# For the good of the country, Bush and Cheney should resign. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 9, 2005, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868 "2005-09-09T19:53:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![zeeny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e9a140/32.png) [@zeeny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zeeny)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2005, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/141 "2005-09-12T23:56:42Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > At least we got through to somebody. Don’t be so negative in your thinking. I doubt I am alone in lurking and reading along. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/142 "2005-09-13T00:13:24Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > Or, your argument simply isn’t persuasive. Just because you feel passionately about something doesn’t mean someone else is mindless because they disagree with you. Even during Nixon’s darkest hour, his approval rating was still a whopping 31%. Like I said, there’s a certain percentage of people in this country that literally will stand behind the President no matter what he does. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/143 "2005-09-13T00:36:32Z")
Y’know Hentor, we were actually having a pretty decent debate here, werent’ we? Oh well. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/144 "2005-09-13T02:25:25Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > Even during Nixon’s darkest hour, his approval rating was still a whopping 31%. Like I said, there’s a certain percentage of people in this country that literally will stand behind the President no matter what he does. Yeah, but all it takes a small majority in both Houses of Congress and impeachment will be the talk of the day. You can’t blame the diehard Pubbie partisans for the fact that the Dems can’t get control of Congress now, can you? ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/145 "2005-09-13T03:01:00Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > Yeah, but all it takes a small majority in both Houses of Congress and impeachment will be the talk of the day. You can’t blame the diehard Pubbie partisans for the fact that the Dems can’t get control of Congress now, can you? Let’s see what happens in '06. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/146 "2005-09-13T03:05:25Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > Which mayor or governor has given the country record deficits, got the nation in a needless war with false pretenses, stretched our Armed Forces nearly to the breaking point, and twiddled his thumbs while the WTC fell and New Orleans got flooded? At some point in time you’re going to have to get over the election just like you’ll have to get over the fact that the Mayor and Governor created the situation and then made it worse for their constituents. Instead of a simple evacuation using city and state assets the Federal Government had to bring in hundreds of helicopters and equipment from all over the US. I’m sure the people in the direct path of the Hurricane appreciated the attention NO got. I can only wonder at this point how much of it was diverted because The Mayor’s escape plan trapped the people he was supposed to evacuate. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/147 "2005-09-13T04:47:28Z")
So that’s the official talking point from those who are “not playing the blame game”, huh? It’s all the Democrats’ fault. ---
**Author:** ![Hail\_Ants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dc4da7/32.png) [@Hail\_Ants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hail_Ants)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/148 "2005-09-13T04:52:40Z")
[http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05254/568876.stm](http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05254/568876.stm) This whole ‘Bush is to blame’ is partisan bullshit. It was a f\*cking hurricane. It wasn’t the Republicans or Democrats fault. New Orleans was in for a world of shit no matter what anyone did. Nobody wanted to spend the billions it would have cost to strengthen the levies, they failed, wa-wa everywhere. Get over it all ready… ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/149 "2005-09-13T04:58:59Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > Yeah, but all it takes a small majority in both Houses of Congress and impeachment will be the talk of the day. I doubt it, actually. The Pubbies succeeded last time around in devaluing impeachment as the tool of statecraft it was intended to be by using it as a tool of personal spite. No matter the basis for doing it now (and if lying us into a war isn’t enough by itself, what is?), they’d be able to spin it as simple revenge. Such spin would succeed, too, there being so many who can’t conceive of putting country before party. > [@](#): > > You can’t blame the diehard Pubbie partisans for the fact that the Dems can’t get control of Congress now, can you? You can certainly blame them for putting party above country. > [@xtisme](#): > > Well, no. It comes down first in proving in a non-partisan way that Bush is unfit to continue as president. Well, no, it comes down to a preponderance of public opinion being that allowing him to remain in office represents an unacceptable danger to the nation. Not the same thing. How, btw, would you prove what you want to be proven? Do you have some “non-partisan” standards to propose? > [@](#): > > Because he’s not going to resign in this reality unless he is pressured to resign with something more real than has been presented thus far. And this pressure that would be effective on him would come from whom, exactly? He only talks to yesmen. > [@](#): > > I’ve given why I think things will be worse with Bush going on in some huge scandal and taking Chaney with him. You…haven’t. No, you have not. You’ve offered the opinion that things would be worse without him, but you have not backed that up with anything at all. I’ve asked you how it would be possible, and you can’t respond. If President Hastert couldn’t be worse, then in all probability he’d be better, wouldn’t he? And once again, the issue is the level of danger to the nation from allowing Bush to remain as President. > [@](#): > > not ever president goes out of their second term in a cloud of scandal. Care to explain the relevance of that remark? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/150 "2005-09-13T05:00:24Z")
