# For cruelty to gramps and cat, I sentence you to hell! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 7, 2006, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472 "2006-02-07T23:54:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/61 "2006-02-09T04:05:59Z")
For some reason, the first line of my post got erased. I meant to write, “Anything would be better than the way they handled it for the OLD MAN, not the cat.” Read the context of the statement you yanked out of an earlier post and plopped down to prove your point. The way the thing went down for the old man was pretty fucking horrendous. My god. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/62 "2006-02-09T04:11:59Z")
> [@Euthanasiast](#): > > So you could argue then that the cat is indifferent, or (if it’s like any other cat I ever saw in action) couldn’t give a frog’s fat ass where the old man was. Aw, give me a fucking break. Cats do give a frog’s fat ass where their owners are. You think after 17 years, the cat was completely indifferent to the old man? Then you really are a fucking moron. I have enough anecdotal evidence in my experience alone to drive everyone out of this thread, so I’ll spare you, but any cat owner knows this is a bullshit position to take and that you have no idea what you’re talking about. > [@](#): > > Maybe it couldn’t give a rat’s flaming sphincter about who all these new people are, “Just feed me already!” Why are you projecting emotion of that magitude into a cat. Being traumatized does not require great emotional depth nor ability for advanced reasoning. Missing a companion of 17 years doesn’t demand higher caliber thought. It’s a pretty basic reaction to an enormous change and loss of familiar family members. I’m not projecting shit. Ask your vet if you don’t believe me. > [@](#): > > You’re God Damned right about that. There is no comparison. You don’t honestly think that the cat is pacing the floor reciting the Lord’s Prayer for its master, do you? > > Do you?! No, I think he’s saying the Kaddish. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/63 "2006-02-09T14:10:06Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > Being traumatized does not require great emotional depth nor ability for advanced reasoning. Missing a companion of 17 years doesn’t demand higher caliber thought. You feel for the cat. We get it. That’s understandable. You have a big heart. For cats. But why must you hang the kids in the process? Have you no sympathy for them? Why must there be a villain? Once again, I ask: Can you imagine no scenario in which the kids had no other choice than to do what they did? And this time, please answer. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/64 "2006-02-09T14:30:26Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > You feel for the cat. We get it. That’s understandable. You have a big heart. > > For cats. Oh, bite me. I feel just as bad for the old man, so don’t try to paint me as someone who only cares about cats and not for people. I think the old man and the cat have had their lives permanently and drastically altered for the worse. The kids are likely upset about their father but they have not experienced the level of trauma of Gramps and Moses. > [@](#): > > But why must you hang the kids in the process? Have you no sympathy for them? Why must there be a villain? Once again, I ask: Can you imagine no scenario in which the kids had no other choice than to do what they did? > > And this time, please answer. I can imagine many scenarios where getting rid of the cat before Dad came home from the hospital was more expedient for them. I’m sure some dire scenario could be concocted where they absolutely had no other choice, but I’m of the mind that people almost ALWAYS have a choice. There is usually more than one possible way to handle any given situation, and from what I know of the this one, they didn’t handle it well. Maximal consideration was clearly not given to the old man’s feelings. The cat, as I said, is secondary because his health and physical well-being are at least being taken care of. If the above answer doesn’t satisfy you, we may just have to agree to disagree. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/65 "2006-02-09T15:15:49Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > Oh, bite me. I feel just as bad for the old man, so don’t try to paint me as someone who only cares about cats and not for people. I never said that. From what I can tell, though, you feel for cats and old men, but you feel nothing for the families of those that suffer severe medical conditions. > [@](#): > > I think the old man and the cat have had their lives permanently and drastically altered for the worse. The kids are likely upset about their father but they have not experienced the level of trauma of Gramps and Moses. I remember when my great grandmother had a stroke. Yes, we were “likely upset.” I remember when my grandmother got lung cancer. We were a “tad concerned.” I remember when my girlfriend’s mother had 5 heart attacks in 2 months. We were a “bit miffed.” Come on. Don’t minimize what the family is going through. They’re going through hell right now, and yet you seem wholly unconcerned. Or too stupid to realize it. > [@](#): > > If the above answer doesn’t satisfy you It does not. You have not given a plausible scenario, other than implying that the family took the lazy way out. So let me give you one: Perhaps the family thought that taking care of the cat would become too much of a burden on gramps, and so took that burden away. And perhaps they were concerned enough about the cat that they’d rather see it in a shelter than under the “care” of a disabled old man. And perhaps, with all of the arrangements they had to make, they dealt with the cat situation in the only available timeslot they had. Plausible? Naw, I like your scenario much better: They sat around and hatched evil schemes to make both gramps and Moses suffer more. Grieving families tend to do stuff like that. