [@Hamadryad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamadryad)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/153 "2003-09-25T04:03:17Z")
I don’t buy it, but it’s not being sold to me, so who gives a shit? Those for whom the apology was intended…good for you. You’re far better people than I am. Had it been intended for me I’d’ve called it weak; fortunately, it wasn’t. Those for whom the apology was not intended but who accepted it anyhow…well, good for y’all, too, I guess…😕 Those of you who didn’t accept the apology (a group including myself)…was it to you? No? Then you don’t have to. The OP of the IMHO thread was a perfect example of what happens when you don’t follow the rule of “Think Twice: Post Once.” I also think some people should go that extra mile. Think Five Times…Go Do Something Else For An Hour…Think Five More Times…THEN Post, If You _Really_ Still Think It’s A Good Idea. Cheers, and let’s be careful out there. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/154 "2003-09-25T04:10:01Z")
> [@](#): > > It was the wolf manner of fighting, to strike and leap away; but > there was more to it than this. Thirty or forty huskies ran to > the spot and surrounded the combatants in an intent and silent > circle. Buck did not comprehend that silent intentness, nor the > eager way with which they were licking their chops. Curly rushed > her antagonist, who struck again and leaped aside. He met her > next rush with his chest, in a peculiar fashion that tumbled her > off her feet. She never regained them, This was what the > onlooking huskies had waited for. They closed in upon her, > snarling and yelping, and she was buried, screaming with agony, > beneath the bristling mass of bodies. Jack London, _The Call Of The Wild_ ---
**Author:** ![Tiburon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e36b37/32.png) [@Tiburon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tiburon)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/155 "2003-09-25T04:10:14Z")
Time to wrap this up, Mods? Finish your drinks everyone! Bar is closing. ---
**Author:** ![Glory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/7cd45c/32.png) [@Glory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Glory)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/156 "2003-09-25T04:10:45Z")
No, I don’t think that apology should be sufficient. I viewed the “degenerate” comment as bigoted, anti-gay hate speech. What if the comment had been: “Not that I care bouta spic’s (or jew’s or black person’s) opinion, anyhow…” I think Tiburon is a good person to have accepted that apology at face value and I will remember Flamsterette\_X is a bigot in the future (a self-centered bigot). ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/157 "2003-09-25T04:11:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Hamadryad \* > **Those of you who didn’t accept the apology (a group including myself)…was it to you? No? Then you don’t have to.** Exactly. Look, if the offended parties want to accept **Flamsterette** ’s apologiy, that’s all well and good with me. All I was saying was that it sounded rather insincere to me. Where were all her “defenders” _before_ she apologized? Not here, that’s for sure. But as soon as anyone dares to question the sincerity of her apology, the “defenders” are all over. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![techchick68](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ea5d25/32.png) [@techchick68](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/techchick68)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/158 "2003-09-25T04:13:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ZiggyB \* > Concerning the responses in this thread: Some of them are so over the top that they go beyond ridiculous to obnoxious if not despicable. **“I am shaking with the desire to punch you?”** “I am writing myself a note to remember to hate you?” “You are a waste of skin?” Not even a :rolleyes: can express the sheer overreaction. Get a life people! Bolding mine of course…Yeah, I said that. The card sender is a friend of mine and how dare she be so ungrateful about this. Granted I could be a better friend to the card sender myself but the second I figured out who she was talking about I did wanna punch her because she was acting like a two year old. I mean really, I will stick up for my friends if I see unfairness and in this case a lack of brains and a lack of gratitude for the simple idea that he took time out of his day to send her a birthday card. Including a name should be the last damn thing on anyone’s mind. BTW, I did post what I thought she could have said to make this not such an explosive issue. I roll my eyes at those that can’t see her serious error. Yes, we all do bone-headed things, I am one of the first to admit it but geez that was a really screwed up post she did. She apologized for it, fine. I am sure some people can accept that, I am in the department that it’s weak. However, I am not going to worry about it because it doesn’t affect me. BUT, I will remain on the side of my friends when they do something kind-hearted and shit like that comes out of one’s thoughts for all to see. That kind of shit is hard to forget. ---
**Author:** ![galen\_ubal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galen_ubal/32/4440_2.png) [@galen\_ubal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galen_ubal)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/159 "2003-09-25T04:16:27Z")
Me, I was at work. And it’s not so much defending **F\_X** , **Q.E.D.** , but attacking the feeding frenzy going on here. What’s wrong with you people? ---
**Author:** ![Berkut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a88e57/32.png) [@Berkut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Berkut)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647/160 "2003-09-25T04:17:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Q.E.D. \* > **If I had been one of the offended parties** You weren’t. Do you see the significance? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flamsterette-you-crossed-the-line/203647.md?page=9)