# Flight with Denzel Washington **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 27, 2012, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248 "2012-12-27T03:44:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2013, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/61 "2013-02-20T23:20:16Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > One, AA is a cult with no more of a success rate (14%) than waking up and saying “Ya know, I don’t think I’ll drink anymore.” Just curious, but does that success rate number count everyone who started AA, but did not finish the program? A common difficulty in measuring the success rate of programs that help people quit doing something is that not everyone finishes the program. ---
**Author:** ![Ostrya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/35a633/32.png) [@Ostrya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ostrya)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2013, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/62 "2013-02-21T00:18:45Z")
> [@Accidental\_Martyr](#): > > I watched this the other night. I thought Washington’s performance was good. I didn’t like John Goodman’s character, it was way too over the top. I agree on both counts, Goodman’s character was brashly absurd. > [@](#): > > The AA stuff was disappointing but not surprising. Almost all movies/TV programs perpetuate the myth of AA/12-step programs as an effective treatment for alcoholism, so I was expecting it. Not necessarily a myth that AA is effective. For example, many people at this very message board feel the program has been helpful to them, or other people they have known. I did not like AA, but it makes no sense to deny that it has worked for many people. If someone thinks it has helped them, how can someone else deny that it has? What ever it takes to quit, if that’s what one wants to do. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2013, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/63 "2013-02-21T00:25:26Z")
The myth is that AA is so much better than other options. It’s not that it doesn’t work at all, it’s that it doesn’t work most of the time. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2013, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/64 "2013-02-21T01:02:57Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > The myth is that AA is so much better than other options. It’s not that it doesn’t work at all, it’s that it doesn’t work most of the time. Meh. The famous program is the program that makes it into the movie- whatever the subject matter. It’s easy shorthand. Use a program no one has ever heard of and you’ve got to spend tedious exposition showing what the program actually is. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2013, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/65 "2013-02-21T01:23:10Z")
Would have been a shocker if he joined Scientology and used that Narconon thingy. Heh, imagine the movie that way. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2013, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/66 "2013-03-02T05:56:01Z")
I just saw it, and I was somewhat disappointed. Washington’s performance reprised a lot of his previous ones, including _Training Day_ and _Safe House_, and I didn’t see much that was new from him here. Cheadle was a non-entity. And the relationship with Kelly Reilly just seemed a little too pat – he finds her apartment right as she’s in a confrontation, and he comes into her life right as she decides to get clean. Plot points spoilered for those who haven’t seen it: I found it hard to believe that the co-pilot and the flight attendant would cover for him by not mentioning his demeanor, his relationship with the dead woman, or his history of drinking. Yes, he landed the plane with few deaths, but they couldn’t have been sure at the time of their depositions that Washington’s behavior had nothing to do with causing the crash. (Actually, I was expecting to learn that the cause of the crash was something like the missing third vodka bottle lodging under the control yoke). ---
**Author:** ![lisacurl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/41988e/32.png) [@lisacurl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisacurl)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2013, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/67 "2013-03-02T15:51:37Z")
I seem to recall the co-pilot knowing that it was an equipment malfunction that caused the problem, and acknowledging that it was Whip’s skill which was the reason he was alive at all. The senior flight attendant had known Whip for over a decade and apparently felt warmly towards him, plus Whip shamelessly called in that marker of friendship by reminding her that her child would have been burying her if he hadn’t landed the plane. They both seemed to feel that his skill was greater than his personality flaws, and that his drinking had nothing to do with the crash. ---
**Author:** ![MostlyCarbon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/848f3c/32.png) [@MostlyCarbon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MostlyCarbon)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2013, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/68 "2013-03-02T17:24:22Z")
I’m surprised at so much talk about AA in the movie. To me the AA meeting was just a brief appearance in which Whip did happen to relate to the man talking there about being honest with oneself. Also, I kinda expected the co-pilot to mention the extreme speed/buffeting/etc in the climbout - and that having some possible connection to the mechanical failure. But, I guess the co-pilot was too concerned that Whip was the devil himself and that’s why he had broken ribs and his wife would have to drive herself to church for awhile. I kept asking myself (though not out loud) throughout the movie, “Is Whip a good guy or is Whip a bad guy”. I decided Whip was a bad guy who, in the end, might become a good guy someday. I personally prefer westerns. When the guys wear either a white hat or a black hat I don’t have to exert so much mental effort. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2013, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/69 "2013-03-02T21:03:33Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > I asked why, using _Flight_ as an example, some trailers seemingly have nothing to do with the movie? The response was surprising: Because they are made that way at the behest of the studio! As Roger Ebert once said “The trailer is the movie the studio _wished_ they had made.” > [@Richard\_Pearse](#): > > My partner and I are both pilots and watched this last night. We were both chuckling at the inaccuracies in the flying scenes and I wondered out loud if junkies watching the movie roll their eyes at the drug scenes. A good friend of mine is a 25 year sober alcoholic who was also addicted to coke, and he loved the film and thought it was very accurate. Also, Whip didn’t get sober until he was in prison, where vodka is a bit harder to come by. > [@Accidental\_Martyr](#): > > I watched this the other night. I thought Washington’s performance was good. I didn’t like John Goodman’s character, it was way too over the top. I’ve known a few drug dealers, and they tend to cultivate over-the-top personae. See Timothy Leary’s “The Dope Dealer as Robin Hood”. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/70 "2013-03-03T20:12:41Z")