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/66 "2006-02-09T15:36:11Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > I never said that. From what I can tell, though, you feel for cats and old men, but you feel nothing for the families of those that suffer severe medical conditions. I feel for them but not enough to excuse their lack of regard for the old man and the cat. > [@](#): > > I remember when my great grandmother had a stroke. Yes, we were “likely upset.” I remember when my grandmother got lung cancer. We were a “tad concerned.” I remember when my girlfriend’s mother had 5 heart attacks in 2 months. We were a “bit miffed.” Would you do to your relatives what these people did to their dad? Your feelings of concern towards Dad, would they involve consideration of his feelings about his cat? If my father were to have a stroke, taking care of his cat would be an integral part of taking care of his needs, both physical and emotional. I can’t imagine a situation for me, myself, where I’d handle it the way these people did. > [@](#): > > Come on. Don’t minimize what the family is going through. They’re going through hell right now, and yet you seem wholly unconcerned. Or too stupid to realize it. You and I have no idea what they’re going through. I know an old man dragged his ass to the SPCA to say goodbye to his cat and that he was apparently upset about the whole situation, which is what led to the shelter head’s sentiments of dislike towards the family. Thus, I’m directing my concern toward the old man and the cat. > [@](#): > > So let me give you one: Perhaps the family thought that taking care of the cat would become too much of a burden on gramps, and so took that burden away. And perhaps they were concerned enough about the cat that they’d rather see it in a shelter than under the “care” of a disabled old man. And perhaps, with all of the arrangements they had to make, they dealt with the cat situation in the only available timeslot they had. WHY DIDN’T THEY LET HIM SAY GOODBYE? Why didn’t they pay the cat’s fee? > [@](#): > > Plausible? Naw, I like your scenario much better: They sat around and hatched evil schemes to make both gramps and Moses suffer more. Grieving families tend to do stuff like that. Yeah, 'caus that’s what I said, that they were being malicious and evil. Uh-huh. I was getting shit from **VegemiteMoose** for assuming the old man was a good guy and I had to admit that maybe he was a bad father and thus deserved the treatment his family was giving him, and now I’m getting shit for feeling the old man got the shaft. Can’t win for losing around here. ---
**Author:** ![KSO](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f07891/32.png) [@KSO](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KSO)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/67 "2006-02-09T15:41:55Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > Perhaps the family thought that taking care of the cat would become too much of a burden on gramps, and so took that burden away. And perhaps they were concerned enough about the cat that they’d rather see it in a shelter than under the “care” of a disabled old man. And perhaps, with all of the arrangements they had to make, they dealt with the cat situation in the only available timeslot they had. Or, instead of leaving the cat at a shelter and not telling the owner, they could have called a vet and found a place to board the cat until a decision could be made based on the owner’s ability to care for the cat. Or, they could have asked the shelter to board the cat until a decision could be made based on the owner’s ability to care for the cat. Or, they could have called a pet-sitting service to temporarily care for the cat until a decision could be made based on the owner’s ability to care for the cat. It’s a cat, not a baby. So long as someone put food and water down and cleaned the litter box every couple of days, the cat would have been fine and the owner could have been involved in the decision-making. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/68 "2006-02-09T15:51:40Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > So let me give you one: Perhaps the family thought that taking care of the cat would become too much of a burden on gramps, and so took that burden away. And perhaps they were concerned enough about the cat that they’d rather see it in a shelter than under the “care” of a disabled old man. And perhaps, with all of the arrangements they had to make, they dealt with the cat situation in the only available timeslot they had. Imagine you are the old man. The above is your children’s attitude towards you. They are so mindful of your feelings of dignity and self-determination that they take all your free will out of the equation and make personal, emotional decisions about your companion of 17 years. They don’t consult you, even though you are eventually well enough to able to get to the shelter yourself and have the mental cogency to pay the cat’s fees. You might have come to the conclusion yourself that you couldn’t keep Moses, but with a little time, you could have re-homed him yourself, with the appropriate goodbyes said, maybe even through the auspices of the SPCA or your cat’s vet. But no, your kids swept in and made all these decisions for you. I’m sure that made the guy feel fan-fucking-tastic. You can say all you want that these kids were trying to do their dad a favor, but the fact that he came in himself to say goodbye tells me that he didn’t like how the situation went and wasn’t prepared to let go when his kids did, or was he prepared for the way they did it. Yes, I care more about his feelings than his kids’ in this situation. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/69 "2006-02-09T15:59:03Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > I feel for them but not enough to excuse their lack of regard for the old man and the cat. You condemned them to hell. Interesting way of showing your concern. > [@](#): > > I can’t imagine a situation for me, myself, where I’d handle it the way these people did. You can’t? I just gave you a scenario wherein they acted out of concern for both the cat and the old man. > [@](#): > > You and I have no idea what they’re going through. Yes, I do. I said so in my last post. When my girlfriend’s mother suffered some ill health a few years ago, my girlfriend and her sister went through her apartment and took or trashed all of her posessions. Robbed the old woman blind, you might say. Was that cruel and self-centered? To an outside observer, yes. To a moron who couldn’t be bothered to find out the facts, certainly. > [@](#): > > WHY DIDN’T THEY LET HIM SAY GOODBYE? I DON’T KNOW. And neither do you. But since you’re the one asking the question, why don’t you answer it? > [@](#): > > Yeah, 'caus that’s what I said, that they were being malicious and evil. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Pretty much. > [@](#): > > I was getting shit from **VegemiteMoose** for assuming the old man was a good guy and I had to admit that maybe he was a bad father and thus deserved the treatment his family was giving him, and now I’m getting shit for feeling the old man got the shaft. You honestly think that’s why you’re getting shit from me? REALLY? ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/70 "2006-02-09T16:02:33Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > They don’t consult you, even though you are eventually well enough to able to get to the shelter yourself and have the mental cogency to pay the cat’s fees. And you know for a fact that the old man was conscious and cogent at the time they took the cat away? Who the fuck gave you a copy of his medical chart? ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/71 "2006-02-09T16:09:17Z")
> [@KSO](#): > > Or, (snip) > > Or, (snip) > > Or, (snip) Hindsight is 20/20. It’s easy to think of all the more reasonable alternatives when you weren’t there in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Honey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/honey/32/5074_2.png) [@Honey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honey)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/72 "2006-02-09T17:24:28Z")
At the risk of sounding like a Pollyana, we can make something good come of this if it forces us to think about what might become of our pets should something happen to us. Make arrangements as best you can for someone to care for your pets in the event that you’re no longer able to. Do it today. ---
**Author:** ![barracuda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@barracuda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barracuda)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/73 "2006-02-09T17:35:41Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Hey, **Faruiza** …if you or anybody you know in town is interested, I have a family of cats living under my house that we have somehow “adopted.” They were hanging around the hedge when we first spotted them (Mom and three kittens.) I committed the cardinal “sin” of putting out food and water for the poor dears. Now they have moved under the house and are sleek and strong and growing like weeds. I would like to find them all good homes before I have to catch them and take them to Y.A.P.S. The kittens look to be maybe 6 months old. At least one is a male. We’d take them indoors and formally adopt them, but we already have two and they fill the house. Any takers? I’m sorry, I didn’t finish reading this thread. I got about halfway through Ruby’s assinine “the cat’s more important than the humans” BS, and gagged. However, regarding the feline family gracing your garden - do you have the resources to have the family spayed/neutered? Many people like having cats around to counter any vermin (mice, rats, moles, etc.). I work with a group in the Long Beach area who could help you with this. I also have ties to the South Bay area rescue efforts. In the valleys, tho, you’re on your own. to reply to the OP: Ruby, you’re full of shit!!! You have no evidence whatsoever that the guy’s kids acted with evil intent. Do you know for a fact that the doctors said “Yeh, he’ll be up and around in no time” as opposed to “I don’t think he’ll ever really regain conciousness.” Do you know how long the kids cared for the cat? Do you know (not guess) that the cat was taken to the shelter out of malice. Could it not be possible that the cat (deprived of its human companion of 17 years) refused to eat, and the kids