# Flash: new TV show (boxed spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 9, 2014, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818 "2014-10-09T01:14:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/141 "2014-11-03T00:21:30Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > Hal Jordan is the #1 Green Lantern of Sector 2814. Why is there an argument? > [@foolsguinea](#): > > Did you forget the 1990’s or are you trolling? If by “Did you forget the 1990s” you mean "Did you not watch John Stewart in the TV cartoons, then yes. I also missed the bulk of Kyle Raynor’s run in the comics during the 1990s. I stopped collecting in 1991 or so, for financial reasons, and then picked it up again circa 2004. I got into GL in the late 1980s, just as Hal Jordan was coming back from a hiatus of some sort. Then when I came back in '04, he was making another comeback from the whole Parallax thing (which, yes, I missed, but I picked up enough backstory to fill me in). There’s a reason Hal keeps coming back: He’s the iconic GL. I’m a huge Guy Gardner fan, and I think John Stewart is a great, fascinating character with a lot of depth. And, as I indicated, I don’t know a whole lot about Kyle Raynor, beyond the fact that he’s apparently the source of the “girlfriend in a refrigerator” meme. But yes, Jordan is #1. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/142 "2014-11-03T00:27:50Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > I’m a huge Guy Gardner fan, and I think John Stewart is a great, fascinating character with a lot of depth. And, as I indicated, I don’t know a whole lot about Kyle Raynor, beyond the fact that he’s apparently the source of the “girlfriend in a refrigerator” meme. Alan Scott is the source of the “Green Lantern” meme. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/143 "2014-11-03T00:36:10Z")
It’s funny how many people quit collecting comics around '91. That was around the time I gave it up too. I was also a Marvel guy, so all the easter eggs in this show are whizzing right past me. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/144 "2014-11-03T01:11:42Z")
Oyyyy…OK, not to hijack, but Hal Jordan is hated by some fans because at some point his arrogance and insubordination hit the point that he flipped out, rebelled against the Guardians, and _killed off a huge chunk of the Green Lantern Corps._ It was a dumb story idea, but he was a villain for years. And in trying to retcon and undo that mess (understandable) writers reinstated the meme that Hal Jordan was pretty much the greatest GL ever, which is really a version of the problem meme (Hal is better than everyone, entire worlds are just disposable supporting players in Hal’s universe) that got us into the mess. So excuse me for liking practically anyone who was a GL better than Hal. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/145 "2014-11-03T01:16:00Z")
And this is why GL fans are so at each other’s throats and have been for years. Do you see John Stewart fans and Kyle Rayner fans screaming at each other? It’s Hal stans, understandably miffed that he got villainized, then overselling him. But I think overselling him was kind of how he got villainized in the first place… ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/146 "2014-11-03T02:52:18Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > screaming at each other? It’s Hal stans, understandably miffed More so than Afghanistan _and_ Pakistan! ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/147 "2014-11-03T03:46:45Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > The show is generally fun, but MAN they are bad at thinking through Barry’s powers. So the guy has a freeze gun. Won’t help at ALL if he doesn’t also have superhuman reflexes. Particularly since he seems to enjoy a good monologue. According to Geoff Johns (who wrote the episode), Captain Cold projects a cold field around him that slows Flash down when he hits it. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/148 "2014-11-03T05:10:42Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > According to Geoff Johns (who wrote the episode), Captain Cold projects a cold field around him that slows Flash down when he hits it. What do you call it when the episode’s author engages in fanwanking? ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/149 "2014-11-03T05:43:58Z")
A great episode? (I loved this episode. It hit every fan/nerd button I had. 🙂 ) ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/150 "2014-11-03T12:06:23Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Alan Scott is the source of the “Green Lantern” meme. Yes, but the overwhelming majority is familiar with the “Silver Age” GL, not the 'Golden Age" GL. Alan Scott’s GL ring/powers had a completely different origin than Hal Jordan’s (it couldn’t affect _wood_), and had to be retconned to fit the “modern” GL universe. > [@foolsguinea](#): > > Oyyyy…OK, not to hijack, but Hal Jordan is hated by some fans because at some point his arrogance and insubordination hit the point that he flipped out, rebelled against the Guardians, and _killed off a huge chunk of the Green Lantern Corps._ > > It was a dumb story idea, but he was a villain for years. And in trying to retcon and undo that mess (understandable) writers reinstated the meme that Hal Jordan was pretty much the greatest GL ever, which is really a version of the problem meme (Hal is better than everyone, entire worlds are just disposable supporting players in Hal’s universe) that got us into the mess. > > So excuse me for liking practically anyone who was a GL better than Hal. John Stewart “let” one planet be destroyed, and then personally executed Mogo. The first ultimately wasn’t his fault, and the second case was a matter of doing what had to be done to survive (and Mogo would have agreed). I won’t “excuse” you, I’ll _applaud_ you for having your own opinion. My