The flashing yellow indicates a need for caution, but it also implies right of way. You’re the lawyerman, you should know I’m not going to be cowed by your throwing that “unimpeded” in there. Show me a definitive cite and I’ll back down. No cite? Then your trying to reinforce your weak point w/ obfuscation.
My practical experience trumps your legal expertise for now.
True, I have seen new signals flashing yellow. I think what people are mostly talking about in the other board’s thread, though, is lights that have been knocked out of sync by a storm and go into flash mode, as noted above. This article was cited as evidence that you should treat some flashing yellows as a four-way stop, but I think that’s just a misreading of a poorly-written article.
From the California Driver Handbook, 2007[pdf]:
Which, you will note, is exactly what I said.
I think we have different interpretations on then definition of “exactly”. So answer me this: You’re driving on a highway and approaching an intersection w/ a flashing yellow light. Do you not expect that cross traffic has a flashing red?
I certainly do and I expect that any experienced driver would also.
no completely different. Yield signs in both directions tell each driver the other has the right of way. Flashing yellow in both directions tells each driver s/he has the right of way.
In California, some cities are now flashing green. The local newpaper has a trafic Q&A, which stated it was get people’s attention (stop and wondering what it meant)and serve the same purpose as flashing red.
C’mon folks, this is GQ, not “Can You Top This”. Cite, cite, cite!!
NO!!! And that’s the whole point!!! YOU may think that, but it’s not the law, it’s not the truth, and you’ve been shown that:
California doesn’t tell you to accept that;
Real locations actually do this (flash yellow both ways).
If you wish to hold to your misguided notion of what flashing yellow lights means, by all means, go ahead. I hope you don’t have to drive through any of the intersections we’ve had under discussion!! :eek:
Old guy: If you read what I posted before, flashing yellow does NOT tell you you have the right of way. It tells you that you do not need to stop, but, as with all intersections at which there is no stop sign in the other direction, you must “respect” (the term California uses) the right of way of other drivers with a better right to proceed (usually, they got there first).
I can only say that you couldn’t be more wrong and you have yet to provide any proof of an intersection w/ 4 way yellow flashers. That’s because it’s tota;;y illogical, goes against the standard meaning of traffic signals and does not exist in the U.S., unless by some exremely unusual accident, which I still doubt.
Frankly I’m amazed that a person trained in the law would accept the premiss to begin with.
More international traffic weirdness…
Australian traffic lights ONLY have flashing yellow for ALL directions. You can see it on a keyhole at the electronics box on one of the poles: “NORMAL - FLASHING YELLOW - OFF”
Local traffic law is that when approaching a flashing yellow light, you stop at the stop line and, in the absence of a police officer on point duty, you give way as per an uncontrolled intersection.
Flashing yellow here is rare and it screams out at you “SOMETHING WEIRD IS GOING ON” so you go through that intersection on bloody eggshells. I can’t imagine anything worse than having some drivers facing a “hey, it’s a nice day, everything’s fine” common or garden variety green light. Flashing yellow is a big deal. It’s reassuring to know everybody is seeing the same thing.
Sorry. To answer the OP: Australian traffic lights are programmed to flash yellow four ways. I don’t have a cite handy, but I’ve no reason to lie about it either. So such lights DO exist.
Geobabe allow me to add that I’ve only seen it a few times. The rest of the times the new signal flashes red on the secondary street ways and yellow on the main street ways. It seems to be dependent upon the individual intersection (traffic counts, alignment, etc. ).
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engineer_comp_geek says, “I’ve seen four way flashing yellows many times. They used to have quite a few of them in the town where I grew up.” He lives in Pennsylvania, and I have no reason to believe he grew up outside the US. Oh, but of course he must be wrong, because A. R. Cane says so.
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The law provides no indication that it can’t happen, nor is it totally illogical. I concede it would be rare, for many of the reasons you’ve indicated (which, as you might recall, I said in my first post). But that doesn’t make it impossible. Oh, wait, except that A. R. Cane says it can’t be so.
Unlike you, who argue from a total lack of knowledge, only your intuition, there does appear to be evidence of four-way yellow flashers presented in this thread, from America. I frankly don’t care anymore if you want to accept that or not; play the three monkeys if you prefer.
In GQ, no difinitive cites provided and even your ambiguous cite states, “You do not need to stop for a flashing yellow light”, what other conclusion could be drawn except that right of way is implied? I too am at an end.
Ok, here’s your cite. Michelle Groh-Gordy, Drive Time, Inland Valley Daily Bulletin
Here’s the bit from your cite:
"Question: A few Monday mornings ago, as I passed Ontario High School and approached an intersection, I realized that the green signal light was flashing. I looked again, thinking I was seeing things (as I think other drivers were doing, since all the traffic came to a halt). In the 20-plus years I have been driving, I have never seen flashing green lights.
I crossed the intersection, then heard and saw an approaching police car with lights and sirens in full force. I looked in my rear-view mirror and saw the green light still flashing, then I watched as the police car moved through the intersection and the lights became solid green.
I am assuming the police car was able to control the intersection signal light. Am I correct?
- Louise Shane, Ontario
Answer: Made you look, didn’t it, Louise? Well, that is exactly what the officer in the police car that activated the light wanted you to do.
Many emergency agencies, including the fire and police departments, have the ability to remotely interrupt traffic signals from inside their vehicles. It may be hard to believe, but the authorities have found that many people think that a yellow light means “go faster.” The flashing green light is turned on to elicit the exact response you gave - it lets you know that you can go, but heightens your level of awareness and caution for the emergency vehicle that is forthcoming."
I admit it’s a new one on me. I’m aware that there are devices used in emergency vehicles to control traffic signals, but I’m not sure of the specifics of how it works. I know we had a collision here recently, between a fire rig and a light rail train. It seems that both can control traffic lights upon their approach and someone hadn’t taken this into consideration, whoops!
I’ll concede the exception, but it doesn’t directly answer the 4 way yellow flasher question.
In Cars (which my three-year-old requests to watch nightly, so I’ve probably seen it twenty times), there is a flashing yellow both ways at night in Radiator Springs. I’ve never seen it in real life, but my experience is that Pixar doesn’t screw up details like that.
A. R., that device is the Opticon. I remember it because our city traffic engineer was always frustrated after one of our fire trucks came thru a signal and disrupted the normal programmed regime of the signals. Often he (or a tech) would have to go to the intersection and manually re-set the thing.