### Author:  [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)
#### Post date: [June 2, 2013, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-continues-to-lead-the-way-on-public-atheist-monuments/659931/1 "2013-06-02T09:25:35Z")
[sub](Wasn’t sure where to put this, but since it involves religion, freedom of speech, and separation of church and state, I figured GD was a safe bet in case an argument breaks out…)[/sub]
First, there was the [Festivus pole erected](http://blogs.browardpalmbeach.com/pulp/2012/12/how_an_85-foot-tall_festivus_p.php) alongside a nativity scene and Menorah in Deerfield Beach last Christmas. But that was a temporary dealio constructed with beer cans in laid-back, non-fundy South Florida. Now, atheists are classing it up and stepping up their game a notch by successfully gaining approval for [this permanent granite monument](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/31/atheist-monument-starke-florida_n_3368319.html) in front of a Starke, Florida (fundyville, prison town, home of Florida’s deathrow and execution chamber) courthouse, across from a recently installed Ten Commandments monument.
The new monument, planned for installation next month, and brought to you through the efforts of the Florida members of _American Atheists_ and funded by the _Stiefel Freethought Foundation_, will feature:
> [@from HuffPo link](#):
>
> quotes related to secularism from Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin and American Atheists founder Madalyn Murray O’Hair on a 4-foot-high panel, alongside a bench.
>
> **\**
>
> It will include a quote from the Treaty of Tripoli, a 1796 peace agreement between the U.S. and North African Muslims, which has become a rallying point for atheists because of its declaration that “the government of the United States is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion.”
>
> The display will also feature Biblical quotes that supporters say correspond to the Ten Commandments, such as Deuteronomy 13:10, which says to “stone him with stones” so “that he die” in reference to people who worship other gods. (The first commandment reads, “You shall have no other gods before me.”)
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### Author:  [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)
#### Post date: [June 2, 2013, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-continues-to-lead-the-way-on-public-atheist-monuments/659931/2 "2013-06-02T12:09:29Z")
While I normally would consider it a waste of money, considering this:
> [@](#):
>
> across from a recently installed Ten Commandments monument
It seems like a reasonable enough thing to do. Although it would have been fun if some Islamic group had wanted to put up some quotes from the Koran to watch the locals try to rationalize why _Biblical_ quotes are OK but the _Koran_ isn’t.
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### Author:  [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)
#### Post date: [June 2, 2013, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-continues-to-lead-the-way-on-public-atheist-monuments/659931/3 "2013-06-02T12:34:11Z")
Also, as someone on another forum just pointed out it’s a monument to secularism, not atheism.
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### Author:  [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)
#### Post date: [June 2, 2013, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-continues-to-lead-the-way-on-public-atheist-monuments/659931/4 "2013-06-02T12:46:18Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#):
>
> Also, as someone on another forum just pointed out it’s a monument to secularism, not atheism.
Whatever… If you look at the pictures in the slideshow, it says “American Atheists” in the biggest, most prominently-placed letters, so I assure you that it will be considered an “atheist monument” by effectively 100% of the town it’s located in.
Any bets as to it actually getting installed before someone tries to get an injunction against it? Will they ultimately prefer to negotiate the removal of the Ten Commandments to avoid having this put up? And if/when installed, how long will it last before it’s defaced?
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### Author:  [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)
#### Post date: [June 2, 2013, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-continues-to-lead-the-way-on-public-atheist-monuments/659931/5 "2013-06-02T14:04:51Z")
I (an atheist) really don’t get all that hot and bothered by things like the ten commandments showing up in places like court houses of high schools (and I’m willing to bet most of the students don’t even notice them). But that monument they want to put up is really ugly. Also, I wish the quote would start out with “An American Atheist believes…” and not just “An Atheist believes…”. It doesn’t seem right for their little group to decide what every single atheist in the world believes. And now that I write that, I want to say that we’ve had this discussion about them before. With people saying things like “So, if I’m pro-war, I’m not an Atheist anymore?” Either way, I don’t think it’s fair for them to hijack the term.
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### Author:  [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)
#### Post date: [June 2, 2013, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-continues-to-lead-the-way-on-public-atheist-monuments/659931/6 "2013-06-02T21:06:57Z")
My main objection is that it’s ugly as shit. I’d expect atheists to have better taste than that. Plus: Atheism describes what a person does NOT believe, but has nothing to do with what he DOES believe.
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### Author:  [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)
#### Post date: [June 2, 2013, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-continues-to-lead-the-way-on-public-atheist-monuments/659931/7 "2013-06-02T21:58:51Z")
If you read the actual linked article in the first post people would see
> [@](#):
>
> The county’s free speech forum guidelines say monuments must commemorate “people, events and ideas which played a significant role in the development, origins or foundations of United States of America or Florida law, or Bradford County,” cannot be permanent and cannot be “libelous, pornographic or obscene.”
So they HAD to put quotes and ideas on the installation. It is quite ugly but the alternative is to let the appearance direct state sponsorship of silly old Abrahamic laws.
Yes, a handful of the commandments are fine…but more than half of them have nothing to do with our laws.
For the most part almost all of “american atheists” actions are about preventing that perception that what ever religion has the most power locally directly controls the states actions.
They work hard to make sure government enforcing the separation of church and state.
e.g. #2
> [@](#):
>
> Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
Thank god (oops broke #3) that one is not codified in US law.
But that’s fine…here is the group that put up the 10 commandments down there [breaking #2](http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/05/28/atheists-sue-florida-county-to-remove-ten-commandments-monument/) 🙂
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### Author:  [@Renee\_RL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Renee_RL)
#### Post date: [June 4, 2013, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-continues-to-lead-the-way-on-public-atheist-monuments/659931/8 "2013-06-04T20:33:42Z")
Does the molested daughter have to honor her father?
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### Author:  [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)
#### Post date: [June 4, 2013, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-continues-to-lead-the-way-on-public-atheist-monuments/659931/9 "2013-06-04T20:40:19Z")
So, uh, what’s the debate here?
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### Author:  [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)
#### Post date: [June 4, 2013, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-continues-to-lead-the-way-on-public-atheist-monuments/659931/10 "2013-06-04T20:44:10Z")
> [@panache45](#):
>
> My main objection is that it’s ugly as shit.
Doesn’t matter much, since it’s going to be illegally destroyed by fundamentalist vandals within a month of its installation anyway. Hope AA didn’t spend a bunch of money on it.
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### Author:  [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)
#### Post date: [June 4, 2013, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/florida-continues-to-lead-the-way-on-public-atheist-monuments/659931/11 "2013-06-04T20:47:43Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#):
>
> So, uh, what’s the debate here?
Witnessing. 😉