# Florida Congressman Demands Gov. Rick Scott ‘Immediately Suspend’ Voter Purge **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 25, 2012, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092 "2012-05-25T19:13:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2012, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/61 "2012-06-19T20:54:04Z")
> [@IntelliQ](#): > > In related news, dead dog gets voter registration form: > > [http://www2.wsls.com/news/2012/jun/18/bedford-county-dead-dog-receives-voter-registratio-ar-1996759/](http://www2.wsls.com/news/2012/jun/18/bedford-county-dead-dog-receives-voter-registratio-ar-1996759/) > [@](#): > > … 10 On Your Side looked deeper and found that the voter registration forms were sent by the non-profit Voter Participation Center, not the State Board of Elections. > > So we contacted the Voter Participation Center and found that they purchase mailing lists from vendors and while they do try and check every name the organization admits that some do fall through the cracks. > > The voter registration efforts are focused on groups like young people, minorities, and unmarried women. > > This could help explain why the Morris’ dog Mozart didn’t receive a registration form until now, since he would have been 18. > > The Board of Elections said they’ve received similar complaints but since the Voter Participation Center is a private organization they can’t stop them from sending voter registration forms. … CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/62 "2012-06-20T01:46:46Z")
> [@IntelliQ](#): > > In related news, dead dog gets voter registration form: > > [http://www2.wsls.com/news/2012/jun/18/bedford-county-dead-dog-receives-voter-registratio-ar-1996759/](http://www2.wsls.com/news/2012/jun/18/bedford-county-dead-dog-receives-voter-registratio-ar-1996759/) From [_Rolling Stone_](http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/pictures/the-voter-fraud-myth-debunked-20120612) (which is a more serious political publication than _The National Review_ or _The American Spectator,_ at any rate): > [@](#): > > **The Truth About Voter Fraud** > > As we’ve reported at Rolling Stone, over the past few years Republicans in more than a dozen states have been knocking themselves out passing laws that make it harder for people to vote. It hasn’t escaped notice that the voters most affected by these measures – from voter ID laws to restrictions on early voting – are Democrats. But no matter: Republicans deny they’re waging a partisan “war on voting” – they say the new laws are needed to combat rampant voter fraud. That’s the line laid down most recently by Florida Gov. Rick Scott to justify purging his state’s voter rolls of alleged noncitizens. “We need to have fair elections,” he said last week. “When you go out to vote, you want to make sure that the other individuals that are voting have a right to vote.” > > But here’s the thing: Not only is voter fraud not rampant – it’s virtually nonexistent. The iron-clad word on the subject comes from the Brennan Center for Justice at NYU School of Law, whose 2007 report, ‘The Truth About Voter Fraud,’ sorts through thousands of allegations going back to the 1990s in the most in-depth voter fraud study ever undertaken. The bottom line, confirmed by all subsequent research: “Usually, only a tiny portion of the claimed illegality is substantiated — and most of the remainder is either nothing more than speculation or has been conclusively debunked.” In fact, “one is more likely to be struck by lightning than to commit voter fraud.” > > \ > > **Voting by Dead People** > > Or, if you prefer, living voters are casting ballots in the names of dead ones. (As in: ‘Among Voters in New Jersey, GOP Sees Dead People’ ‘1.8 Million Dead People Registered to Vote,’ and ‘Dead People Cast Over 950 Ballots in South Carolina.’) > > **The truth:** In most cases, allegations arise from flawed matches of death records and voter rolls. Sometimes a voter turns out to have died after voting; in other cases, a living voter might be mistaken for a dead one with the same name. > > **Typical case:** In Georgia in 2000, 5,412 votes were alleged to have been cast by dead voters over the previous 20 years. The allegations were based on a flawed match of voter rolls to death lists. An investigation turned up only one instance, and even this was later found to have been an error: One Alan J. Mandel was alleged to have voted in 1998, despite having died in 1997. It turned out that another Alan J. Mandell (two "l"s) – very much alive – was the guy who’d voted, but election workers simply checked the wrong name off of their list. > > \ > > **Voting by Dogs** > > That is, people are voting in their dogs’ names. As in: ‘Prank Lands Voter in the Doghouse,’ 'Woman Registers Her Dog to Vote; Prosecutors Growl." > > **The truth:** Brennan turned up only nine specific reports of dogs found on the voter rolls. In six of the nine, the dogs were put on the rolls by people trying to make a point – that’s it’s possible to place a dog on the voter rolls. “Which is to say, if people no longer registered dogs to show that dogs are on the rolls, dogs would no longer be on the rolls.” No wonder this kind of fraud rarely happens: To get a dog on the rolls, you need to risk up to 30 years imprisonment on federal charges alone. All for one vote! > > **Typical case:** There is no typical case. Brennan found only two cases – ever – of ballots being submittted in the name of a dog: a ballot cast by “Duncan MacDonald” in 2006 and 2007 (but labeled “VOID” and signed with a paw print), and another cast by “Raku Bowman” in 2003 in a local election in Venice, California. ---