> [@Hail Ants](#): > > Nobody wanted to spend the billions it would have cost to strengthen the levies Nobody? Really? You sure? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/151 "2005-09-13T05:21:32Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > I doubt it, actually. The Pubbies succeeded last time around in devaluing impeachment as the tool of statecraft it was intended to be by using it as a tool of personal spite. No matter the basis for doing it now (and if lying us into a war isn’t enough by itself, what is?), they’d be able to spin it as simple revenge. Such spin would succeed, too, there being so many who can’t conceive of putting country before party.You can certainly blame them for putting party above country. For crying out loud, man, do you EVER not tire of whining about the Republicans? Wah, wah, wah, the Democrats can’t use impeachment because the Repubicans ruined it. If the Democrats can’t win control of Congress, and, if they do and can’t overcome Republican “spin” then it’s time you found a new party for yourself. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/152 "2005-09-13T06:04:02Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Nobody? Really? You sure? Do you have someone in mind who actually was in a position to allocate funds who is on record prior to this storm saying that we should spend $14 billion (or however many billion it would take to get the levees rated to CAT 5). Certainly in retrospect it looks like a good idea…a bargin in fact (at twice the price :)), as the damage is likely to cost us an order more. > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Well, no, it comes down to a preponderance of public opinion being that allowing him to remain in office represents an unacceptable danger to the nation. Not the same thing. How, btw, would you prove what you want to be proven? Do you have some “non-partisan” standards to propose? Do you think there is such a preponderance of public opinion, Elvis? Besides, I doubt the public will be involved in the process…isn’t that a function of the Congress/Senate? Or is it a function of the Judiciary? I can’t remember this one from Civics class. I’m sure there are guidelines for removing a president if he is unstable or due to other health reasons. I seriously doubt even the dread Republican controlled Congress is going to let him go completely off the deep end and just kick back and watch. > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > And this pressure that would be effective on him would come from whom, exactly? He only talks to yesmen. Well, thats the meme of the month, certainly. I remember when HE was supposed to be a puppet on a string and a yes man himself. It changes. Reguardless, even if he is surrounded by yes men, the Congress isn’t his bitch…thats who would put pressure on him if he’s gone around the bend. I know you think that the Republicans would let him stay even if he’s literally barking mad…but I have at least that much faith in our system that it won’t happen. Short of that this is all just left wing porn…the fantasy of Bush and Chaney resigning in disgrace, blah blah blah. Not…gona…happen. > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > No, you have not. You’ve offered the opinion that things would be worse without him, but you have not backed that up with anything at all. I’ve asked you how it would be possible, and you can’t respond. If President Hastert couldn’t be worse, then in all probability he’d be better, wouldn’t he? And once again, the issue is the level of danger to the nation from allowing Bush to remain as President. My point was I offered an opinion and some debate points…you merely attacked them. I explained why I thought Hastert WOULD be worse…or at least the situation would be worst for the country reguardless of how good or bad Hastert might or might not be. See the difference? Let me just get to the point then. WHY do you think it would be better? What do you think would be the realistic effect on the US domestic and foreign policy if Bush/Chaney resigns in disgrace? What would the effect be on the economy? How would the next 3 years be better…or even different…without Bush/Chaney in the drivers seat. Realistically? Without all the rjung chimp at the wheel bullshit, what would change for the better? > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Care to explain the relevance of that remark? Well, it was a ‘duh!’ phrase to go with the blindingly obvious quote I was responding too. Sort of a ‘sky is blue, water is wet…A is A’ type deal. 😛 -XT ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/153 "2005-09-13T06:06:36Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > For crying out loud, man, do you EVER not tire of whining about the Republicans? When they stop being assholes… ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/154 "2005-09-13T12:57:32Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > For crying out loud, man, do you EVER not tire of whining about the Republicans? I’ll stop doing it as soon as they stop giving reason to do it, how’s that for ya? Meanwhile, the people in complete charge get all the criticism. It comes with the territory, duh. What’s there to criticize about the party that is completely excluded from any say in how the government is run? You’ve been awfully silly here lately, ya know. > [@xtisme](#): > > Do you have someone in mind who actually was in a position to allocate funds who is on record prior to this storm saying that we should spend $14 billion (or however many billion it would take to get the levees rated to CAT 5). Certainly in retrospect it looks like a good idea…a bargin in fact (at twice the price ), as the damage is likely to cost us an order more. How could you not know? The work was well under way until 2003, when funding got diverted to pay for Bush’s war. [Start