felt that shelter personnel would be able to address that issue better than they? I speak as a cat lover, fosterer, and advocate. (Credtials provided upon request) ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/74 "2006-02-09T17:39:09Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > You condemned them to hell. Interesting way of showing your concern. HYPERBOLE. Look into it. > [@](#): > > You can’t? I just gave you a scenario wherein they acted out of concern for both the cat and the old man. I don’t see it that way. I see them showing concern for their own expediency over the old man’s feelings. > [@](#): > > When my girlfriend’s mother suffered some ill health a few years ago, my girlfriend and her sister went through her apartment and took or trashed all of her posessions. Robbed the old woman blind, you might say. > > Was that cruel and self-centered? > > To an outside observer, yes. To a moron who couldn’t be bothered to find out the facts, certainly. What fact are there to make this Ok? Fill me in. Fight my ignorance, as it were. > [@](#): > > You honestly think that’s why you’re getting shit from me? > > REALLY? I’m getting shit from you because you are seeing things from the kids’ POV and I’m seeing them from the old man’s. That’s the bottom line. You think they were justified and I can’t imagine how they could be. I wouldn’t do that to my father. That’s all. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/75 "2006-02-09T17:44:17Z")
> [@barracuda](#): > > I’m sorry, I didn’t finish reading this thread. I got about halfway through Ruby’s assinine “the cat’s more important than the humans” BS, and gagged. Please cite where I said that. > [@](#): > > Ruby, you’re full of shit!!! So’s your mother. :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > You have no evidence whatsoever that the guy’s kids acted with evil intent. Please cite where I said that. Colossal insensitivity and expediency, yes. Evil, no. > [@](#): > > Could it not be possible that the cat (deprived of its human companion of 17 years) refused to eat, and the kids felt that shelter personnel would be able to address that issue better than they? If you were the cat lover you say you are, surely you would know that a cat who is not eating is NOT FUCKING LIKELY to start eating again after being put in the shelter. We have a lot of cats who come in and refuse to eat who were eating fine before they were taken out of their homes. It takes quite a bit of doing to get them to eat again. > [@](#): > > I speak as a cat lover, fosterer, and advocate. (Credtials provided upon request) Out your ass, you speak. ---
**Author:** ![barracuda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@barracuda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barracuda)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/76 "2006-02-09T18:11:48Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > Please cite where I said that. > > So’s your mother. :rolleyes: > > Please cite where I said that. Colossal insensitivity and expediency, yes. Evil, no. > > If you were the cat lover you say you are, surely you would know that a cat who is not eating is NOT FUCKING LIKELY to start eating again after being put in the shelter. We have a lot of cats who come in and refuse to eat who were eating fine before they were taken out of their homes. It takes quite a bit of doing to get them to eat again. > > Out your ass, you speak. I’m not sure where to start to reply. **"So’s your mother. :rolleyes: "** ---
**Author:** ![barracuda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@barracuda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barracuda)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/77 "2006-02-09T18:13:30Z")
> [@barracuda](#): > > I’m not sure where to start to reply. > > **"So’s your mother. :rolleyes: "** AKKK! not sure what I hit to make that post. I’ll start over again in a few minutes. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/78 "2006-02-09T18:15:22Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > HYPERBOLE. Look into it. Backpedalling. Stop it. > [@](#): > > I don’t see it that way. I see them showing concern for their own expediency over the old man’s feelings. It may very well be that. It’s one possible scenario out of many. Is your brain so small that you can only entertain one? Why are you so attached to this particular explanation? > [@](#): > > What fact are there to make this Ok? Fill me in. Fight my ignorance, as it were. I would, but it’s clear you’re not interested in facts. > [@](#): > > I’m getting shit from you because you are seeing things from the kids’ POV and I’m seeing them from the old man’s. Not quite. I’m trying to see things from everyone’s POV. You’re digging your heels into one narrowly biased opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/79 "2006-02-09T18:22:36Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > > [@Rubystreak](#): > > > > HYPERBOLE. > > Backpedalling. [How so](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7079916&postcount=12)? ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2006, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472/80 "2006-02-09T18:26:40Z")
> [@Lute Skywatcher](#): > > [How so](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7079916&postcount=12)? “Backpedalling” may have been the wrong word. “Stupidity” is probably closer. 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-cruelty-to-gramps-and-cat-i-sentence-you-to-hell/343472.md?page=5)