question, “Why is there an argument?”, was an honest question. The DC universe makes it clear that Hal is, ultimately, the official, and best GL of 2814. Yes, the whole “villainization” of Hal Jordan was a bad idea. But it was, in its way, necessary. When it comes down to it, the “yellow impurity” was the stupidest thing ever. It was nothing more than an officially-sanctioned “weakness”, because even in the 1960s, somebody at DC realized that superheroes needed to have some sort of weakness to make them more interesting (Superman’s lack of weaknesses, other than kryptonite, was a huge reason the Crisis reboot became necessary). If you go back to the 1960s GL comics, every single issue turned into Hal finding some clever way to get around the “yellow impurity”. It got kind of ridiculous. US Military is testing a new missile, it goes haywire, and GL has to intervene to save his city? Oh look, the test missile is coincidentally painted yellow. Alien monster threatens the city? Oh look, the monster is yellow. Over and over and over. Hal’s whole villainization served, ultimately, to _do the fuck away_ with the yellow impurity, because modern writers realized how fucking stupid it was. The GL Corps is, when it comes down to it, a police force. How stupid would it be to write a cop show wherein the cops couldn’t shoot, or even _punch_, a criminal wearing a yellow hoodie? And, at the same time, they got rid of the whole “without fear” nonsense (because anybody completely “without fear” is either an idiot or insane) and turned it into, “_able to overcome_ great fear”. And how did the “yellow weakness” apply to F# Bell, the GL whose race was blind and had no concept of color? F# Bell would be ineffectually fighting a yellow enemy, and have no idea why his attacks weren’t working. As for my personal love of Hal Jordan … The “old school” Hal Jordan was an alcoholic. Like me. And, like me, he spent some time in jail. Hell, that was how Guy Gardner was introduced: as Hal Jordan’s public defender (yeah, Guy is portrayed as a dumb “tough guy”, but he’s actually pretty damned smart). And, like me, Hal overcame his own _personal_ weakness and became a better person, and eventually, a better hero. I understand the introduction of John Stewart; DC eventually realized that their stable of characters was “too white” and they needed t introduce some non-white characters. Kyle Raynor, not so much. Given that 2814 is a sector, not of the Milky Way galaxy, but of _the entire fucking universe_, why does the damned ring keep coming back to Earth in search of a “replacement” GL? ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/151 "2014-11-03T12:59:02Z")
So how about this new show about The Flash? Great isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/152 "2014-11-03T13:06:22Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > What do you call it when the episode’s author engages in fanwanking? Bad writing. > [@Miller](#): > > I thought it was The Streak? They’re using both The Streak and The Blur. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/153 "2014-11-03T16:08:24Z")
> [@Terminus\_Est](#): > > So how about this new show about The Flash? Great isn’t it? Yes it is, sorry :o I meant my “Hal Jordan is the #1 Green Lantern of Sector 2814. Why is there an argument?” to be a cheeky off-hand joke when I posted it a couple weeks ago. I didn’t think it would come back. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/154 "2014-11-03T17:22:44Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > According to Geoff Johns (who wrote the episode), Captain Cold projects a cold field around him that slows Flash down when he hits it. How about a half a brick travelling at the speed of sound? Geoff say anything about that? You should never underestimate the kinetic energy of a hypersonic chunk of masonry. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/155 "2014-11-03T17:31:10Z")
I’m not sure, but I kinda think Barry’s trying not to kill people here, so as to not come across as a killer (as opposed to that Clark Kent guy in _Smallville_). Particularly seeing as how they mentioned they had a containment option, and the first two people he fought? Not so much with the surviving part. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/156 "2014-11-03T19:35:21Z")
OK, I guess a hypersonic chunk of masonry adds a whole different meaning to terminal velocity. No thrown bricks then, got it. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/157 "2014-11-03T20:03:03Z")
Now, small water balloons… ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/158 "2014-11-03T23:11:25Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > What do you call it when the episode’s author engages in fanwanking? Author’s Saving Throw? Word of God? [Sorry for the hijack.] ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2014, 11:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/159 "2014-11-05T11:24:00Z")
Just watched the pilot. Aren’t the speeds being thrown around waaayyyy too slow? It takes him several seconds to accelerate to 300 MPH, and they wonder if he can possibly handle going 700 MPH at the end. But when he is zipping through traffic, or “flashing” across the room and back (to stop the guy from grabbing the gun) so fast his crush doesn’t notice he’s gone, he’s obviously going, what, several thousand MPH at least? You move around a room at 300 MPH, and you’ll create quite a stir…but you certainly will be anything but invisible! ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2014, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818/160 "2014-11-05T13:31:06Z")
Yeah, they’re handwaving a lot of the “moving to fast to be seen”, and the effects of that movement (wind, impact, inertia of things/people he grabs), just like they did in _Smallville._ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flash-new-tv-show-boxed-spoilers/700818.md?page=9)