# Food stamps; do you think one's purchases/taxes should be looked into? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 9, 2012, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625 "2012-06-09T15:30:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/121 "2012-06-10T00:12:34Z")
> [@the\_apples\_fell](#): > > I do know her circumstances but according to others on here even, blowing your money on useless junk is not considered fraud, and this friend makes well under the poverty level. Blowing your money on useless junk does not make you eligible for public assistance, you. . . not very knowledgeable person. ---
**Author:** ![the\_apples\_fell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@the\_apples\_fell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_apples_fell)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/122 "2012-06-10T00:14:45Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > Blowing your money on useless junk does not make you eligible for public assistance, you. . . not very knowledgeable person. Have a civil conversation without any sort of insult, I beg of you. ---
**Author:** ![the\_apples\_fell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@the\_apples\_fell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_apples_fell)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/123 "2012-06-10T00:15:50Z")
> [@Farmer\_Jane](#): > > But most welfare recipients are white. > > Again, no one has the right to potato chips. I don’t think that just because you are poor, you can’t treat yourself. I don’t have an issue with restricting what you can purchase with an EBT card, however. The original welfare programs were meant to take farming surpluses and put it into the hands of poor city folk. > > There’s a correlation between obesity and food assistance. I think that some food benefits should be increased - like access to healthy food, for example. > > edit: Post aimed @ Doc > > edit again: Of course if I point out that some people abuse the system or whatever, it means I’m against the system entirely. :rolleyes: Right? Because it’s impossible to have a well-thought out nuanced opinion on the Dope. I agree. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/124 "2012-06-10T00:18:48Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > The most they can hope for is two consecutive years of assistance. Kind of a pitiful thing to have a houseful of kids for. I think you can get Food Stamps for longer if you have kids. Two years is for cash…and I’m not sure that Section 8 or Medicaid has limits. edited to add: I believe everyone has the right to healthcare, though. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/125 "2012-06-10T00:20:21Z")
> [@the\_apples\_fell](#): > > Have a civil conversation without any sort of insult, I beg of you. That was not an insult. That was a statement of fact. You do not have any knowledge of how public assistance works. For one thing, you think spending all your money somehow qualifies you. This is not true. You also think that if a poor person has something nicer than you, they should not get public assistance. This also shows ignorance of how public assistance works. So let us continue having this civil conversation. ---
**Author:** ![Swords\_to\_Plowshares](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b38774/32.png) [@Swords\_to\_Plowshares](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swords_to_Plowshares)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/126 "2012-06-10T00:21:59Z")
I voted “yes”, since they already do it, and I am fine with keeping the status quo for food stamps for now. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/127 "2012-06-10T00:25:15Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > You don’t understand, **Doc**. When Jane was poor and needed assistance she didn’t get it so, therefore, everyone who does get it is a cheat. > [@Biggirl](#): > > That was not an insult. That was a statement of fact. You do not have any knowledge of how public assistance works. For one thing, you think spending all your money somehow qualifies you. This is not true. You also think that if a poor person has something nicer than you, they should not get public assistance. This also shows ignorance of how public assistance works. > > So let us continue having this civil conversation. Yeah, well to be fair: anyone who disagrees with you is apparently some Big Conservative Meanie Head Who Hates Black People and Poor People and Babies! Nowhere did I say that the majority of people who got welfare were cheaters. I said it happens and it is a problem and it makes me angry. Somehow you mangled that into the logical fallacy of, “When Jane was poor and needed assistance she didn’t get it so, therefore, everyone who does get it is a cheat.” ---
**Author:** ![the\_apples\_fell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@the\_apples\_fell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_apples_fell)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/128 "2012-06-10T00:29:34Z")
> [@Farmer\_Jane](#): > > Yeah, well to be fair: anyone who disagrees with you is apparently some Big Conservative Meanie Head Who Hates Black People and Poor People and Babies! Seriously. Funny because I have given to charities for years, raised money by hand to give to UNICEF, and am one of the first to speak up on behalf of injustices faced by minorities. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/129 "2012-06-10T00:31:04Z")
> [@Farmer\_Jane](#): > > I think you can get Food Stamps for longer if you have kids. > > Two years is for cash…and I’m not sure that Section 8 or Medicaid has limits. > > edited to add: I believe everyone has the right to healthcare, though. Yes, there is no time limits on Medicaid. And you can get food stamps for your kids but not for you. Do you know how much you can get on food stamps? In New York City it’s a maximum of $200 a month for one kid, $367 for two. I’m not gonna lie, if you plan ahead and use coupons and shop intelligently, you can eat pretty well. You can probably even afford lobster twice a year. Let’s hang them! . ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/130 "2012-06-10T00:32:12Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > Yes, there is no time limits on Medicaid. And you can get food stamps for your kids but not for you. Do you know how much you can get on food stamps? In New York City it’s a maximum of $200 a month for one kid, $367 for two. I’m not gonna lie, if you plan ahead and use coupons and shop intelligently, you can eat pretty well. You can probably even afford lobster twice a year. Let’s hang them! > > . Did you not read the part where I said benefits should be increased so recipients can have access to better food? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/131 "2012-06-10T00:33:19Z")