**Author:** ![IntelliQ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e99b99/32.png) [@IntelliQ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IntelliQ)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/63 "2012-06-20T02:12:38Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > From [_Rolling Stone_](http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/pictures/the-voter-fraud-myth-debunked-20120612) (which is a more serious political publication than _The National Review_ or _The American Spectator,_ at any rate): Rolling Stone is unconvincing. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/64 "2012-06-20T02:18:06Z")
Then do the research, they aren’t hiding anything. If they are lying or wrong, you will have no problem proving it. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/65 "2012-06-20T02:27:38Z")
> [@IntelliQ](#): > > Rolling Stone is unconvincing. :rolleyes: :dubious: Everything in that article comes from [a 2007 study by the Brennan Center for Justice at New York University School of Law.](http://brennan.3cdn.net/c176576c0065a7eb84_gxm6ib0hl.pdf) Convincing enough for ya? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/66 "2012-06-20T02:39:35Z")
Would that be _Walter_ Brennan? No? Well, I mean, really… ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/67 "2012-06-20T02:44:41Z")
> [@JBGUSA](#): > > My view is that if a voter is legitimate and votes regularly there is little risk of their being “purged”. Really? Nothing could go wrong? Here’s a nice story for you: [http://www.npr.org/blogs/itsallpolitics/2012/05/31/154020289/world-war-ii-vet-caught-up-in-floridas-voter-purge-controversy](http://www.npr.org/blogs/itsallpolitics/2012/05/31/154020289/world-war-ii-vet-caught-up-in-floridas-voter-purge-controversy) Bill Internicola, a 91-yar-old World War II veteran, was born and raised in Brooklyn, N.Y., and now lives in Florida’s Broward County. He recently received a letter from county elections officials asking him to show proof he was a U.S. citizen or be removed from the voting rolls. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2012, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/68 "2012-06-20T02:46:29Z")
> [@IntelliQ](#): > > In related news, dead dog gets voter registration form: > > [http://www2.wsls.com/news/2012/jun/18/bedford-county-dead-dog-receives-voter-registratio-ar-1996759/](http://www2.wsls.com/news/2012/jun/18/bedford-county-dead-dog-receives-voter-registratio-ar-1996759/) You don’t see how this is not going to result in a vote actually cast? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/69 "2012-06-23T06:03:03Z")
> [@lance\_strongarm](#): > > You don’t see how this is not going to result in a vote actually cast? I dunno, with right combination of patience, training, and voodoo . . . ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/70 "2012-06-23T17:46:51Z")
> [@lance\_strongarm](#): > > You don’t see how this is not going to result in a vote actually cast? That, and the dog lived in Virginia. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/71 "2012-06-23T19:29:28Z")
> [@lance\_strongarm](#): > > You don’t see how this is not going to result in a vote actually cast? With no voter ID, guy shows up, says he’s _insert dog name_, casts vote. Easy peasey. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/72 "2012-06-23T19:55:43Z")
And this is where we appear to differ: I think the sensible solution is to reform the registration process, so the dog doesn’t get registered to vote in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2012, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/73 "2012-06-28T07:09:05Z")
[A federal judge just denied the DOJ’s attempt to stop the purge.](http://www.thenation.com/blog/168636/federal-judge-denies-doj-request-stop-florida-voter-purge) Wonder if this will go to the SCOTUS? (Or if there’s any point taking it there?) Same judge, BTW, who [just blocked Florida’s new voter-registration laws.](http://colorlines.com/archives/2012/06/federal_judge_overturns_draconian_voter_registration_rules_in_florida.html) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2012, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/74 "2012-08-05T08:20:03Z")
Former Florida GOP Chair Jim Greer says [they were actually planning to disfranchise blacks.](http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/) > [@](#): > > In the debate over new laws meant to curb voter fraud in places like Florida, Democrats always charge that Republicans are trying to suppress the vote of liberal voting blocs like blacks and young people, while Republicans just laugh at such ludicrous and offensive accusations. That is, every Republican except for Florida’s former Republican Party chairman Jim Greer, who, scorned by his party and in deep legal trouble, blew the lid off what he claims was a systemic effort to suppress the black vote. In a 630-page deposition recorded over two days in late May, Greer, who is on trial for corruption charges, unloaded a litany of charges against the “whack-a-do, right-wing crazies” in his party, including the effort to suppress the black vote. > > In the deposition, released to the press yesterday, Greer mentioned a December 2009 meeting with party officials. “I was upset because the political consultants and staff were talking about voter suppression and keeping blacks from voting,” he said, according to the Tampa Bay Times. He also said party officials discussed how “minority outreach programs were not fit for the Republican Party,” according to the AP. > > The comments, if true (he is facing felony corruption charges and has an interest in scorning his party), would confirm what critics have long suspected. Florida Gov. Rick Scott is currently facing inquiries from the Justice Department and pressure from civil rights groups over his purging of voter rolls in the state, an effort that critics say has disproportionately targeted minorities and other Democratic voters. One group suing the state claims up to 87 percent of the voters purged from the rolls so far have been people of color, though other estimates place that number far lower. Scott has defended the purge, even though he was erroneously listed as dead himself on the rolls in 2006. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2012, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/75 "2012-08-05T15:56:44Z")
> [@](#): > > Scott has defended the purge, even though he was erroneously listed as dead himself on the rolls in 2006. That explains a lot. Too bad the wingers here don’t have this guy’s honesty. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2012, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/76 "2012-08-05T16:58:16Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > With no voter ID, guy shows up, says he’s _insert dog name_, casts vote. Easy peasey. With an ID? Florida requires an ID at voting. Unless you have a dog tag, it’s going to be tough. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2012, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/77 "2012-08-05T17:22:07Z")
Scott won the case to continue the purge. It’s legal, and actually, it’s the law. Voting lists have to be maintained under the Help America Vote Act. Computerized statewide voter registration HAVA requires states develop a single, uniform, official, centralized, interactive computerized statewide voter registration list defined, maintained, and administered at the State level. (Previously, voter registration lists were maintained by local officials.) HAVA requires the statewide list be coordinated with other agency databases within the state. HAVA also requires regular “maintenance” of the statewide list including removing ineligible voters and duplicate names are eliminated in accordance with the National Voter Registration Act of 1993 (NVRA). > **[Help America Vote Act](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help_America_Vote_Act)** > > The Help America Vote Act of 2002 (Pub. L. 107–252 (text) (PDF)), or HAVA, is a United States federal law which passed in the House 357-48 and 92–2 in the Senate and was signed into law by President Bush on October 29, 2002. The bill was drafted (at least in part) in reaction to the controversy surrounding the 2000 U.S. presidential election, when almost two million ballots were disqualified because they registered multiple votes or no votes when run through vote-counting machines. > The goals of ... Rick Scott was complying with federal law and a judge upheld the purge. Rick Scott went beyond the requirements by asking for a more accurate federal database. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2012, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/78 "2012-08-05T19:03:43Z")
Yeah, well, by the way, did you hear about this, and just forgot to mention it? > **[Local Election Officials Resist Florida's Efforts to Purge Voter Rolls |...](https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/article/local-election-officials-resist-floridas-efforts-to-purge-voter-rolls/)** > > Local election supervisors, about half of whom are Republican, have balked at the move by state officials to strike ineligible names from voter lists. > [@](#): > > …But local election supervisors, about half of whom are Republican, have also balked, refusing to continue a purge that one suggested might be illegal… Don’t know how you missed that, but not to worry, got your back on this… ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2012, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/79 "2012-08-06T01:59:39Z")
I’ve heard reports of refusal to carry out the purges locally, but that’s a different issue from whether the purges are allowed. I’m not adamant that we have to have purges, just that the federal government not interfere with a legal state process. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2012, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092/80 "2012-08-06T02:42:01Z")
Under certain circumstances, Federal intervention in legal state processes are actually quite a good idea. If we can be entirely assured that what appears to be happening is not, so much the better. Otherwise, Federal intervention is the only alternative short of divine intervention, which is less reliable. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-congressman-demands-gov-rick-scott-immediately-suspend-voter-purge/623092.md?page=5)