# For you, does Christmas have anything to do with Christianity? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 9, 2009, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-you-does-christmas-have-anything-to-do-with-christianity/520589 "2009-12-09T15:04:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-you-does-christmas-have-anything-to-do-with-christianity/520589/61 "2009-12-09T20:04:37Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > But the elimination of the dietary restrictions comes directly from Peter’s account, not from anything that happened during the life of Jesus, so there isn’t really a contradiction in this case. Peter just threw out hundreds of years of Jewish law thanks to a dream coming from his stomach, no doubt. That he needed to do it indicates that Jesus kept kosher. > > In any case, it was pure marketing. Actually, it wasn’t even Peter. It was a story that Luke (a gentile) made up about Peter several decades after his death. Whether Jews should follow dietary laws was a bone of contention between Paul and the "Pillars’ of the original Jesus movement in Jerusalem (i.e Peter and the rest of the original disciples, i.e the people who actually knew and got their teachings directly from Jesus when he was alive instead from revelation and “not from any man” the way Paul did). It’s hard to believe the original disciples would think that dietary laws were still important if Jesus had told them that it wasn’t. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-you-does-christmas-have-anything-to-do-with-christianity/520589/62 "2009-12-09T20:11:58Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > Nazis (which I am prone to be) will eschew celebrating Christmas until Dec 25, so as not to deprive oneself of experiencing the Advent season of anticipation. Personally I do not wish anyone a “Merry Christmas” until 12/25 and I leave my tree/lights up and lit until Epiphany. Same here–I do say Happy Holidays to folks I won’t see, but Merry Christmas is for Christmas –\> Epiphany. Otherwise you miss out on Advent. Don’t get me started on people who put out Easter candy on Good Friday!! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-you-does-christmas-have-anything-to-do-with-christianity/520589/63 "2009-12-09T20:20:34Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Actually, it wasn’t even Peter. It was a story that Luke (a gentile) made up about Peter several decades after his death. Well, it’s an overstatement to say he made it up. In Luke’s time, non-Jewish Christians were not observing the Jewish dietary restrictions, and Luke probably heard that story about Peter from somewhere. It’s also consistant with Pauline teaching about diet (c.f. meat sacrificed to idols). > [@](#): > > Whether Jews should follow dietary laws was a bone of contention between Paul and the "Pillars’ of the original Jesus movement in Jerusalem (i.e Peter and the rest of the original disciples, i.e the people who actually knew and got their teachings directly from Jesus when he was alive instead from revelation and “not from any man” the way Paul did). > > It’s hard to believe the original disciples would think that dietary laws were still important if Jesus had told them that it wasn’t. At the council of Jerusalem, where this all went down, the leaders of the Jerusalem church said to Paul “Fine, the gentile believers don’t have to be kosher or get circumsized. Just don’t eat meat with blood in it, or meat from an animal that was strangled to death, and don’t be sexually immoral.” It’s hard to believe that they would have done so if that was completely inconsistant to Jesus’ teaching. (Again, I realize, this is Luke’s account). The bottom line is that we have other examples of Jesus re-defining the Law (such as handwashing and observing the Sabbath) so we can’t say for sure he would not have approved of your Christmas ham. ---
**Author:** ![rivulus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/839c29/32.png) [@rivulus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rivulus)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-you-does-christmas-have-anything-to-do-with-christianity/520589/64 "2009-12-09T20:20:56Z")
For me, Christmas has a little to do with Christianity, but also something to do with mid-winter or Yuletime or similar concepts. Growing up, my Christmases had quite a lot to do with the birth of Jesus, as my family was heavily involved with church. It equally had a lot to do with performing, since I was always an active church choral singer and church musician. Now, I am functionally atheist. However, I still retain my love of the music and some sense of the biblical Christmas story in my celebration of the holiday. It’s like the old English carols, which mixed other ancient traditions with Christianity, emphasizing the miracle of life in the middle of the darkest time of the year. It has to do with the idea of celebrating the time when nights stop getting longer and begin to get shorter. There’s hope of a new beginning in the middle of cold and death. This is part of the Christian message too – and this is the aspect that I retain: a baby in a manger, a star in the night, and so on. This is mixed with the wonder of evergreen plants in the midst of snow. That life is not all dead. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-you-does-christmas-have-anything-to-do-with-christianity/520589/65 "2009-12-09T20:22:46Z")
> [@CrazyCatLady](#): > > It’s rather a mess, really, but I really think if you keep the name, the date, and the traditions, it’s hard to say you’re really celebrating something else entirely. It would be like someone throwing a party on my birthday, inviting me, making a cake with candles, giving me a present…and then claiming that it wasn’t a birthday party. It’s just very :dubious:, if you see what I mean. Well, It think it’s more like Valentine’s day it’s celebrated on the Saint’s day but has no religious meaning. Unless you want to tie dinner, presents and sex to celebrating the life of a saint. Similarly a tree, lights, food and presents have nothing to do with celebrating Jesus’ birth unless you go out of your way to make it. To go back to your birthday example what if I like drinking beer so I have a kegger on your birthday so I invite you to a party. Someone else decides that they want to bring a cake and a third person remembers they knitted you a sweater but forgot to give it to you. Does a party on your birthday you attend where there is cake and a present make it your birthday party? No it’s just people doing things they like on a day that happens to be special to you. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/for-you-does-christmas-have-anything-to-do-with-christianity/520589.md?page=3)