> [@Richard\_Pearse](#): > > Cocaine fixes everything apparently. This was my takeaway from the move. Coke is good stuff, and apparently can get you over a massive drinking binge in just a couple of minutes. It seems like something you should always have a bit of stashed in the medicine cabinet, just in case. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/71 "2013-03-03T20:18:58Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > This was my takeaway from the move. Coke is good stuff, and apparently can get you over a massive drinking binge in just a couple of minutes. It seems like something you should always have a bit of stashed in the medicine cabinet, just in case. I don’t know about the specifics, as coke was never my thing, but alternating stimulants and depressants to maintain some sort of balance is hardly unusual for addicts. Or even for non-addicts - plenty of people have an extra Red Bull in the morning if they occasionally overindulge the night before. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/72 "2013-03-03T20:22:59Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > I don’t know about the specifics, as coke was never my thing, but alternating stimulants and depressants to maintain some sort of balance is hardly unusual for addicts. Or even for non-addicts - plenty of people have an extra Red Bull in the morning if they occasionally overindulge the night before. Oh, of course. I was just joking. I have no experience with cocaine at all, and don’t plan on changing that situation. I don’t have a lot of experience with drinking to excess, either. ---
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/73 "2013-03-03T22:49:11Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > This was my takeaway from the move. Coke is good stuff, and apparently can get you over a massive drinking binge in just a couple of minutes. It seems like something you should always have a bit of stashed in the medicine cabinet, just in case. Like all other drugs, it’s a good short term solution. The trick is managing to keep it a short term solution. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/74 "2013-03-19T19:31:42Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Hated it. It was a 2 hours ad for Alcoholics Anonymous. Concur. The ending made me regret wasting time on the movie, which had many good elements. It’s not that addiction etc. can’t be presented as part of a movie, but this one fell prey to \*Top Gun \*syndrome. We’ve all seen characters “go to meetings” in TV and film and 9 times out of 10, it’s a pastiche of AA and not the real thing. That lets the writer be flexible and, more importantly, not have to submit to AA’s approval. For whatever reason, the makers of \*Flight \*had to use the real AA and thus do the sort of delicate, unrelentingly-positive, we-win outcome that you see in films where the US military lets makers borrow its fancy toys. The price of using real F-14s is that you’d better make the AF/Navy/Marines look damn handsome and glorious. The ending of _Flight_ turned into a paean of wonderfulness for AA, and IMHO flew the whole thing into the ground. They should have used a fake organization and thus been allowed a grittier, more realistic ending instead of this Shirley Temple “and then the little boy fell off the bottle and woke up” crap. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/75 "2013-03-19T21:22:51Z")
What are you talking about? There is one AA scene in the movie and Denzel leaves. Nobody is required to get “approval” to depict AA in a movie. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/76 "2013-03-19T21:27:50Z")
It’s true. There was only one AA scene in the movie. The scene started with the opening credits and it ended with the closing credits. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/77 "2013-03-19T21:27:58Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > What are you talking about? There is one AA scene in the movie and Denzel leaves. Nobody is required to get “approval” to depict AA in a movie. Yeah, I don’t get the AA hate in this thread. Don’t get me wrong, it was a self-indulgent, trite, contrive, and appallingly boring movie and there are plenty of reasons to dislike it, but its portrayal of AA isn’t one of them. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/78 "2013-03-19T21:30:38Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > Nobody is required to get “approval” to depict AA in a movie. They are if they use the name and identifiable elements. It really doesn’t matter. The entire movie was crippled by a Care Bears-level resolution to addiction. The brand name is irrelevant. ---
**Author:** ![Accidental\_Martyr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ce7236/32.png) [@Accidental\_Martyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Accidental_Martyr)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/79 "2013-03-19T21:32:59Z")
Even if they didn’t specifically mention AA I think it’s pretty obvious he’s in some sort of 12-step program, which is the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2013, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248/80 "2013-03-19T21:38:04Z")
> [@Accidental\_Martyr](#): > > Even if they didn’t specifically mention AA I think it’s pretty obvious he’s in some sort of 12-step program, which is the same thing. The only thing that’s obvious is that he quit. I don’t think quitting drinking and abusing drugs is synonymous with AA (mayhap the opposite), or any 12 step program. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/flight-with-denzel-washington/645248.md?page=5)