> [@Farmer\_Jane](#): > > Yeah, well to be fair: anyone who disagrees with you is apparently some Big Conservative Meanie Head Who Hates Black People and Poor People and Babies! > > Nowhere did I say that the majority of people who got welfare were cheaters. I said it happens and it is a problem and it makes me angry. Somehow you mangled that into the logical fallacy of, “When Jane was poor and needed assistance she didn’t get it so, therefore, everyone who does get it is a cheat.” That was the impression I got from this post: > [@](#): > > You know what else is annoying? Selling those for cash. The EBT card hasn’t stopped fraud, either. Or the SNAP program. > > It would be nice to require an ID when you use that stuff. > > I could’ve easily lied and qualify for Medicaid several months ago, but I didn’t. Now I’m considering bankruptcy because of medical bills. I could’ve qualified for Food Stamps if I had lied in my Super Poor Days. And in my Super Poor Days, there’s no way I could’ve even afforded a knockoff purse. Ramen at lunch every day! I was so much skinnier then. One pack = 2 meals. In my Super Poor Days, I could’ve qualified for some things but I didn’t apply because of the paternity thing. Didn’t want the government forcing me to take someone to court. It was hard, but we survived. I recall two birthdays and two Hannukahs that were supplied from the Dollar Tree. > > As a teacher in a low-income, high crime neighborhood, I can assure you that a lot of those kids have things that we can’t afford (multiple pairs of Jordans, iPods, gaming systems). > > I can also assure you that there are kids who are desperately poor and for whatever reason, they can’t get help through the system. Some kids without citizenship routinely go to the Children’s Hospital for care and never pay the bills. One has a deadbeat dad who cant be tracked but the caseworker accused his mother of lying - so no more food help for that family. I’ve bought him lunch and food several times this year. He sneaks back into his old school to get lunch because he has his old school I.D. and qualified for free/reduced lunch a few years back. It makes me angry when I hear about kids who ADMIT their moms are welfare queens and they’re sitting right next to a hungry child. Donno how many kids I’ve fed breakfast (keep a Sam’s Club sized box of oatmeal in the back), bought a bus pass for, or whatever. Oh, and clothes for teenage girls. One girl has a mom who is a ‘welfare queen’ and claims her even though she kicked her out of the house. So the girl has little to no food and no help from mom and guess who bought her bus passes this year so she could get to school? Yeah. Also cleaned out my closet for her. Since I don’t have to eat Ramen as much, I porked out. > > GAAAAH. I hate people. If that’s not what you meant, please forgive me. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/132 "2012-06-10T00:35:12Z")
> [@Farmer\_Jane](#): > > Did you not read the part where I said benefits should be increased so recipients can have access to better food? > > :dubious: Um, that wasn’t directed at you. This was a general fact post. ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/133 "2012-06-10T00:35:14Z")
I don’t usually hold up the UK as a shining example of how to do anything, and I’m not really doing so here. But I processed welfare benefits for a couple of years for claimants in the London area. We give benefit recipients cash. Why not do this rather than food stamps? That way, the recipients don’t have to suffer the indignity of having their lifestyles and shopping carts scrutinised by total strangers, and the total strangers won’t have to expend all that energy and outrage nosing into other peoples’ business. It seems like a win-win to me. ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/134 "2012-06-10T00:35:57Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > So your cousin wasn’t a fraud, you just can’t stand her? Is that it? Really, why are you so angry she got assistance. You think you should have kept your .3 cent tax that went to public assistance while she starved because she had kids you don’t think she should have had? > > P.S., no, there was no grandfathering. Once the new law went into effect she had two years to find a job. Period. You yourself admit you do not know what her exact circumstances were. You only know she had kids and you didn’t like it one bit because she was poor. Wow, way to read my entire post there. I actually like my cousin quite a lot. She’s a very nice person, and aggravatingly a VERY smart person, she could have been anything and done anything with a career. The main reason I’ve posted about her case is not (as you ridiculously claim) I hate her or wanted her kids to starve. But that she’s an example of someone who gamed the system from the very get go. And if you’d read my entire posts, you’d have seen that I have been on welfare as well. Only I didn’t game the system and I fought every step of the way to get off of it as soon as possible. Here is is AGAIN, for those with poor reading comprehension. I’m discussing two separate, but related issues here. 1.) As to my cousin, I’m annoyed at what she did for a few reasons: ``` a.) she did exactly what the program is intended NOT to do. That is, use it as a career/ lifestyle choice and only got off of it when she was forced to. She was perfectly capable of working all of those years. As to the "having kids I don't think she should have had. It has NOTHING to do with having the kids. I was a single parent as well, yet somehow for the majority of my working life, I've managed to work. It has to do with having the