here.](http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001051313) Wow. > [@](#): > > Do you think there is such a preponderance of public opinion, Elvis? Pretty close. His approval ratings are reaching Nixon’s bottom, and, dare I point out, barely half of Clinton’s during his own impeachment. > [@](#): > > Besides, I doubt the public will be involved in the process…isn’t that a function of the Congress/Senate? Or is it a function of the Judiciary? I can’t remember this one from Civics class. It would help you immensely to do your homework before publicly admitting ignorance. Sure, the public plays no official role, but it’s a political process guided by the political environment for all that. Meanwhile, you have confirmed that you have no standards to propose, but you still decry the vagueness of standards others suggest, hmm? > [@](#): > > I explained why I thought Hastert WOULD be worse…or at least the situation would be worst for the country reguardless of how good or bad Hastert might or might not be. See the difference? You offered an opinion not consistent with reality. I attempted to correct you. You refuse correction. Shrug. ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/155 "2005-09-13T13:16:17Z")
A lot of apologist are trying to shift the blame to the Mayor for not commandeering the school buses we’ve all seen under water. And to the Governor for not making evacuation mandatory. Now I’ve not read many city charters or the Louisiana Constitution. But of the ones I have read, I don’t recall them giving the Governor and especially not the Mayor such power. Could they have actually done what they’re blamed for not going? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/156 "2005-09-13T15:00:25Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > How could you not know? The work was well under way until 2003, when funding got diverted to pay for Bush’s war. Start here. Wow. Um…did you actually read what I wrote? Or to put it another way, do you know the difference between $430 (or $230 remaining) million and $14 billion? Here, from your article: > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Over the next 10 years, the Army Corps of Engineers, tasked with carrying out SELA, spent $430 million on shoring up levees and building pumping stations, with $50 million in local aid. But at least $250 million in crucial projects remained, even as hurricane activity in the Atlantic Basin increased dramatically and the levees surrounding New Orleans continued to subside The figures you are quoting here were the ones to get the repair the levee system up to a CAT 3 rating IIRC…not to get it up to a CAT 5 rating (which is what I was talking about). In other words, even if this had been fully funded the levees wouldn’t have been rated for the storm that actually hit. > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Pretty close. His approval ratings are reaching Nixon’s bottom, and, dare I point out, barely half of Clinton’s during his own impeachment. You’d need to show me some proof of the Nixon claim. IIRC Nixon dropped into the 20’s for approval…and Bush is hovering somewhere in the 40’s (perhaps the high 30’s) last time I checked. As for as this storm goes, seems to me that public opinion is slowly shifting the blame towards the local and region government…though Bush is still getting hammered for his part in all this too. You do realize that even if Bush drops to a 10% approval rate or even lower (something not likely to happen as he’s probably already as low as he’ll go considering his base) thats not grounds for impeachment…right? Public opinion has zero to do with impeaching a president. > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > It would help you immensely to do your homework before publicly admitting ignorance. Sure, the public plays no official role, but it’s a political process guided by the political environment for all that. Meanwhile, you have confirmed that you have no standards to propose, but you still decry the vagueness of standards others suggest, hmm? How is it showing my ignorance to point out that you are full of shit? Public opinion has nothing to do with impeachement, which is what I said (and is what YOU are saying here too, sifting through your usual BS doubletalk), and you are showing your own partisan tendencies to try and go down this path. > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > You offered an opinion not consistent with reality. I attempted to correct you. You refuse correction. Shrug. So, I ask you to elaborate, and you instead hand wave that its ‘not consistent with reality’. In other words, you got nada. _shrug_ I’m militantly unsurprised Elvis. -XT ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/157 "2005-09-13T15:18:29Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > The figures you are quoting here were the ones to get the repair the levee system up to a CAT 3 rating IIRC…not to get it up to a CAT 5 rating (which is what I was talking about). In other words, even if this had been fully funded the levees wouldn’t have been rated for the storm that actually hit. Do you have a cite that illustrates that the $14 billion figure was just to get the levees up to withstand a category five hurricane? I was under the impression that the $14 billion was the estimated cost for a far more comprehensive project that involved more than just the levees. > [@](#): > > You’d need to show me some proof of the Nixon claim. IIRC Nixon dropped into the 20’s for approval…and Bush is hovering somewhere in the 40’s (perhaps the high 30’s) last time I checked. I recall reading recently that Nixon dropped only to 31%. Bush is at 38% right now. > [@](#): > > Public opinion has zero to do with impeaching a president. I disagree. Those involved in impeaching a president are tremendous whores to public opinion. If their constituents were calling for it, they would do it (or would try to weasel out of it so as to try to straddle both sides, like Specter did regarding the vote to remove Clinton). A near majority favored impeachment a few months back if it could be shown that Bush lied about WMD. I would like to see new polls that include questions about removal from office, but I have no real solid belief that public opinion would get hot enough for the Republicans to feel enough heat. > [@](#): > > So, I ask you to elaborate, and you instead hand wave that its ‘not consistent with reality’. In other words, you got nada. _shrug_ I’m militantly unsurprised Elvis. > > -XT You’re a fine one to talk about producing nada, **xtisme** , having recently acknowledged your penchant for taking up opposing points of view merely for the fun of it. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/158 "2005-09-13T15:34:24Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > Do you have a cite that illustrates that the $14 billion figure was just to get the levees up to withstand a category five hurricane? I was under the impression that the $14 billion was the estimated cost for a far more comprehensive project that involved more than just the levees. I saw it on a show I was watching last night…so, I conceed it could very well be wrong or misremembering. Do you have a cite amplifying that $430 million number to claim that it would get the levee’s up to a CAT 5 rating, because what I read on Factchecker seems to say that this isn’t so. > [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > I recall reading recently that Nixon dropped only to 31%. Bush is at 38% right now Well, again, I could be mis-remembering, but I seem to recall Nixon was in the 20’s…if I have time later I’ll see if I can dig that one up. As for Bush, no idea where you are getting your numbers from…the polls seem to be all over the place. [This](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9317203/) article that I was just reading puts it at 42 percent: > [@](#): > > The bungled response to the hurricane has helped drag down Bush’s job-approval rating, which now stands at 42 percent – the lowest of his presidency – in the Post-ABC poll and down three points since the hurricane hit two weeks ago. Fifty-seven percent disapprove of Bush’s performance, a double-digit increase since January. > [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > I disagree. Those involved in impeaching a president are tremendous whores to public opinion. If their constituents were calling for it, they would do it (or would try to weasel out of it so as to try to straddle both sides, like Specter did regarding the vote to remove Clinton). A near majority favored impeachment a few months back if it could be shown that Bush lied about WMD. I would like to see new polls that include questions about removal from office, but I have no real solid belief that public opinion would get hot enough for the Republicans to feel enough heat. If that was the case then unpopular presidents would always face impeachment due solely to their unpopularity. Assuming you are correct and a majority of American’s favored impeachment over Bush’s ‘lies’ about WMD…whats been done? Has he been impeached when I wasn’t looking? Lets say you are right and Bush’s poll numbers really are at 38% or even lower…do you really expect him to be impeached because of this? > [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > You’re a fine one to talk about producing nada, xtisme, having recently acknowledged your penchant for taking up opposing points of view merely for the fun of it. While I acknowledge that I do enjoy playing devils advocate, I don’t see how it has any bearing on this Hentor. I listed out why I thought things would be worse if Bush/Chaney were to resign in disgrace…or just resign. Elvis chose not to address any of those points but to handwave. When I asked him to elaborate he merely spouted that my points were ‘not consistent with reality’. Not consistent with reality how exactly? I don’t mind someone puncturing my points with logic, ripping them to shreds with reason, or citing me facts that shows I’m clearly wrong…in fact I get a lot out of folks doing that. But handwaving? -XT ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/159 "2005-09-13T15:34:38Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > I’ll stop doing it as soon as they stop giving reason to do it, how’s that for ya? Meanwhile, the people in complete charge get all the criticism. It comes with the territory, duh. What’s there to criticize about the party that is completely excluded from any say in how the government is run? You’ve been awfully silly here lately, ya know. I’m not even going to comment on this. I’ll just let it stand as a testimony of exactly what I was talking about. Astounding… Oh, and nice _ad hominem_, btw. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2005, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868/160 "2005-09-13T15:44:23Z")
[One source of many](http://blogcritics.org/archives/2005/09/10/174323.php) for the poll numbers Hentor has provided (thanks). > [@](#): > > Nearly four years after Bush’s job approval soared into the 80s after the terrorist attacks on Sept. 11, 2001, Bush was at 39 percent job approval in an AP-Ipsos poll taken this week. That’s the lowest since the the poll was started in December 2003. > > The public’s view of the nation’s direction has grown increasingly negative as well, with nearly two-thirds now saying the country is heading down the wrong track. Associated Press, 10 Sep 05. [From a paper enlightened enough to run the Dope](http://www.bostonphoenix.com/boston/news_features/editorial/documents/04927095.asp), printed even before Katrinagate: > [@](#): > > his standing in opinion polls is lower even than Richard Nixon’s during the depths of Watergate. In those days of constitutional crisis Nixon mustered an approval rating of 39 percent. Today, Bush scores 36 percent. Got the picture now, chief? > [@](#): > > Public opinion has zero to do with impeaching a president. It didn’t in Clinton’s case, granted. But remember that the Congressmembers who act have to run for re-election, and in most cases can be recalled even before then if they go against public opinion too strenuously. Hardly “zero”. When you’ve done some research of your own on the levee funding story, come back. Don’t forget the pie, either. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-the-good-of-the-country-bush-and-cheney-should-resign/320868.md?page=9)