kids for the sole purpose of getting on welfare as a lifestyle, make a living choice. There IS a difference. b.) People like her, who game the system, are why people like the snotty bitches, who were gunning for me while I was on the system, do it. Someone has to try and find the defrauders somewhere. If it weren't for those defrauding the system, people who are using it legitimately wouldn't be treated like crap. c.) even if it was a legitimate lifestyle choice, let's say to be a SAHM and properly raise kids to be functioning members of society. EPIC FAIL on her part. Neither of her children are any such thing. They learned that the way you do life is, you get on welfare as soon as possible, by whatever means necessary, and then you play, and grandma and grandpa will cover what's left over. I feel sad that all three of them (cousin and the two kids, and soon to be the two grandchildren as well) don't even seem to see the disaster that's going to happen when grandma and grandpa die. ``` As to “I admit I don’t know what her exact circumstance were”. What I ACTUALLY said was that I didn’t know the exact years. I had to figure backward and work them out, (which I did, in a previous post). And I know exactly what HER circumstances are based on her statements, my mom’s and my aunt’s. What I wasn’t sure of were the regulations in her state regarding welfare. Because they did send her through training, twice, I’m assuming that her records were up to date and she was qualified to still be on welfare until approximately 2004. I do know, for sure, that she told us that she had to get off when the youngest turned 18 and get trained at that point. As far as I know (bearing in mind I don’t know from STATE regs), she must have still been qualified to be on it, or else they wouldn’t have sent her through, and paid for training at that time (approximately 2004), which is a completely logical conclusion. FAR from “I admit I don’t know her circumstances or whatever silliness you’re trying to attribute to what I said”. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/135 "2012-06-10T00:36:18Z")
That’s the post where I said, **I can also assure you that there are kids who are desperately poor and for whatever reason, they can’t get help through the system.** Right? I never said that all welfare recipients are cheats. I don’t even know if half are. But we’ve heard from a welfare worker that it happens and happens enough. Is she bad, too? eta: I really need to quote people when i reply. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/136 "2012-06-10T00:36:21Z")
> [@PaulParkhead](#): > > I don’t usually hold up the UK as a shining example of how to do anything, and I’m not really doing so here. But I processed welfare benefits for a couple of years for claimants in the London area. > > We give benefit recipients cash. Why not do this rather than food stamps? That way, the recipients don’t have to suffer the indignity of having their lifestyles and shopping carts scrutinised by total strangers, and the total strangers won’t have to expend all that energy and outrage nosing into other peoples’ business. It seems like a win-win to me. Because then total strangers won’t be able to feel superior to the person receiving benefits. Duh! ---
**Author:** ![the\_apples\_fell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@the\_apples\_fell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_apples_fell)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/137 "2012-06-10T00:39:13Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > Because then total strangers won’t be able to feel superior to the person receiving benefits. Duh! Get this through your head.. WE DO NOT FEEL SUPERIOR. Just because I do not want my money that is going toward others’ spending to be wasted on objects that are not necessities does not mean I feel superior! ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/138 "2012-06-10T00:40:51Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > Because then total strangers won’t be able to feel superior to the person receiving benefits. Duh! I suppose you may be right. Personally, I don’t think I ever thought, when issuing a benefit payment, about what it was going to be spent on. I guess some people do, though. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/139 "2012-06-10T00:42:05Z")
Here’s the thing: For every welfare parent that does drugs, or smokes cigarettes, or gambles, or blows money on junk food, or \_\_\_\_\_\_\_, that’s food and necessities that aren’t being given to children. I don’t pay attention to what people buy in the supermarket, but I used go to a to a supermarket (known as the unSafeway) in a neighborhood where people were trying to commit EBT fraud all the time. I’ve been approached. I’ve also seen people yell at cashiers when their stuff isn’t covered. I also saw a mom struggling because her 2nd gallon of milk and baby food wasn’t covered. So I calculated the amount I had in my bank account and covered what she couldn’t. (This was in my Pretty Poor days.) Kids shouldn’t be hungry. Ever. And yeah, let me pull out my I’m Now a Teacher in a Poor Neighborhood Card again: I feed my students constantly. Sometimes their parents really are trying and sometimes they aren’t. It breaks my heart. ---
**Author:** ![the\_apples\_fell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@the\_apples\_fell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_apples_fell)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2012, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625/140 "2012-06-10T00:43:25Z")
> [@Farmer\_Jane](#): > > Here’s the thing: For every welfare parent that does drugs, or smokes cigarettes, or gambles, or blows money on junk food, or \_\_\_\_\_\_\_, that’s food and necessities that aren’t being given to children. Also mind you that with the whole lobster and steak argument that caused controversy, why should someone on welfare buy these items when many who work and are not on welfare cannot even afford them? Because when it’s not your money, you think far less about budgeting what you spend. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/food-stamps-do-you-think-ones-purchases-taxes-should-be-looked-into/624625.md?page=8)